Wurth suspension bracket 16

Discussion in '400-Day & Atmos' started by etmb61, Apr 8, 2014.

  1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.
  1. etmb61

    etmb61 Registered User
    NAWCC Member

    Oct 25, 2010
    2,220
    93
    48
    Retired Avionics Technician
    Mascoutah, IL
    Country Flag:
    Region Flag:
    Does anyone have pictures they can post of the parts breakdown of bracket 16? I'm just looking for the information.

    Thanks,
    Eric
     
  2. John Hubby

    John Hubby Principal Administrator
    Staff Member NAWCC Star Fellow NAWCC Life Member

    Sep 7, 2000
    12,077
    165
    63
    The Woodlands, TX
    Country Flag:
    Region Flag:
    Eric, I'm posting several photos from my archives of this bracket. You will be able to see that it is made of seven parts plus six screws:

    1) The support bracket, same design as the one used for upper bracket No. 14.

    2) Platform in the shape of a "T", that is screwed to the top of the support bracket at the "T" end with two screws. The leg of the "T" has a cup at about the center on the top side where the ball bearing rests.

    3) The ball bearing.

    Next is the "gimbal" which is composed of four parts:

    4) The top plate with holes at each end for two assembly screws. This is a flat rectangular hardened plate that rests on top of the ball bearing when the gimbal is assembled.

    5) The ball retainer plate, also with holes at each end for two assembly screws. This plate has a large hole in the center slightly larger in diameter than the diameter of the ball bearing. It keeps the bearing in place.

    6) Two identical suspension spring clamp pieces that fit around the platform, with threaded holes in the vertical sides where the two upper plates are screwed into position, and with one having two smooth holes and the other with two matching threaded holes at the bottom cheeks where the suspension spring is clamped.

    I hope this is sufficiently descriptive so you can see the shape and function of each part. Need to have a cad program so I could make an exploded drawing.

    22507 Brkt 16 Side.jpg 22507 Brkt 16, Dbl Scr. Ring.jpg 23863 Mvmt Brkt 16.jpg 23863 Mvmt Upper Brkt.jpg 23460 Susp. 16.JPG 23461 Brkt No 16.jpg

    Are you going to try to make one? It would not be all that difficult if you had some of the parts to start. One thing you should be aware, the gimbal only allows front to back movement. The suspension spring clamp pieces are a close fit to the platform sides, so the gimbal won't rotate with pendulum rotation and cause loss of power.
     
  3. etmb61

    etmb61 Registered User
    NAWCC Member

    Oct 25, 2010
    2,220
    93
    48
    Retired Avionics Technician
    Mascoutah, IL
    Country Flag:
    Region Flag:
    Hi John,

    I was entertaining the idea of making one but I decided not to buy the clock (23306 by the way). The parts that were missing got me to thinking.

    My question is about the "T" platform. From looking at several photos it appears the two screws below it clamp a post on the underside of the platform to the main bracket support, and allow the platform to rotate (possibly to adjust the beat?).

    Is this the case? You can see the skew in the photo of 23640 above.

    Here is a crop from a photo of 21984 in the Wurth thread. I believe you can see the shadow of the top of the post (arrow).

    Eric
     

    Attached Files:

  4. Kamil Urbanowicz

    Kamil Urbanowicz Registered User

    Aug 17, 2010
    255
    1
    18
    Just receive top finial like that from an expensive lot I purchased in fact only for it - to finish my wurth clock

    The platform is in fact rotable - so it got possibility to adjust.

    DSC00544.JPG DSC00545.JPG DSC00546.jpg DSC00547.jpg DSC00548.jpg DSC00549.JPG

    KAmil
     
  5. John Hubby

    John Hubby Principal Administrator
    Staff Member NAWCC Star Fellow NAWCC Life Member

    Sep 7, 2000
    12,077
    165
    63
    The Woodlands, TX
    Country Flag:
    Region Flag:
    Kamil, thanks for posting! This is an interesting discovery that the No. 16 platform rotates so that the beat can be set. I had been curious because the "stirrup" upper suspension clamp is made so it can't rotate; since if it were free to rotate the clock would not run.

    I have documented your clock remnant as a variation of Plate 1427, without the "Made in Germany" stamp. Several Würth clocks have been found with this variation. Based on the serial number it was made in early 1910, the final year of production by Würth. Even this bit of information is useful when building the Würth database as it provides continuity in the serial number series and back plate identification info we have recorded.
     
  6. etmb61

    etmb61 Registered User
    NAWCC Member

    Oct 25, 2010
    2,220
    93
    48
    Retired Avionics Technician
    Mascoutah, IL
    Country Flag:
    Region Flag:
    Kamil,

    If you have not already restored the clock, could you post a picture of the unassembled bracket when you go to clean it up?

