This old watch…

[Reconnaissanceman]

Hello - I‘m kind of jumping protocol by asking a question in my first post, but I’ll introduce myself too. I’m one of those guys who grew up before everything jumped from analog to digital. Always have had a fascination for the little ticking boxes and was given a box of clocks and pocket watches once when I was a kid. Nobody cared about them, so I was free to disassemble and explore them. I managed to get a couple of them running but alas, not the one cool looking Waltham pocket watch!

Now I’m semi-retired and have decided I’ll never have the cash to restore the Porsche 911 of my dreams, but nothing is stopping me from rescuing a few old pocket watches and clocks. The Kundo anniversary clock I just repaired (mainspring slipping, big gear pinion broken) is sitting in front of me as I work on regulating it.

I now have this old watch I got from an eBay seller. I’ll post a picture of it below. The mainspring will wind up to 7 half turns, then slips but it ticks if I just get it to 6 half turns. So that‘s a good start I guess. Now, the question is, what on earth is it? No markings on the movement except the serial number. See what you think. I’ll get the barrel out of it in a few days and see what the mainspring looks like.

Photos to come, sorry. I think my device takes photos too big for the server. Will work on that and come back to attach.

Edit: So far, unable to attach photos. Maybe this link will work. Pocket Watch Database: Information and Serial Numbers for American Pocket Watches

 

[MrRoundel]

If the watch you'll be working on is a "Bracelet" model (That's where the link took me.), you might be in for a little big challenge due to the size. 10 ligne watches probably aren't the best to cut, or re-cut, your teeth on. Even handling those little mainsprings can be tricky. It's sort of like brain surgery without the brain. The good news is that the mainsprings are readily available. And it does sound like you're on the right track regarding what's stopping it from running. The fact that it will run on the winds it holds is a good sign that at least the balance staff should be good. Good luck,.

 

[Skutt50]

Welcome to the forum.

I agree with roughbarked. Probably a mainspring issue. This behavior is typical when the end of the mainspring that hooks to the mainspring barrel, has come loose.

You don't realy need the maker of the movement to fix this. Simply measure the old mainspring with a micrometer and order a new one by dimmension.

 

[Reconnaissanceman]

If the watch you'll be working on is a "Bracelet" model (That's where the link took me.), you might be in for a little big challenge due to the size. 10 ligne watches probably aren't the best to cut, or re-cut, your teeth on. Even handling those little mainsprings can be tricky. It's sort of like brain surgery without the brain. The good news is that the mainsprings are readily available. And it does sound like you're on the right track regarding what's stopping it from running. The fact that it will run on the winds it holds is a good sign that at least the balance staff should be good. Good luck,.

Sorry the link took you off-trail. It’s an 18s with 3/4 plate and the larger size is one of the reasons I was willing to tinker with it. Probably european built according to PWDB, 1890’s estimated.

 

[Reconnaissanceman]

Welcome to the forum.

I agree with roughbarked. Probably a mainspring issue. This behavior is typical when the end of the mainspring that hooks to the mainspring barrel, has come loose.

You don't realy need the maker of the movement to fix this. Simply measure the old mainspring with a micrometer and order a new one by dimmension.

Correct. Researching the correct mainspring isn’t the issue. Just would like to know what on earth I have. Still working on getting photos in small enough size so they will upload here.

 

[gmorse]

Hi Reconnaissanceman,

Just would like to know what on earth I have. Still working on getting photos in small enough size so they will upload here.

I think it is English; these were often marked as 'chronograph' on the dial, even though they weren't true chronographs. There should be a small slide in the case band which starts and stops the whole movement, so effectively a balance brake, and there's no facility to return to zero. A lot were made in Coventry during the 19th century.

What was the size of the picture you just posted? it's ended up as 538 x 1184, and the forum will normally accept much larger original images and scale them if necessary. This image is 3459 x 2148 and I've just uploaded it, by clicking on the 'Attach Files' button, without any extra processing by me. The system has scaled it to 74%, and I've taken the option to insert just the thumbnail in the post.



Regards,

Graham

 

[John Runciman]

If you look carefully at the image he attached the escapement it's in English lever. Then yes visually it looks like a three-quarter plate English watch. Also as everyone else noted we all agree it's probably the mainspring it's broken.

One of the interesting problems and watch repair is unmarked watches which of course means no tech sheet and definitely no tech sheet for watch of this age. But if you taken apart and measure the mainspring we should build the figure out something that should work hopefully.

 

[Bila]

The mainspring will wind up to 7 half turns, then slips but it ticks if I just get it to 6 half turns.

If it winds that far-up it will not have a broken mainspring (as suggested by others), but probably instead it will be slipping. If it is a hole-end spring (can also happen with a tongue-end mainspring) there will be a small pin/tab on the wall of the mainspring barrel, this can become worn and the spring does not catch as it should under the full pressure of the wound mainspring.

 

[Bernhard J.]

Hi,

The hairspring stud imo looks untypical for an English make. These "Centre Seconds Chronograph" movements were also made by the Swiss, for the English market. Looking very much alike the "real thing".

Cheers, Bernhard

P.S.: In English watches of this type the studs typically look like these, depending on whether flat or overcoil hairspring. Both examples are "Centre Seconds Chronograph" movements.

 

[Reconnaissanceman]

Great information, which I appreciate very much. I can confirm there’s a small slide button which you can see the outline of on the case band between the 1:00 and 2:00 indice, but I wasn’t sure what it was for since I didn’t notice any effect on the movement. I’ll keep you updated on progress once I have a chance to inspect the mainspring.

Who knew this could be so fun?!

 

[Reconnaissanceman]

Update: I pulled the barrel out and found the tail of the mainspring was broken so I punched a new hole in the end and reassembled the watch which is now ticking away the moments which make up my dull day. That long second hand is a beauty in motion.

I found no further identifying information other than the serial number, so that mystery is unsolved.

 

[gmorse]

Hi Bernhard,

The hairspring stud imo looks untypical for an English make.

You can see a very similar stud arrangement on some Lancashire Watch Company balance cocks.

Regards,

Graham

 

[Reconnaissanceman]

 

[Reconnaissanceman]

Here I was able to finally upload a photo of the movement