Whats the proper verge

D

dan_46

90.gif

I'm still pretty new to antique clocks, and have alot to learn.
I'm trying to fiqure out how to find the proper verge for this unmarked 30 hour ogee weight movement. The escape wheel is an inch and three eighths in diameter, and has 42 teeth, I ordered one from timesavers that was listed as right for most marked and unmarked ogee movements with 42 teeth, but it was too small.
Since I have to find a verge via mail order, is there a rule of thumb for finding the right one, or is it just hit or miss ?


Dan
 
D

dan_46

90.gif

I'm still pretty new to antique clocks, and have alot to learn.
I'm trying to fiqure out how to find the proper verge for this unmarked 30 hour ogee weight movement. The escape wheel is an inch and three eighths in diameter, and has 42 teeth, I ordered one from timesavers that was listed as right for most marked and unmarked ogee movements with 42 teeth, but it was too small.
Since I have to find a verge via mail order, is there a rule of thumb for finding the right one, or is it just hit or miss ?


Dan
 

eskmill

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The recoil escapement is very tolerant of the verge angles; of course there are optimum angles.

Ideally, the verge should span seven and one-half teeth on most right angle geometry escapements. That is with one verge palet on a tooth, the opposite palet should be between two 'scape wheel teeth.

It is not umcommon for a verge to function properly between fewer or more teeth than the usual seven and one-half teeth.

Note too, that the pivot for the verge assembly saddle is somewhat adjustable on your Connecticut clock movement. Thus the distance between the verge pivot and 'scape wheel arbor pivots are variable affecting the clearances as the verge moves between 'scape wheel teeth.

The verge used on Connecticut brass clocks like yours can be bent to spread the span of the palets. Don't re-form the tips of the verge; bend it in the middle where the steel should have been annealed for you.

If the verge tips have been malformed, then obtain a simple gauge invented by Royce Hulsey.
Some of the supply houses offer Hulsey's gauge.

I believe if you study the escapement as you work, you will get a good understanding of it's geometry and know how the subtle angles of the palet faces affect the "lift" of the escapement and how the two "drops" (entry drop and exit drop) or clearances between the palet tips cause the "tic and toc."

Much of the above is illustrated in many books. I suggest Dr. David Goodman's "This Old Clock," available at very modest cost from him for starters.
 

Smudgy

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May 20, 2003
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Although I wouldn't recommend it for a movement of the age and condition of the one you have, you can purchase the wheel and verge as a set. You would need to replace the wheel, and that may require making a bushing for the wheel depending on the hole size and arbor dimensions. Replacing the original wheel with a newly fabricated one would also alter the historic structure of the piece, which is why I wouldn't recommend it. If you did decide to replace the wheel, keeping the original part with the clock for restoration would be helpful.
 
D

dan_46

Thanks for the input. I agree, think things should be kept as original as possible.
This movement is in really good shape. If I can just find the proper verge, and a decent ogee case it should make a pretty nice clock.

Dan
 

Sooth

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Depending on the verge you use, be sure it hasn't been "hardened" or tempered, because it may break in half if you don't anneal it. Annealing and hardning metal is fairly easy. To anneal, place in a heat source until red hot (or close) then let it cool slowly. To harden, repeat, but cool it quickly instead (in oil or water).

It's too bad you don't have a case. Your movemnt (based only on my personal experience) looks like it is probably from a Seth Thomas. I could be wrong. It looks like an early one though, since it's got ribbed gears and pinned plates.

Keep an eye out on eBay. Flea markets and antiques stores may also have some.
 
D

dan_46

First off, thanks to you guy's for sharing what you know with a "rookie".
Made a test stand the other day out of some scrap, ordered some verges, and after a little fiddling, got the movement running like a charm, been going 2 days now.
Now my question is about the strike side. I took the movement apart and cleaned and oiled it. I'm using about 2 lbs of weight on the strike side. I will start off striking slow, then speed up. The fan is going like it should and theres no play or wobble to the gear wheels. Should I use less weight, or is there something else I should look for?

Dan
 

Ralph

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I would say 3 1/2 - 4 lbs would be correct.

Ralph
 
D

dan_46

The works on this is brass. I tried a 4 lb weight and it went much too fast.

Dan
 
D

dan_46

I didn't mean to give the impression that it was a wood works movement, its all brass.I posted photo. When I say it strikes fast with 3 or 4 lbs, I mean fast. Almost like an alarm clock.

Dan
 

Sooth

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Hi again,

Some movements of this type used weights as heavy as 4 lbs though, even if it's not a wooden works. I have seen the photo above, so that's why I'm saying it should be about 3 1/2 lbs. 3 minimum.

If it's striking any faster than this clock:
http://www.angelfire.com/me5/clockman/steeple1.wav
then there may be a problem with your clock.

Check that the fly/fan is tight on the shaft, but still able to rotate if pushed by hand, or with a finger. It should be tight enough to not slip, or spin freely. That's about the only problem I can think of.

I haven't seen any ogee movement with a weight of under 2 3/4. The ONLY smaller weights are 1 lb alarm weights, used when the movement has the alarm mechanism inside the plates at the bottom.
 
D

dan_46

You hit the nail on the head, the fly was loose on the shaft. Thats what I needed to know, thanks.

Dan
 

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