Pocket: The elusive remontoire

Discussion in 'Chronometers' started by karlmansson, Sep 27, 2015.

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  1. karlmansson

    karlmansson Registered User

    Apr 20, 2013
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    Hello!

    I posted this in the Watch Repair forum a little while ago. Whilst the answers I got were interesting and enlightening they didn't really answer my original question. As a remontoire in watches seems to be reserved for the most part to chronometers, I thought I'd try here as well. Here goes:
    "Hello everybody!

    At times, I wish there was a "Watch Construction" forum here, just as there is one for the clocks. This question would be better posted in such a one.

    I've started to read up a little on the principle of the remontoire, or try to read up on it that is. I have found very little. I understand that it is (in a watch) an intermediate spring that is wound at regular intervals by the mainspring and released by the escapement, either directly or indirectly, thereby acting on the escapement with a constant force for each cycle. That way, the force transmitted to the escapement will be the same for the entire running lenght of the mainspring, as long as the mainspring can wind the remontoire.

    Here are the resources I've found so far:
    http://www.tempered-online.com/forum....php?f=2&t=255

    In that post this is linked: http://www.marcdatabase.com/~lemur/d...emontoire.html

    Most of the mechanisms in the descriptions seem to have the arrangement that acts directly on the escapement. So that they would wind and unwind on each vibration of the oscillator.
    George Daniels does adress this arrangement in "Watchmaking" and about the only thing he has to say about them is that they are "unpractical". He instead favors a 15 second remontoire but leaves the description at that.

    Now. My understanding is that a 15 second remontoire would have to be triggered at some point outside the escapement, perhaps at every full rotation of the escape wheel. I've, in vain, tried to find an image of one of Daniels pocket watches (or R. Smiths for that matter) that employs a 15 second remontoire. If someone knows where I might find such a picture, or has a drawing of Daniels design, I would love to see it and be able to wrap my head around this.
    I can't figure out how such a mechanism would both be triggered and wound without first increasing resistance (trigger) and then either adding or losing power to the impulse (winding, depending on if the remontoire is bypassed in winding or if it is wound whilst in contact with the escapement).

    The idea seems ingenious and I'd love to try my hand at making one day. But for the moment I'll settle on understanding it!

    All help appreciated!

    Karl"

    In addition to that post, I later found a picture of Roger Smiths pocket watch No. 3 with a 15 second remontoire. I can't figure out how it works and the function of all auxiliary wheel involved in it and would love some help in understanding it. I understand that the fly is there to regulate winding speed but I can't find a connection to it and the going train.
    http://people.timezone.com/img/articles/news631856760155937500/rwsmith08.jpg

    So again: all help appreciated!

    Best

    Karl
     
  2. RON in PA

    RON in PA Registered User
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    May 18, 2005
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    Have you checked info on Harrison's H4?
     
  3. karlmansson

    karlmansson Registered User

    Apr 20, 2013
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    I did again and I relalize now that it is very close to what I am asking about... Thanks for pointing that out.

    However, I'm still curious to learn more about Roger Smiths remontoire in the last picture. Especially the triggering mechanism. If anyone would like to share some thoughts or actual facts about it, I'm all ears! Also, if there are other examples of train remontoires that you can share (the H4 is the only one in a watch that I've been able to find so far) I'd love to see it!

    Thanks!

    Karl
     

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