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Waterbury Mantel Clock minute hand and strikes issue

rfederle

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Hello all,

I am new here and this looks like the place to be for me. I have an old Waterbury Clock and tha minute hand fits on a square shaft and once in place, a washer slips on and is pinned in place. After lubricating I finally have it running after getting the pendulum times / adjusted. The strike works at the half and strikes the hours but its 4 minutes early.

Is there a way to adjust the minute hand shaft or maybe the "trip" for the strikes?? By the way, I have no information as to actual date on manufacture or model number. The lables are gone and a family member bought it at a flea market a while back. On the mechanism it has Waterbury Clock Co Pat'd Sept 22.1874.. I also have no key for winding it so I used a small adjustable wrench. The squares on the shafts appear to be about 3/32". Would anyone happen to have a number for the key size I would need?

Thank you all in advance.

Robert
 
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wow

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Look under “how to do it” at the top of this repair section and find “count wheel basics”. The J hook can be bent to adjust the point where the strike begins. Your key is probably one of these:

1FD9DFDF-E5FB-4020-B125-2C0BC1A37723.png
 
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shutterbug

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You'll have to decrease the bend in the "J" just a tiny bit.
 
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rfederle

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Look under “how to do it” at the top of this repair section and find “count wheel basics”. The J hook can be bent to adjust the point where the strike begins. Your key is probably one of these:

View attachment 678307
Thank you. I will certainly look there and thank you for that link to keys. I will take a more accurate measurement.

rfederle
 

rfederle

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OK, I see a wire that is connected to the shaft the strikes the gong. All are connected and the J wipes the arbor. Is that correct? If it strikes 4 minutes early and I need to bend that where if touches the arbor, which way do I bend and I assume very slightly? From the previous post I understand I need to bend it very slightly AWAY from the arbor, is this correct?

rfederle
 

wow

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OK, I see a wire that is connected to the shaft the strikes the gong. All are connected and the J wipes the arbor. Is that correct? If it strikes 4 minutes early and I need to bend that where if touches the arbor, which way do I bend and I assume very slightly? From the previous post I understand I need to bend it very slightly AWAY from the arbor, is this correct?

rfederle
What do you mean by wipes the arbor? And… the J hook is not connected to the hammer wire arbor, right?
 

Willie X

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The hook's 'toward' or 'away' needs to stay about the same. Pretty sure you need 'more curl' ... whatever it takes to move the drop off point to where it needs to be. Probably about 1/16", more or less.

I don't think anyone mentioned 'turning the hand over', this is not often the problem but always a good thing to try, before bending anything.

Most take a #6 key but measuring often doesn't help that much. I would buy a #5, 6, and 7 American made keys, along with a Waterbury repo key. This should do it and the cost of the extra 3 keys will be about the same as a second shipping charge, if you ordered a single key that didn't fit.

Willie X
 

rfederle

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What do you mean by wipes the arbor? And… the J hook is not connected to the hammer wire arbor, right?
OK, The one I mentioned does touch the arbor but then there is another on the opposite side that does not. NOW I see a tab on the arbor and I suppose that is what eventually wipes that wire. Would this wire on the opposite side be the "J" I need to adjust? This wire is connected to the shaft that moves as it strikes as this moves the wire that engages the sproket (for lack of better term) that counts the number of strikes (Hour).

rfederle
 

rfederle

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Oct 26, 2021
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The hook's 'toward' or 'away' needs to stay about the same. Pretty sure you need 'more curl' ... whatever it takes to move the drop off point to where it needs to be. Probably about 1/16", more or less.

I don't think anyone mentioned 'turning the hand over', this is not often the problem but always a good thing to try, before bending anything.

Most take a #6 key but measuring often doesn't help that much. I would buy a #5, 6, and 7 American made keys, along with a Waterbury repo key. This should do it and the cost of the extra 3 keys will be about the same as a second shipping charge, if you ordered a single key that didn't fit.

Willie X
Yes, I tried turning it over but still the same. I will get a better measurement on the winding shafts. Thank you for the reply.

rfederle
 

wow

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OK, The one I mentioned does touch the arbor but then there is another on the opposite side that does not. NOW I see a tab on the arbor and I suppose that is what eventually wipes that wire. Would this wire on the opposite side be the "J" I need to adjust? This wire is connected to the shaft that moves as it strikes as this moves the wire that engages the sproket (for lack of better term) that counts the number of strikes (Hour).

rfederle
The J hook is the wire that is shaped like a J. It has a pointed paddle that is lifted slowly as the minute hand turns. Watch that hook as you turn the minute hand and it will drop when the hand is at 12. Yours is off so if you bend that pointed paddle so it releases later and drops at 12 and you have it.
 
