Using palladium leaf for "silvering" a dial

Discussion in 'Reverse Glass and Dial Painting' started by Russ Granzow, Jan 11, 2019.

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  1. Russ Granzow

    Russ Granzow Registered User
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    Jan 10, 2019
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    Jim DuBois likes this.
  2. novicetimekeeper

    novicetimekeeper Registered User

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    I would question what technique of silvering resulted in a chrome hubcap look. Certainly not the traditional displacement reaction with silver chloride.
     
  3. klokwiz

    klokwiz Registered User
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    I am far from an expert in these matters but examining the photos in the article the results appear less than ideal. The silvered areas appear to have an aluminum appearance rather than the classic silvered appearance. this is especially evident on the name badge, there is also a great deal of color variation especially around the noon hour.
    I expect the primary intent was to not replace original material, but it appears to me that the silvering was all but gone from the dial rings and may have been better corrected by a re-silvering with the numerals re-waxed. the hands also seem to have a strange coloration.

    That being said there is no doubt the dial has been greatly improved and it is difficult to really discern the product just from photos on a computer screen.

    I hope someone answers the original question of what the process is they used.

    Joe
     
  4. novicetimekeeper

    novicetimekeeper Registered User

    Jul 26, 2015
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    I hadn't read the text in the link before. I quite agree that the cleaning and restoration should have been left to a professional, they should have let somebody else do it.
     
  5. Jim DuBois

    Jim DuBois Registered User
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    Well, this may be a case of professional museum conservators vs what a professional dial restorationist might think appropriate. The museum conservationists generally so not allow processes that remove original material. I think we could agree that the methods we generally use to re-silver a dial require the removal of original material to get down to "bright/grained" brass to allow the resilvering compounds to bind with the brass. Every museum conservator I have known would not allow that, and that is one reason why so many clocks in museums look like yesterdays dog's lunch. In this case, they evidently overlaid a fair amount of oxidation with the leaf. That suggests it would be reversible. And the after shot is much more representative of what we would want the clock to appear, than the before version.


    What remains to be seen is what will happen to these surfaces over the next 10-50-100 years. Will it hold up? Affect the underlying surface adversely? Age gracefully? Remain as is? All unknowns. But, it certainly looks far better than it did before and is not in my eyes overly bright.
     
  6. novicetimekeeper

    novicetimekeeper Registered User

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    It doesn't require the removal of the wax though, which they thought it did, suggesting they don't know enough about the subject. They touched in the missing wax with acrylic paint, which sounds far more invasive than I would want. What ever they did to the dialplate seems to have left it rather blotchy, I don't think I'd want them any where near one of my clocks.
     
  7. Jim DuBois

    Jim DuBois Registered User
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    Notso novice....I certainly agree with you the dial mat is too splotchy.

    I find it interesting that museums will waste hundreds of thousands of dollars or euros or pounds on accidentially buying up fakes or completely restored examples of this or that, but will then pontificate for weeks/months/years over preserving flyspecks and oxidation and other natural but offensive occurrences...
     
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  8. klokwiz

    klokwiz Registered User
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    The real issue In my opinion is did the dial require restoration and how best to do so.

    I am all for retaining the original material and appearance whenever possible. If the only criteria was that it should not have any original material altered then it should have been left alone. Covering up missing or damaged material with a coating is questionable to me. Obviously they felt it had to be "repaired or restored" since they did so.

    In my opinion the dial required restoration as it had been severely damaged apparently by poor care. If the dial was to be restored then it should have been done by accepted restoration methods, i.e. cleaning of the brass to remove oxidation and re-silvering and waxing of the dial rings. Again I am only working with what I can see in the photos, It appears that all silvering of the dial rings had been lost and the way to correct that is the same process used to create them in the first place.

    It is a shame that the original dial was damaged, but it was done and needed to be restored correctly.

    Joe
     
  9. TEACLOCKS

    TEACLOCKS Registered User
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    Maybe this guy can help.

     

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