American Waltham Pendulum Info Needed

Discussion in 'General Clock Discussions' started by pmatson, Mar 12, 2020.

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Need missing pendulum info.

  1. Pictures of similar pendulum

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  2. Lead on parts

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  1. pmatson

    pmatson Registered User
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    May 11, 2016
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    I have a customer who has a 9 tube Waltham grandfather clock that is missing the pendulum rod and leader with beat adjuster and suspension spring. This clock has a tag that states it was a gift to a gentlemen in the Elks on April 2 of 1924, assuming it was new it was probably built in 1922 or 1923. The serial number on the bottom of the back plate is 11157.

    It has a 3 tube mercury pendulum but the mercury was spilled out in transit, the picture shows it inverted.

    Any pictures of a similar clock with the pendulum, leader and suspension spring would be appreciated. I can probably fabricate most of what is missing but I need a starting point. Any lead on old Waltham parts or drawings will also be desired.

    Best Regards

    Clock face.jpg Front 36.jpg Notch and Pin.jpg Pendulum weight.jpg Scale post at bottom.jpg Works Back 19.jpg Works Back Left 42.jpg
     
  2. Andy Dervan

    Andy Dervan Registered User
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    Oct 23, 2002
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    See my conversation to you.

    Andy Dervan
     
  3. upstateny

    upstateny Registered User

    Oct 2, 2015
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    You could use the rod from a standard Waltham. I have one here that I will take pictures of and post them.
     
  4. upstateny

    upstateny Registered User

    Oct 2, 2015
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    20200314_092432.jpg 20200314_092454.jpg

    The spring is very similar to a Herschede, the one pictured here is an original Waltham. It is the type used by your clock.
     
  5. pmatson

    pmatson Registered User
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    May 11, 2016
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    Thank you upstateny -- do you have a picture of the leader & beat adjustment?
     
  6. upstateny

    upstateny Registered User

    Oct 2, 2015
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    There is no leader as such, the pendulum rod has a slot milled in it that slips over the post on the crutch. The beat adjuster is the threaded affair on the end of the suspension spring in the first picture. In a pinch you could use the Herschede part after a little tweaking, I have done this but you need to shorten the Herschede spring or perhaps make a new spring that fits the Waltham slot in the first picture. The picture does not show the pin that holds the spring in place.
     
  7. upstateny

    upstateny Registered User

    Oct 2, 2015
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    #7 upstateny, Mar 14, 2020
    Last edited: Mar 14, 2020
    This should make it all clear to you. With the slot in the rod over the crutch pin, the nuts on either side of the shaft on the spring is shifted left or right to achieve the correct beat. Old Walthams are built like a tank!

    20200314_100711.jpg
     
  8. pmatson

    pmatson Registered User
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    May 11, 2016
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    Thank you, this clears things up. One more question or assumption -- so it looks like I will need to thread/tap the suspension spring so when you turn the nuts it will move left or right?
     
  9. upstateny

    upstateny Registered User

    Oct 2, 2015
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    Yes, not easy to see but the top end of the spring has a rather thick brass block which is tapped to match the threads on the top rod. Does your customer just want the clock to run or are they trying to put it back to factory?
     
  10. upstateny

    upstateny Registered User

    Oct 2, 2015
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    Given that the dial says Waltham Clock Company I would guess the clock was built prior to 1922. Waltham changed their name to the waltham clock and watch company in 1922/3.
     
  11. pmatson

    pmatson Registered User
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    May 11, 2016
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    We are going to just get it to run. It looks like I will need to make a round rod to match the pendulum and a wood or flat leader. best regards.
     
  12. upstateny

    upstateny Registered User

    Oct 2, 2015
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    OK, good luck with it! Since all of your viles are intact, you might want to consider having steel turned to fit the vials and eliminate using real mercury. It is dangerous but the main problem is the cost of a flask of mercury 2-3K$ for 1 flask around 29 pounds.
     
  13. pmatson

    pmatson Registered User
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    May 11, 2016
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    Thank you for the info, I will come up with turned steel of lead shot (I am from Idaho) for filler. I will make the pendulum flat and one peace with a suspension assembly at the top and a slot for the crutch pin. One of the pictures shows a threaded post, I assume this is to lock the pendulum in place. A measurement from the top notch to the base of the pendulum would be a great starting point.
     
  14. upstateny

    upstateny Registered User

    Oct 2, 2015
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    OK, I will make that measurement for you and post it. Well I am originally from Nebraska, so hello neighbor.
     
  15. upstateny

    upstateny Registered User

    Oct 2, 2015
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    You may be better off using the standard lead/brass standard bob instead of the three vial. More available and less construction details to mess with. I will get you the measurements you asked for.

    20200314_092454.jpg

    This picture is the rating assembly for the standard brass/lead bob, the brass nut is what is used to raise and lower the bob to get accurate timekeeping.
     
  16. pmatson

    pmatson Registered User
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    May 11, 2016
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    OK, upstate -- looking forward to the measurement/picture if you have a mercury set up.
     
  17. upstateny

    upstateny Registered User

    Oct 2, 2015
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    Here are the pictures of a standard pendulum.

    20200315_172805.jpg 20200315_172824.jpg 20200315_172839.jpg
     
  18. pmatson

    pmatson Registered User
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    May 11, 2016
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    Thank you so much for your time, these pictures are all I need to get going.
     
  19. upstateny

    upstateny Registered User

    Oct 2, 2015
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    You are welcome! The length of the pendulum is the same regardless of the bob style standard or three vial. The only difference is the top hook and suspension spring but that is goverened by the back cock style on the movement.

    Regards
     
  20. upstateny

    upstateny Registered User

    Oct 2, 2015
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    I will get my microeter out tomorrow and get you WxD measurements on the pendulum rod as well as the size of the slot for the foot of the crutch.
     
  21. pmatson

    pmatson Registered User
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    May 11, 2016
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    Hi, any luck with measuring the WXD and slot? Hope all is well and you and family are virus free.
     
  22. upstateny

    upstateny Registered User

    Oct 2, 2015
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    Yes! Here you go!

    All measurements are in decimal inches.

    Pendulum rod
    0.62 wide
    0.16 thick

    Slot
    0.7 long
    0.152 wide

    Placememt of slot centered on pendulum rod.
    Top of slot 4.5 inches down from top of pendulum
    Bottom of slot 5.25 inches down from top of pendulum

    Suspension feather
    1.45 inches long
    0.40 inches wide
    0.0045 inches thick

    Have a look on eBay for Waltham 9 tube pendulums....900-1300$
     
  23. upstateny

    upstateny Registered User

    Oct 2, 2015
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    Here is hoe the suspension spring is attached to the pendulum rod.

    20200318_183001.jpg 20200318_183010.jpg
     
  24. pmatson

    pmatson Registered User
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    May 11, 2016
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    Thank you all, I am good to go.
     
  25. pmatson

    pmatson Registered User
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    May 11, 2016
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    Per the picture of the mercury pendulum shown above (it is up-side-down) There is a threaded portions with a thum-bwheel -- what is it for:???::???:? I am just guessing but is it to fine tune seconds:???:
     
  26. pmatson

    pmatson Registered User
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    May 11, 2016
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    Here is another picture of the nut on a threaded shaft. The ID of the shaft is about 5/8 in diameter and there are two set screws. Any thoughts ?? I am perdy sure there should be a round shaft that connects to the pendulum. I think the rough rating is accomplished by loosening the set screws and moving the heavy mercury pendulum bob up or down.

    Pendulum top nut.jpg
     

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