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Barry Armstrong

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Feb 3, 2015
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I just purchased a torsion and I think the plates belong to plate 1663. But I'm not sure that blocks are proper and I think that a Disc versus a 4 ball is proper pendulum. So the question is, is it an early Badische Uhrenfabrik? Any idea of date? Any info would help. Thanks. Barry

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Schatznut

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I just purchased a torsion and I think the plates belong to plate 1663. But I'm not sure that blocks are proper and I think that a Disc versus a 4 ball is proper pendulum. So the question is, is it an early Badische Uhrenfabrik? Any idea of date? Any info would help. Thanks. Barry

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Clear pictures of the back plate (from straight on and as close as you can get), top (showing the escapement, which will probably have a pin pallet anchor) and the opposite side showing the mainspring barrel will help identify it. If it has the gear teeth on the barrel adjacent to the back plate, it is probably a Huber Uhren movement, which has been incorrectly documented as a Badische Uhrenfabrik movement in the book
 

KurtinSA

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Nov 24, 2014
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My marked up repair guide says this is a Huber ca 1914-1920. I think we've had the discussion that Huber made movements that were badged by others...this one appears to be offered by Kienzle but made by Huber. The guide does say it's supposed to be a disc pendulum.

Kurt
 

etmb61

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Kienzle model 204. Looks like you have the very scarce original non-adjustable Kienzle pendulum, #32 in the guide, and require the special bottom block shown in appendix 96.

You can buy a reproduction bottom block on ebay or from Horolovar. Both are from the same source.

Eric
 
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Barry Armstrong

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I've search the forums for Kienzle 204 and have found a couple of pictures of back plates that are different then mine. They all have a cut out on the top center and this one doesn't. Does that make a difference?
 

etmb61

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Hi Barry,

No the model has nothing to do with the actual plate design except that it has lantern pinions. Model 204a is the same clock but with a solid pinion movement. There is a Kienzle catalog page posted somewhere that describes it.

What's important to note is your clock has the first version of Kienzle's ball pendulum, and it's original to the clock. From that we can determine the date range when it was made. There is another post with a similar clock somewhere in this forum which has more info. I'll post a link when I find it.

Eric
 

Barry Armstrong

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Does not having any markings or serial numbers on the plates indicate that it is an early or late production date?
 

etmb61

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For Huber movements, not having the DRGM stamps shows it's a later product but aside from that there is not enough information to tell. The pendulum was only used a short time so that is the date you'll need to find. John Hubby could probably tell us more.

Eric
 

Barry Armstrong

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I've ordered a repro adjustable bottom block and have the clock running with its current setup. The suspension spring is holding the pendulum about half way between the base and the movement. It doesn't look right. When I get the new bottom block I'll get a new suspension spring. Any idea how long it should be? What does the length of the suspension spring have to do with the clock performance? Any suggestion would be appreciated.
 

KurtinSA

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The shorter the spring, the faster the clock will run...shorter means stiffer. So, if the spring is not the right length and you cannot adjust the rate of the pendulum to keep proper time, you only have two choices...buy a longer spring or use a thinner spring.

As for length of spring, you'll have to do some mockups and come up with a length. Rest the pendulum on the base with your new bottom block in place. Make a measurement of the length needed...then maybe reduce by a few millimeters. Cut the new spring and put it together. Likely you will need to cut some more, but don't cut too much at the outset. Can't add it later!!

Kurt
 

etmb61

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I've ordered a repro adjustable bottom block and have the clock running with its current setup. The suspension spring is holding the pendulum about half way between the base and the movement. It doesn't look right. When I get the new bottom block I'll get a new suspension spring. Any idea how long it should be? What does the length of the suspension spring have to do with the clock performance? Any suggestion would be appreciated.
Hi Barry,

Your suspension spring should be long enough to put the pendulum at a pleasing height above the base. The length will affect timekeeping. Longer=slower. The adjustable bottom block changes the free length of the suspension spring to regulate the clock. It's less effective than shifting the weight on an adjustable pendulum and only gives a fine adjustment. The spring you choose must be very close to keeping the clock regulated with the adjustable block centered in it's range.

Eric
 

Barry Armstrong

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I've received the adjustable bottom block. Now I need to order a suspension spring. I needs a longer suspension spring than the 5 inch. So what size spring should I order? .004? Anyone have a model 204 and can let me know? Thanks
 

Barry Armstrong

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Does anyone have the dimensions of the suspension guard. I have a machinist friend who will make one up for me (unless someone has one that they are willing to sell)?
 

KurtinSA

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Are there screw holes on the back plate to accept a suspension guard? I'm not sure I see any, but maybe the angle of the picture is wrong.

Kurt
 

etmb61

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KurtinSA

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I saw those two holes but wasn't sure they were for a guard. Clearly they are not in proper position to be a pivot hole.

Kurt
 

Barry Armstrong

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Eric...thanks for the pictures.
Kurt.... When I first picked up the clock I wasn't aware what the purpose of those two holes were, but, saw a description of them I think in a post by John H. somewhere on the Forums.
 

Barry Armstrong

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I bought a repro bottom bracket and used a .0040 suspension spring. It's running about 30 minutes fast a day. I've extended the adjustment as long as it can go. From your experience, going to a .0038 spring slow it down enough. Or should I try something else?
 

KurtinSA

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I think that much of a jump is too much...even 0.0039" is probably too much. You're only 1.25 minutes per hour fast. I think you should slowly thin the current spring and keep checking your beats per minute. Do it slowly and sneak up on the right number.

Kurt
 

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Rockford's early high grade movements by Greg Frauenhoff