Thoughts on Seagul and Sea-Gull

Discussion in 'Wrist Watches' started by Jubilado, Dec 30, 2016.

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  1. Jubilado

    Jubilado Registered User

    Feb 3, 2012
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    More than four years ago, I asked about a shameless automatic "replica" that I had been given and was advised that the movement was probably a Seagull TY2876. A few days ago, my younger son showed me a Yongeret Bresson automatic watch that his wife had given him. It appeared to beat 8 times per second and when I Googled the make, I learned that it too might rely on a Seagul ebauche.
    Since my replica, though worn rarely (I feel embarrassed) still keeps good time as does the French watch. I am interested in buying a watch that uses a Seagull movement as Seagull may be at an interesting point in their history. Naturally, I would prefer a Chines Sea-Gull using their own movement but as these are not so easy to find here, can anyone comment on the Western makers that use the ebauches of at least fair quality? I note that Fossil supposedly do so and they are readily available. The makers themselves appear a little coy about describing the insides of their products.
    Many thanks for any advice.
    I am, alas, not in the ranks of the big spenders but I find the history of mechanical developments fascinating.
     
  2. RON in PA

    RON in PA Registered User
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    May 18, 2005
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    Have you posted over in the Chinese Watch Forum over at WatchUseek.com? Probably the best source of info about Chinese watches on the web. Most of what I've read would indicate that SeaGull brand watches with their own in-house movements are of the best quality.
     
  3. Jubilado

    Jubilado Registered User

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    Thank you Ron in PA. I haven't explored the Forum you mention but will seek it out early next year.
     
  4. pmwas

    pmwas Registered User

    Dec 12, 2010
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    Sea Gull makes a variety of automatic and mechanical movements, including their own designs, ST-16 aka Claro888 being the best known, large and heavy ST-25 the other (both 21,600bph), tourbillion movements probably of their own design, and even more clones, incl. manual Unitas clone, St-19 chronograph (don't know what's the original, some Swiss chrono) and clones of both ETA 2824 and 2892A2.
    And I've likely missed at least one or two.

    A good maker, shame their movements are so often used in replica or counterfeit watches.
     
  5. Jubilado

    Jubilado Registered User

    Feb 3, 2012
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    Thank you pmwas. It was just that thought that led me to think that I would like to have one of their products that was not a fake. I will talk to our local watch repairer, who has helped me out with the odd old timepiece and see if he could remove or paint over the name that my examle bears. At least in my own mind, I could then wear it without shame. Some years ago, experts on this forum suggested that the movement, which I had photographed, was probably and ST-16. It seems to have something in common with the SEIKO of about 40 years ago.
     
  6. pmwas

    pmwas Registered User

    Dec 12, 2010
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    ST 16 is probably Sea-Gull's design but it combines features found in other watches.
    I've not torn it apart, but it's - like some other Chinese automatics - more or less similar to Miyota 8200, with indirect drive second hand. However, Sea-Gull's version has Seiko magic Lever autowinder, as opposed to other Chinese miyota-like designs.

    So to say - it's a Miyota 8200 with Seiko winder.
     
  7. RON in PA

    RON in PA Registered User
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    May 18, 2005
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    ST 19 is based on the Venus 175. The machinery was purchased by the Chinese around 1960 so that SeaGull could make chronographs for their air force.
     
  8. pmwas

    pmwas Registered User

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    Super! Yes Venus 175, now I remember :)
    So good that someone here knows, for me a Swiss chrono is a Swiss chrono. Shame on me, but I completely don't know who made them and what models are there...
     
  9. Jubilado

    Jubilado Registered User

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    Face.jpg Visible back.jpg Sorry that my photo skills are limited but thought that you might like to see the watch in question. Maybe this will help to pin down the movement type.
     
  10. pmwas

    pmwas Registered User

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    More complicated (dial indicators) version of ST-16.

    the rotor is a disgrace :(
     
  11. Jubilado

    Jubilado Registered User

    Feb 3, 2012
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    pmwas - now you see why I am embarrassed to wear it! I find that a great pity as it still keeps fair time. It has lost an average of 1 second per day for the past four days. I time it against my Junghans mega solar which has a minute hand that moves on after the second hand has reached 12.
    Thanks for all your comments anyway. I will hope to find a respectable watch with the simple ST-16 mechanism.
     
  12. JTD

    JTD Registered User

    Sep 27, 2005
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    I don't think you should feel too bad or embarrassed about wearing this watch. After all, most people will have no idea about the quality (or lack of), it keeps pretty good time and looks better than it really is. Wear it when you are working or whatever and keep your good watche(s) for special.

    Is what I think.

    JTD
     
  13. pmwas

    pmwas Registered User

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    Here's mine - a Polish Xicorr watch with Sea-Gull ST-19 chronograph movement:

    attachment.jpg

    attachment.jpg

    attachment.jpg

    Commemorating a Polish racing car Fiat 125P Akropolis.
    Large, thick and still quite pretty. Too large for my (Mr Burns size) wrist...
     
  14. Jubilado

    Jubilado Registered User

    Feb 3, 2012
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    You have a very distinctive watch, both face and back. Does it keep good time or has the slender wrist prevented testing? Sea-Gull face.jpg Sea-Gull back.jpg Sea-Gull face.jpg A friend passed me these (rather poor) pictures of a hand wound Sea-Gull that he received as a gift in 1991 when he completed the commissioning of a plant for a Chinese chemical concern. It had never been out of the box until he showed it to me on Friday. He took the photos! We have no friends who read Chinese, so have no idea what the ideograms mean.
     
  15. pmwas

    pmwas Registered User

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    In fact I've never worn it for more than few hours...
    So it certainly runs reasonably well, but I don't know if it's 10s or 40... Nothing I'd notice during half a day.
     
  16. glenhead

    glenhead Registered User
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    Jubilado, we spoke in PMs about my co-worker translating the tags on the watch. She looked at the thumbnails, and gave me a partial translation.

    In the one with the logo on it (with less writing), the bottom square says the prefecture where it was manufactured. She expects the lower part includes addresses and phone numbers, though it's a bit fuzzy. The top square is actually upside down (perhaps it's a folded card?), and she said it has the field names for the model number and serial number, but they're blank.

    In the one with more writing, it says "Seagull Automatic Watch", then something about "Note the following information". 1 suggests that you wear it at least ten hours a day to keep it wound. 2 tells how to wind it manually if you don't wear it enough, and says to manually wind it before you wear it the first time. 3 says that if you don't move enough, you may have to manually wind it. 4 starts describing how to set the date.

    She said she'll be happy to give you a complete translation if you send me the larger shots.

    Hope this helps!

    Glen
     
  17. Jubilado

    Jubilado Registered User

    Feb 3, 2012
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    Hi Glen
    Thank you and your colleague for the exciting news that the watch is the automatic version. I have passed it along to the owner and asked him to provide more and better pictures. I know that he has visitors at the moment but he will be very interested in your findings.
    Thanks again to you both

    Martin
     
  18. D Magner

    D Magner Registered User
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    Jubilado
    While this isn't what you are asking about, I thought I would include a picture of my Chinese Sea Gull brand watch. Attractive dial, domed sapphire crystal, nice case, keeps time and everything works fine. At just under 40mm, it is as large as I will wear.

    David
     

    Attached Files:

  19. Jubilado

    Jubilado Registered User

    Feb 3, 2012
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    David
    Thank you for showing those pictures. It may not be what I asked about but a handsome watch and very interesting. I will be in Bali next month and will look around while I'm there. Maybe they are on sale in Denpasar....
    Jubilado
     

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