Strike and time winding wheels: which way should the teeth point?

Discussion in 'Wood Movement Clocks' started by jboger, Feb 20, 2019.

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  1. jboger

    jboger Registered User

    Jan 7, 2019
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    I have a Terry-type movement that was running beautifully. I disassembled and put back together and now will only run strongly for a few minutes., then die. If I jiggle the time winding arbor a bit, the clock will start up again, then stop. Ditto for the other side: if I jiggle the strike winding arbor, the clock will start up, then stop. I don't want to take the movement apart (again) until I'm certain about one thing: which way should the winding wheel teeth point, in the direction the wheel turns, or the other way?

    So to be clear, the teeth on both the winding wheels (strike and time) do not point out radially from the center, but rather are slanted to one side, which I assume is to reduce rolling friction when these teeth engage the leaves of the adjoining pinion. Furthermore, the teeth point in opposite directions, which makes sense to me as these wheels unwind in opposite directions.

    Right now, I have the slant pointing in the direction the wheels unwind. Is that correct? I know I could reassemble once again by switching the wheels to see what happens, but surely wouldn't mind a definitive answer from someone on this forum.

    Thanks.
     
  2. gleber

    gleber Registered User

    Jun 15, 2015
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    Here is a photo of my movement assembled, but without the rear plate. The weight cords unwind from the bottom, so, the time wheel (on the left in this photo) rotates clockwise and the strike side rotates counter clockwise. To answer your question, the teeth point in the direction of their movement. It sounds like there is some other problem - odd that it would affect both sides the same way. Not that it helps now, but there is an old adage, if it ain't broke, don't fix it (sorry, I had to). For more practical advice, If jiggling the winding arbors starts each side, I would look for binding in that area.
    20160325_090204.jpg
    Surprisingly to me, this is my most awarded photo on www.viewbug.com (a photo contest site), beating out even this one.

    mirror.jpg

    Tom
     
  3. jboger

    jboger Registered User

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    I can work with that photo. It's been odd. I had the strike side working fine. The clock ran the full length of the weight drop. I did a repair to the strike wheel, and it ran nicely. But he two together have given me a problem. Your photo will remove at least one question, did I perchance have the winding wheels in backwards. Thanks.
     
  4. jboger

    jboger Registered User

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    Tom: Thanks again for that picture. A few days ago I reassembled just the time side of the movement. The clock ran beautifully for a few days, just as before. Then today I reassembled the entire clock. I used your picture, which was a great help. You of course know that there is a unique solution to how all the wheels go together, not just in order but in relative depth between the plates. I've always had to reinvent the wheel whenever I reassembled a clock. Your picture save me much time. So now the movement is ticking away merrily, but I've only put the weight on the time side, not the strike side. That is, I only have one weight on. In the past, my trouble began when I had both weights on. And even if I took the strike weight off, the time side would not run. Now I seem to have the time side running with the movement fully assembled--an advance. Tomorrow, if the clock continues to run, I will put the other weight on and see what happens.
     
  5. gleber

    gleber Registered User

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    #5 gleber, Feb 24, 2019
    Last edited: Feb 24, 2019
    First, I must point out that there is an error in the photo that I caught after I took it. The lower lever on the right side is below the arbor for S3. In that position, it can't be lifted far enough to release the strike and it would stop the minute arbor. It has to be positioned above S3. It should be in-between the two arbors where the upper lever is.

    Second, if adding the weights cause it to stop, my first thought is are the pillars tight in the plates? What I am wondering is whether the weights are distorting the movement and causing something to bind. If the pillars are loose enough that you can rack the movement, you will need to fix that.

    Good luck and let us know how it goes.

    Tom
     
  6. jboger

    jboger Registered User

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    Yes, I saw that. In any case, it stopped after running a short time. Doesn't like to run when fully assembled. The only interaction between the time and strike sides is that lever. This is black magic.
     
  7. gleber

    gleber Registered User

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    If you engage the strike by turning the minute hand does that work through all the hours?

    While it is discouraging, you have a place to focus, which is good. Start by looking at the movement when you add the weight and see if anything shifts. Hopefully you have it on a stand.

    Does it stop when the lifting arm on the arbor is near the lifting lever or at any time?

    Tom
     
  8. jboger

    jboger Registered User

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    Tom:

    Two days ago I gave the pendulum a push and it started up again and hasn't stopped. So why it stopped I do not know. The strike side runs quite strong now with the movement fully assembled (i.e. with the strike side in place). The problem now is the strike side. The lever lifts on the hour as it should to release the striking train, but the strike runs the weight all the way down. That is, the hammer keeps striking and the wheels keep turning. . Believe me, I had the strike side working at one time too, by itself, but I've never had both the strike and time running together. TI truly believe I have a reassembly problem somewhere and nothing fatalistically wrong with the movement.

    So the lever drops into the slot on the count wheel. I thought that would stop the weight from dropping because another lever (between the plates) drops into the so-called hoop wheel and should stop that wheel from turning. But it doesn't.

    John
     
  9. gleber

    gleber Registered User

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    The symptoms sound like the lever is not catching the cam or the count lever is not engaging the slot properly, but what about the stop pin? This is on the last wheel before the fly fan. It is what actually stops the train. It is probably out of sync with the count lever dropping in the slot and therefore doesn't get stopped. It's actually pretty ingenious, because that wheel has the least amount of torque. Farther down the train there is more torque, which would cause a stop pin on those wheels to slam into a lever if it was set up that way.

    Tom
     

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