Unknown mainspring winder

[jboger]

Is anyone familiar with this mainspring winder? It came in a box with other things. I am not sure it is complete. I don't have a clock mainspring winder. If this one is worthwhile and the missing parts--if any--can be located, I my use it. The two Allen keys are correct and came in the box.

John

 

[TooManyClocks]

It has everything my Webster winder has, plus a extra arbor that can be useful. Looks like a vise mounted winder too. Can’t tell from the photo if it ratchets and can lock in position, or if it free-spins. It should work, though

John

 

[jboger]

Thank you. It does have a ratchet and it catches. I'll look up a Webster winder and see how it works because right now it eludes me.

 

[TooManyClocks]

Thank you. It does have a ratchet and it catches. I'll look up a Webster winder and see how it works because right now it eludes me.

i can take pictures of the instructions that came with my old winder and post them. It’ll be some hours later today before I get a chance.

Eye protection and gloves aren’t just a nice idea….they are a requirement! There are many instsnces of cut/lacerated hands shown on this message board. The very first open mainspring ever done here on a winder blew apart on me—that taught me what to watch out for if nothing else—and parts went flying quickly. The instructions for mine can be adapted to yours, the principle is the same


John

 

[jboger]

John:

Would really appreciate your instructions. And your words are very much taken to heart.

I don't plan to use the mainspring today or tomorrow, so please take your time.

John B.

 

[TooManyClocks]

The instructions you're looking for will be in the next thread below this one


One thing your winder doesn't have is a means to hold the winding arbor on two sides. That in itself isn't a dealbreaker, however. I wound many mainsprings without the arbor support Timesavers sells (no. 23762). It was designed for the Webster winder to hold the opposite end of the winding arbor and includes a longer 3/8 inch rod that replaces the bottom rod on the winder. If that can be adapted to yours, it is helpful but I don't find it is always works well as the hold on the other end is friction only and if the arbor is a little bent or worn strangely the extra support has questionable value. I also adapted my support to have larger hand setscrew handles by buying bigger ones and drilling and tapping new threads on the arbor support.

Here's a few pictures of mine to get an idea. I'll put Webster's winding instructions in the next thread below this one.

Also John B!

(yes, that outside workshed is overcluttered!)

 

[TooManyClocks]

Here's the instructions that came with my Webster winder:

 

[jboger]

It's getting clearer now. My version does not have a chuck to hold a winding arbor. (It's called a collet in the instructions.) What it does have are four sets of two screws (eight total). If I understand correctly, these are used to tighten down on a square arbor so that one can wind or unwind a mainspring. An Allen wrench came with the set is used to tighten these screws.

I hope I got that right. If so, one of the things that confused me is now clear.

In any case, I want to thank you very much for your time and effort to educate me on the use of this apparatus. I have wound mainsprings by hand into barrels. This should make life easier.

John

 

[shutterbug]

I believe that is correct. You'll want the setscrews snug, but you don't have to bear down on them enough to mar the squares. For barrels, you'll have to hold the barrel with one hand while you wind and position the capture sleeve with the other. The sleeve goes on before the arbor.

 

[TooManyClocks]

If my experience is any example, just be sure you have the setscrews tight enough on the arbor so that it can’t slip off the shaft when winding. The collet(tightening method that looks like a small drill chuck) on this Webster winder acts tight when it really isn’t. That’s the biggest reason the first mainspring i was winding flew one way, and the arbor went another direction. Even the mainspring clamp i was putting in place got into the act and went airborne. Guess that’s how I learn…

John

 

[shutterbug]

Yeah, the Webster clamp is not the best design, and is especially bad on smaller arbors. The set screws are a better idea.

 

[Thomas Sanguigni]

jbodger, I noticed one of the hooks is broken in your set. You will have to make a new one. Get a set of suede leather gloves at ACE to hold the barrels when winding. Your hand will get sore.

 

[shutterbug]

Yep. The good one is for open springs and the broken one is for barreled springs. The second photo in #6 (above) gives a pretty good idea of what it should look like.

 

[jboger]

Thanks, folks. Very much appreciated, both the advice and noticing the broken part.

 

[TooManyClocks]

Here’s some pictures of what it should look like. Of course, this is Webster’s version of the barrell hook. This one is just about 2 1/4 inches long from center of shaft to inside of hook. The length probably isn’t critical as long as it’ll get the job done. This one has the wire formed around a steel grommet, and there’s an old one here that is just wire with no grommet. This style is a little more secure, at least the one made for open-end mainsprings. Not sure I’ve used this one yet.

John

 

[Thomas Sanguigni]

My Webster must be older. It does not have the grommets or the barrel stabilizer. It must be 'first generation'. I've also noticed winding arbors bigger than a six will not fit in the chuck.

 

[TooManyClocks]

My Webster must be older. It does not have the grommets or the barrel stabilizer. It must be 'first generation'. I've also noticed winding arbors bigger than a six will not fit in the chuck.

Mind didn’t come with the grommets. That hook came as part of an “upgrade kit” or whatever they call it that Timesavers sells for the Webster. It primarily has an arbor support for the opposite side of the winding arbor, Timesavers part no. 23762 that I ordered a few years back.

I overhauled an Ithaca Calendar clock with an E N Welch movement that takes a #7 key. It’s been a while back, but I don’t remember having any issues mounting the arbor into the winder, and it seems to open as wide as I might need it to. It could be the jaws on the chuck on yours were bent downward to accommodate a small arbor at one time?

I really don’t know how old mine is. There is a label on it saying ’Webster Scale Manufacturing Co. Sebring, Florida visible in one of the photos on page 6, and the original box and instructions it came with when it was bought used look old, andd the box has faded print…

John

Actually, i just re-looked at the instructions. There’s a 1992 copyright date on it. Looks like they also sold a bushing tool, a depthing tool, and an escape wheel straightener about 30 years ago.

 

[TooManyClocks]

accidental duplicate post deleted

 

[Thomas Sanguigni]

Neat. I like the upgraded winding arbor stabilizer.

 

[chrisuk]

Hi there. I've used a Webster winder for several decades. I agree with you about the problem of holding small arbors. I made an adapter out of a large mainspring arbor by sawing off the opposite end from the square, making a hole in it and fitting set screws at 90 degree angles through the wall of the hole into the bored hole.
Another useful tool makes it easier to remove those springs where the squared end protrudes through the barrel base, usually the chime barrels. Again it is a modified arbor. In this case I removed the arbor's hook and fitted a new one which operates in an anticlockwise direction, just a screw with its head filed down. The spring can then be removed in the normal manner.
I also made some smaller sleeves out of round bar, 22mm & 20mm.
Anything else?
For large barrels in musical clocks with fusees a substantial piece of wood with a hole cut through it at one end and just large enough for the barrel with a slot cut from the hole to the end of the wood. A clamp can be used to hold the barrel in place and the other end of the wood can rest on the banch.
My winder does not have a barrel holder.
I hope that some of this was helpful.
Chris