    Thanks,

    Eric
     
  7. Kamil Urbanowicz

    Kamil Urbanowicz Registered User

    Aug 17, 2010
    255
    1
    18
    Sure I will, I haved not worked on the clock yet. In fact all we see on this pictures I posted is what I got from a clock 22886. So I will use this top block in the earlier clock with rectangular dial I posted around 8 months ago.

    Kamil
     
  8. Kamil Urbanowicz

    Kamil Urbanowicz Registered User

    Aug 17, 2010
    255
    1
    18
    I started working on my Wurth repair. Here is the pictures how this ball suspension looks and operate.

    Kamil


    DSC00644.jpg DSC00645.jpg DSC00646.jpg DSC00647.jpg DSC00648.jpg DSC00650.jpg DSC00651.jpg
     
  9. etmb61

    etmb61 Registered User
    NAWCC Member

    Oct 25, 2010
    2,220
    93
    48
    Retired Avionics Technician
    Mascoutah, IL
    Country Flag:
    Region Flag:
    Thanks for the pictures Kamil!

    Wurth a thousand words. :excited:

    Eric
     
  10. Kamil Urbanowicz

    Kamil Urbanowicz Registered User

    Aug 17, 2010
    255
    1
    18
    Your welcome :)
    Will You try to make such one bracket?

    Regards
    Kamil
     
  11. etmb61

    etmb61 Registered User
    NAWCC Member

    Oct 25, 2010
    2,220
    93
    48
    Retired Avionics Technician
    Mascoutah, IL
    Country Flag:
    Region Flag:
    That was my first choice. I was considering a clock that was missing the top parts. Now I think I'll look for a complete clock.

    Still, making one doesn't appear to be that difficult.

    Eric
     
  12. John Hubby

    John Hubby Principal Administrator
    Staff Member NAWCC Star Fellow NAWCC Life Member

    Sep 7, 2000
    12,077
    165
    63
    The Woodlands, TX
    Country Flag:
    Region Flag:
    For info when considering the use of this upper bracket in restoring one of the Würth clocks, the lowest serial number documented to date with one if these installed is 21726 (3rd quarter 1909), with about 80% of all the clocks having higher serial numbers being fitted with the No. 16 bracket. The highest serial number recorded to date is 24341.

    The relatively late usage of this bracket is puzzling since it was patented mid-1907, but so far none have been found earlier than the one mentioned. The No. 14 double gimbal bracket showed up promptly when it was patented in 1906 and used extensively until this No. 16 was introduced. It was also used by Kienzle from their startup in late 1907 and until the end of 1910 when Würth ceased production; it appears that Kienzle were sourcing their No. 14 brackets from Würth and when production stopped they didn't try to make any more themselves.
     
    etmb61 likes this.
  13. jeffm

    jeffm Registered User

    Mar 21, 2010
    7
    1
    3
    Clothing pattern maker
    Niwot, Colorado
    Country Flag:
    Here is another Wurth clock to add to the data base. It is serial # 23866. This clock was part of the "Horolovar Collection", Clock #19 (#61 in the Repair Guide). I got this clock from Dave Cooper, who got it from Robert Terwilliger. Dave did a beautiful job restoring it. It has a bracket #16, 3 ball pendulum #28, Plate #1427. In the pictures, the position of support for the top block is rotated to where the beat is correct. The clock did not have a fork with it, so I put one on that fit the pin. I will try to locate a correct one. It has a .0033" spring. It runs very strongly, and keeps good time. Any more info on this clock, and where this fit in with Wurth clocks in general would be greatly appreciated.
    Thanks,
    Jeff

    Terwilliger clock 19.jpg Terwilliger full back.jpg Terwilliger back plate.jpg Terwilliger pendulum.jpg Terwilliger gears.jpg Terwilliger top block 4.jpg Terwilliger top block 5.jpg Terwilliger top block 7.jpg Terwilliger top block 8.jpg Terwilliger face.jpg Terwilliger dome.jpg Terwilliger dent.jpg
     
  14. lesbradley

    lesbradley Registered User
    NAWCC Member

    Dec 20, 2007
    1,037
    4
    38
    IT analyst
    Fairford, England
    Country Flag:
    Region Flag:
    I am pretty confident the pendulum is not original. It is a Badische model. Wurth were supplied with a number of different pendulums. If you look in this link Post Your W. Würth & Co. Clocks Here for a post from Ingulphus in 2008 you will see the most likely match and others.
     
  15. etmb61

    etmb61 Registered User
    NAWCC Member

    Oct 25, 2010
    2,220
    93
    48
    Retired Avionics Technician
    Mascoutah, IL
    Country Flag:
    Region Flag:
    Jeff,

    My data shows this would qualify as Würth's basic model clock for the final 3rd of their production. At the time it was made JUF and Kienzle were selling clocks that looked nearly identical. It probably sold for about $15.

    Eric
     

Share This Page