Unmarked Figure 8 Wall Clock

Discussion in 'Your Newest Clock Acquisition' started by mshamblin, Sep 10, 2017.

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  1. mshamblin

    mshamblin Registered User

    Aug 3, 2017
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    Greetings,

    I picked this clock up at an estate sale recently, seems to be in good condition but I am not able to find a makers mark. There is a "3" stamped on the movement and "R = A" on the bob. The movement is pinned as well as the hands. It is 27 in tall and 16 3/4 in wide.
    There are handwritten notes on the back that look like they are from being serviced.
    I would really like to know the maker and time period for this clock as I have not been able to find anything via google or any of my books.

    TIA!
    Michael

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  2. JTD

    JTD Registered User
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    Sep 27, 2005
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    Please could you post a pic of the back of the movement?

    JTD
     
  3. mshamblin

    mshamblin Registered User

    Aug 3, 2017
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    That would require removing the movement from the housing. That is not something I have ever done and something I would rather not do until I know more about the clock.
    I will try to see if I can get a mirror or snake camera back behind it for now though.
     
  4. mshamblin

    mshamblin Registered User

    Aug 3, 2017
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  5. JTD

    JTD Registered User
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    #5 JTD, Sep 12, 2017
    Last edited: Sep 12, 2017
    'Fabrikmarke' is German for 'trade mark'. The logo you see on the back of your movement is that of Carl Werner (you can see the initials CW in the middle of the logo).

    Carl Werner was a prolific manufacturer. The company was founded in Germany (Villingen) in 1861 and was taken over by Kienzle in 1913. They made a very wide range of clocks.

    I am not entirely sure that the pendulum is original to the clock - it seems to be hanging very high but that may be the angle at which the photo is taken.

    You have a nice clock in an unusual case - not one I have seen in a German clock before.

    JTD
     
  6. Uhralt

    Uhralt Registered User
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    Sep 4, 2008
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    The case reminds me of the Ingraham "Ionic" case.
    uhralt
     
  7. JTD

    JTD Registered User
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    I agree Uhralt, - I am almost wondering if the movement started out life in another case, but there does not seem to be any evidence of holes etc. in the present case that might point to that.

    Also the dial and hands are not quite what I would have expected. But all this is just a 'feel' I have about it, no real evidence.

    JTD
     
  8. mshamblin

    mshamblin Registered User

    Aug 3, 2017
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    #8 mshamblin, Sep 12, 2017
    Last edited: Sep 12, 2017
    I am adding more pics of the case. It does look similar to the Ionic or I have found pictures of what is called the Ansonia Kobe that is similar. The bottom glass is hinged differently from all of the pictures I have been able to find of the Ionic and Kobe. The top glass latch goes through the case rather than latch on the outside of the case.
    Mine also does not have the barrels on each side that extend from just behind the small round buttons between the top and bottom glass and the "buttons" are connected by a piece of wood that is loose in the case, i cannot remove it but it slides a quarter inch in either direction.
    Also, there are no other holes where an "original" movement was installed in the case which is making me think this is the original movement for this case unless there is something I am missing.
    I do feel that the face is incorrect. Just the paper feel of it but I am by far no expert. I am not sure about the rod and bob.
    I am still researching the movement to see if maybe I can figure out if maybe it was originally in this case or married later. Hard to tell since I cannot find another case like it.
    Thanks for all of your replies!

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  9. chronologiker

    chronologiker Registered User

    Jun 28, 2017
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    This is the first Werner I see in a case with an American design! But as far as I know, C. Werner was the only German clocks company with it´s own branch in Chicago/USA. So I think all it´s original.

    But the movement might have been imported from Germany and the case might be American. And movement and case were mounted together in Chicago.

    Chronologiker
     
  10. mshamblin

    mshamblin Registered User

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    Thanks!

    I really wish I could figure out the case now. It's similar to others but I have not found any others exactly like it.
     
  11. Jim DuBois

    Jim DuBois Registered User
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    Jun 14, 2008
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    It does not look like the case is American. At least the backboard is unlike anything I have seen in American clocks. Not only is the multipiece backboard questionable, but the wood itself in the backboard is not what we normally find here. Most backboards in smaller clocks here are of one piece construction and are of either pine or poplar. That material looks more like spruce or even a hard yellow pine....
     
  12. chronologiker

    chronologiker Registered User

    Jun 28, 2017
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    Jim, thank you for your comments!

    Mshamblin we have very less information about the Werner-branch in Chicago. Neither do we know when it was established, nor how long it existed. But certainly not in 1914 anymore.

    But we know the address: Washington Street 88-90.

    If you can find information about the Werner branch in Chicago, I would also be very interested.

    Chronologiker
     
  13. mshamblin

    mshamblin Registered User

    Aug 3, 2017
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    Thanks everyone for your input!

    I will do what I can to find information about the Werner-branch in Chicago and post here what I find.

    Thanks again!
     
  14. chronologiker

    chronologiker Registered User

    Jun 28, 2017
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    Thank you Mshamblin!

    Company Carl Werner was around the year 1910 in Germany the number 3 among the clocksfactories (after Junghans and HAC) but was larger than Kienzle, Lenzkirch or Mauthe. And Werner has also produced the best clocks of all of them: inexpensive alarm clocks, but also very elaborate and very expensive clocks and even anniversaries. So company Werner is today underrated again and again.

    Information about the branch of C.Werner in Chicago is therefore very welcome!

    Regards!

    Chronologiker
     
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