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Willie X

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Don't mess with the little 'L' shaped wires that protrude from the handshaft. They can be adjusted but shouldn't be touched unless they have obviously already been messed with. :) Willie X
 
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rfederle

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Don't mess with the little 'L' shaped wires that protrude from the handshaft. They can be adjusted but shouldn't be touched unless they have obviously already been messed with. :) Willie X
This one, looking at the back of the mechanism is on the right side of handshaft. It is shaped as a "J". I gently bent this wire and I was so gentle I dont think it moved but when it strikes the half hour the minute hand does seem closer to correct time than before but even though I handle the mechanism ever so lightly, not the hour strike does not chime. I am sorry I am being troublesome but I am trying to get this right for a family member as much as I can and everyone here has been a big help. I know things now I didnt know a few days ago.

Thank you all again for helping me.

rfederle
 

rfederle

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The J hook is the wire that is shaped like a J. It has a pointed paddle that is lifted slowly as the minute hand turns. Watch that hook as you turn the minute hand and it will drop when the hand is at 12. Yours is off so if you bend that pointed paddle so it releases later and drops at 12 and you have it.
Thank you. I didnt touch those, only the wire to the right of the handshaft looking at the back of the mechanism. I may have to look at that paddle. I will be away for the weekend so will check when I return.

rfederle
 

Vernon

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Open this RFE. Thanks Bangster & Charlie
 

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rfederle

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Open this RFE. Thanks Bangster & Charlie
Was just heading out the door and saw this. Opened the doc and saw the diagram. That is very helpfull and I will definitely look at that further when I return. Much appreciated and have a good weekend. I will try and get the wire back in position and look at the arbor tabs. Half hour strikes as it should so I will tinker a little more.

Thank you again.

rfederle
 

Vernon

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Check your downloads
 

Vernon

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How? I’m on an iphone
I have android but think that you access downloads through your files app. I tried to post it differently to no avail.
 

shutterbug

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It sounds like you have a passing strike on the half hour. If so, it functions differently from the hour strike. You'll have to watch what is happening at the hour that prevents the strike now. Also note that the movement must be vertical in order for the hour strike to work.
 

rfederle

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It sounds like you have a passing strike on the half hour. If so, it functions differently from the hour strike. You'll have to watch what is happening at the hour that prevents the strike now. Also note that the movement must be vertical in order for the hour strike to work.
Thank you Shutterbug,

Will be back maybe tomorrow and will have a look see. Yes, the half hours strikes as it should so I will refer to that PDF and have a look at the strike when it reaches the hour. I think I bent the wrong part of that J wire. I so slightly closed the gap on the wire and now I see I probably should have bent a different part of that wire. Thank you again and to all for the help. I am learning alot.

rfederle
 

rfederle

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Hello again all,

I have learned quite a bit here from all those that have replied. I also want to thank Vernon for the PDF file. I read it and using diagram 2 at the bottom I bent that J wire in the proper location and after 24 hours of running (AFTER I got the pendulum to swing after winding a little too tight) the strike is now about a half a minute off and am afraid to keep messing with it. Seems to be keeping good time so far and I think the minute hand may have to be bent slightly to line up with the 12 on the strike as its a little sloppy on the arbor. Any hints here would be welcomed.

Thank you all for the assistance and for this forum in general.

rfederle
 

rfederle

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Oct 26, 2021
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It sounds like you have a passing strike on the half hour. If so, it functions differently from the hour strike. You'll have to watch what is happening at the hour that prevents the strike now. Also note that the movement must be vertical in order for the hour strike to work.
Thank you.

Yes, it was a bit of a pain taking it in and out of the cabinet but the efforts paid off. Yes, it is hard to see in there but I was able to get an idea of what was being talked about and helped me to understand.

rfederle
 

rfederle

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Oct 26, 2021
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Thank you.

Yes, it was a bit of a pain taking it in and out of the cabinet but the efforts paid off. Yes, it is hard to see in there but I was able to get an idea of what was being talked about and helped me to understand.

rfederle
Thought I would give an update. I think I am going to have to adjust the "J" again. The hour strikes about 2 minutes slow but the half hour, which I understand is seperate mechanically is dead on. It has run over a week now and wound it this past Monday.

I thank all of you for your input and look forward to more as time goes on. I will try and post some photos soon but not sure when. I DO think the top part of the cabinet may be Seth Thomas but the works and base are definitely Waterbury.

Happy Thanksgiving to all and to all Veterans out there, I appreciate and thank you for your service and sacrifices.

rfederle
 

rfederle

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Hello again all,

Hope everyone had a great Thanksgiving for those that observe that Holiday.

I have now got the strike on the half hour and the hour correct. It matches my Grandfather Clock nearly spot on. The issue I have now is that the minute hand is not in the correct position on th strikes and I know there is a little slop in the arbor hole but it appears the flats on the Arbor are off slightly. I was wondering if someone may have had this apart before and maybe placed the Arbor back in and was off by a tooth? Would this be possible and how would I alter this? OR, could it be the Arbor itself may have a slight twist?

Thank you all in advance for your isight and knowledge. I appreciate it.

rfederle
 

shutterbug

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First try turning the minute hand over. That will often fix things up.
 
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rfederle

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First try turning the minute hand over. That will often fix things up.
Thank you. I will give that a try. Will be away today but as soon as I get back will flip it and see how it does. Thank you Shutterbug.

rfederle
 

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