Suspension Spring

[Nicko]

I posted some photos of a Hauck clock that I have. After being away for a few months I returned to find that the suspension spring had broken.
Where and what would the best to be to use as a replacement and are there any instructions regarding length, fork and block placement.
I don't know how to post a link to the previous post but its no #114 on this board

Cheers
Greg Nixon

 

[KurtinSA]

Just helping out with the link:

https://mb.nawcc.org/showthread.php...ay-Clocks-Here&p=637784&viewfull=1#post637784

The way you do it is to find that original post, right click on the #114, and select Copy Shortcut. Then come back to this thread, and paste in the shortcut.

Kurt

 

[shutterbug]

The Hauck's, unlike the KundO's were all over the place with suspension spring sizes. I posted to your timing question at the end of that other thread. I THINK your plate is #1607, which would use a .0038" suspension. However, yours has an extra hole at the top of the plate. John will likely verify or correct me on that, so hold on
If you have a micrometer, you can Mic the old one and duplicate it.

 

[Nicko]

It looks to be .0034" thick x 4.6" long x .022" wide.

Time Savers 29896 or 29897 seem likely candidates. Which extra hole do you refer to shutterbug?

 

[shutterbug]

Looked like a pendulum lock or something that doesn't show in the book for the plate I mentioned. But if your figures are accurate, I may have the wrong plate However, the Horolovar springs are always .018" wide, so you may have a non Horolovar spring. They make the clock run fast, which would explain the thinner spring (to slow it down). Springs are not expensive, so if it were me I'd order both sizes Get the Horolovar springs.

 

[Nicko]

I replaced the suspension spring in this clock but there are a few other issues. The escapement is prone to chattering and the crutch bounces around the place after it unlocks. Reading some online info I reduced the distance of the fork from the top from 7mm to 5mm. Does anyone know what it should be? That tamed the chattering and adjusting the pallets back to equal length made it behave normally. Now one of the trailing impulse faces hits the top of two EW teeth, as the pallets drop again, but I should be able to straighten those out.
I wasn't going to take this movement apart but it was fortunate I did, I found a bent pivot on the wheel below the escape wheel. The bent pivot had been trying to bore its own hole into the plate for some time by the look of it.
All of those faults were present when I got the clock, no wonder it was hard to set the time.

 

[Tinker Dwight]

This is usually an adjustment that is done until it
works right. There is no specific value that is correct.
The fork must be higher than the flutter but
low enough to get over swing.
I'm not sure what you are saying about the the
impulse face hitting?
Tinker Dwight

 

[Nicko]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Escapement#mediaviewer/File:Graham_Escapement.svg
In this graphic, the RH pallet, the acute point, strikes on the tooth of the escape wheel as the pallet re-enters between the teeth. This stops the wheel. It only happens on a couple of teeth.


I read this post
https://mb.nawcc.org/showthread.php...eral-Questions&p=877416&viewfull=1#post877416
The interchange between you and Douglas is most informative.

BTW what is "the book" and where would I obtain a copy

 

[MartinM]

"The book" is:

400-Day Clock Repair Guide - 10th Edition
from June 1991

by Charles Terwilliger and edited by Bill Ellison




ISBN-13: 978-9992387269 ISBN-10: 9992387262

Available at lots of places

 

[Nicko]

Old thread, same clock, little progress. It did run for a few weeks, then I put the face and hands on and disturbed something and now it won't run.

I did get "the book" all the way from the US of A, and have studied it. So now, where do I start in setting up this Hauck escapement. I think setting the anchor lever straight up would be good. I would do this by sitting it on a level surface and adjusting the pallets so that the pallet lengths are equal and the lever points straight up.That would give some symmetry about the anchor movement when adjusting the drops and then the locks. Any idea how far the pallet tips should protrude, as a starting point?

On to the locks, it looks straight forward on the diagrams to see and adjust the locks to 2º. However in practice how to you achieve that? It looks like the easiest way is to check the distance between the leading edge of the tooth just past, and the leading edge of the pallet. I could calculate that 2º rotation as a distance at a radius of 10mm from centre. I can judge thousands of an inch much more easily than degrees.

Looking forward to your replies.
Cheers
Greg

 

[AndyDWA]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Escapement#mediaviewer/File:Graham_Escapement.svg
In this graphic, the RH pallet, the acute point, strikes on the tooth of the escape wheel as the pallet re-enters between the teeth. This stops the wheel. It only happens on a couple of teeth.

I'm far from an expert, but here's my understanding.

The pallets should never touch the back of the teeth. They do come very close, but shouldn't touch. If they touch some teeth every time - but not all teeth - that would suggest (I believe) the teeth which are contacting the other pallet are bent.

In the illustration, the pallet on the right of the image is the exit pallet and the pallet on the left is the entry pallet.

If the tip of the tooth touching the entry pallet was bent forward a tiny amount (toward the exit pallet), it would hold the wheel back a little, and the exit pallet would touch the opposing tooth. It's pretty easy to visualise with the illustration you linked.

If some teeth are touching, I expect the clock will be unreliable and stop with the slightest amount of interference as it surely must lose power.

Page 47 of the book has a chart of common problems with pallet locks and drops and the appropriate remedy.

You may also get some useful information in this recent thread where I was educated in pallet adjustments.

 

[Tinker Dwight]

Just remember that if setting the locks while manually
rotating the pendulum, there is a small amount of back
movement from the spring. It is important that when
running, the tooth doesn't land on the impulse face.
If so, it needs just a little more lock.
As for how much to have them out to start, they need to
be far enough that it doesn't let the escapement wheel
run free but not so far that it jams against the escapement wheel.
A good starting place would be to measure the distance you
have now and add the two together. Then divide that by two,
making them equal.
Tinker Dwight

 

[shutterbug]

I rarely find issues with the escapement of these. Raise the fork a little to stop the flutter, set the beat, be sure you have over swing, clean it up and give it a go.

 

[Nicko]

In this Hauck clock the anchor lever does point straight up, however it is offset from the centre of the anchor. To get the pallets to drop equally either side of the escape wheel the suspension fork's centre position is offset from centre by quite a large amount. Is this the way these clocks are intended to operate or is there and alternative solution?

Cheers Greg

 

[Tinker Dwight]

You'll need to measure how much it is off
center and balance it.
I don't recall seeing the pin being offset of the center
of the arbor. Maybe I just never noticed.
I just checked two of my clocks and none are like
that.
I wonder if the pin had been broken off and someone
drilled a new hole?
What is important is the angle the pin makes relative
to the fork when it swings to the ends. It should not
bind.
Tinker Dwight

 

[KurtinSA]

Seems like, within reason, this could be compensated by the fork on the spring...it will be offset too. But as long as the escapement is adjusted right, proper over swing, etc., I would think it might still work. Obviously, one can go overboard with being too far out as the anchor isn't working on the fork the same the farther away from center you get. Just my thoughts...

Kurt

 

[John Hubby]

In this Hauck clock the anchor lever does point straight up, however it is offset from the centre of the anchor. To get the pallets to drop equally either side of the escape wheel the suspension fork's centre position is offset from centre by quite a large amount. Is this the way these clocks are intended to operate or is there and alternative solution?

Cheers Greg

Greg, I've found a couple of clocks with this problem in the past, evidently a factory defect. This can be partially compensated for by setting up the suspension so the fork is positioned to the left far enough so that the anchor pin is vertical when the pendulum is at rest. However, this also gives a weaker impulse to that side and a stronger one as the fork swings to the right. It also make setting the beat more difficult.

My solution was to bend a small dogleg in the lower end of the anchor pin so that the upper part of the pin is vertical and centered on the centerline of the anchor arbor. I did this by first detempering the pin, heating to a red glow with a torch and letting it cool slowly. Then the first bend of about 15 degrees was made about 3mm above the anchor using two narrow flat blade pliers. The second bend was made 3 mm further up the anchor so that the long part of the pin would be vertical, centered and parallel as noted earlier. Some final small adjustment was needed but not at all difficult. When finished I again heated the pin and quenched it in oil. It may look unusual but the escapement will now work properly and there is still plenty of working length on the pin.

 

[Nicko]

The escapement does work with the fork off centre, but not well. The rightmost movement of the fork is straight up and the left movement is hard over.

John, can you remember if the lever is threaded in or pressed in. The lever is only just long enough in its straight up position so I may have to replace it somehow.

Thanks again
Greg

 

[Tinker Dwight]

Depending on how much length is left, it can be done
with a single bend, rather than zigzag.
You still have to anneal the rod, these are quite easily
broken. I don't know why they need to be so hardened.
Maybe so they polish well where the fork is. They need
to slide a little.
Anyway, you just bend it as high as you can without
being in the range of the fork adjustment. The amount
you need to bend is smaller the father out you go.
This minimizes the adjustment needed to the pallets.
The bend is so that the top end lines up with he anchors
arbor.
Tinker Dwight