- Nov 5, 2020
Larry, this doesn't look like a typical Sessions click. Not saying that it isn't. Can we see a picture of the entire main wheel, and also the complete movement. We need to know for sure whether the click spring was attached to the click and hooked under a "tab" on the main wheel, or it the click spring is attached to the main wheel and applies pressure to the the click in which case there is usually a groove in the edge of the click. In either case check carefully that the brass rivet holding click is not loose.
If the click spring was attached to the click (typical for Sessions) the first step is to remove the rivet and remove the click. You can then see how it was attached and will need to drive out the broke off remnant. A new click spring wire can usually be inserted and staked in place as the original was. It is generally recommended to replace brass click springs with steel. 0.018" music wire or pivot wire is good. Keep in mind that a steel click spring wire will be smaller in diameter than a brass wire for the same strength.
Thank you RC for the education on Click spring replacement/repair. Since I'm just a beginner with the basic hand tools it's probably best for me to go with the replacement option. I'll see what I can find on timesavers.OK, on the back of the wheel grind off any head of the rivet where it was peened. Support click and drive out the rivet and remove the click. Let us see the back side of the click. Probably has a groove into which the original wire was placed and staked on either side. The new wire goes in the same way. With these repairs, replacing the rivet is the main task. I prefer a steel shoulder rivet. If you have a lathe it is a simple matter to make a rivet. Click rivets are available from the suppliers such as www.timesavers.com but seldom fit properly. You have the option of replacing the entire click with a new one that comes with a spring and rivet.
Here is a picture of one of the generic clicks installed on a Sessions movement. Sort of ugly but pretty substantial. A lot of the replacement clicks are crap. Usually best to repair the original.
View attachment 634395
Ok Wow, I'll try and remove the click and see how the spring was originally attached. Sure appreciate the advise on repair.The click looks like it is still in good condition. Like RC said, the spring will need to be removed, the rivet removed, and a new click spring staked into the slot in the click. Using the old click spring will probably not work because it will be too short. Take the click off and let us see the other side where the slot is.
Oops, RC ad I posted at the same time.
I have found those wires to be of poor quality. They seem to be made from soft steel.I was able to tap out the broken off piece in the click without removing the click or drilling out the click post. The wire measures .030" or about 0.75mm so I think the Timesavers 10-pack of .035" diameter click spring wire may work.
Appreciate the offer and education very much but I've got to place an order with timesavers anyway, for some other things I need so I'll just get some spring wire that way. I do see a couple of teeth on the great wheel that have damage but just to the very tip of a couple of the teeth. I'll be careful to watch the meshing of the click with the great wheel teeth. Appreciate you noticing that and cautioning me about it.How about Google?
Search for piano wire or spring steel wire.
From your first photo, I may see a tooth or two of the ratchet wheel damaged or the point/s missing.
It is your thumb that is at risk with a failure.
PM me with your address and I will send you a few lengths of spring steel wire.
Ok thanks for the warning but since you haven't even inspected the wheel teeth yourself, and I have, you assuming I am going to get hurt is a bit of a stretch. This click is good and tight and the wheel teeth are in good reusable condition and only needs click spring replacement.Well, I guess you have been warned.
When that click assembly fails I hope you remember the good advice given as your hand bleeds and the end of your thumb continues to throb for weeks.
I had a mainspring break just all of a sudden while the movement was installed in a clock and had been running for days. Just out of the blue and it was quite a violent thing since the clock was sitting right next to me. So I'm aware of the dangers now and always have safety in the back of my mind when working around mainsprings.Based on the pictures along, I see nothing wrong with the click wheel or the click except the broken click spring. To do a proper repair of the spring the rivet will need to be replaced so its condition is not relevant at this point but a loose click rivet would spell disaster. The warnings about the consequences of a click failure however are very true and I am sure well intended to protect the "uninitiated". Many of us have been "initiated" into that club and now have a greater respect what can happen.
Would you mind looking at your past order with timesavers and let me know exactly what you ordered or maybe a link to the item on timesavers? Appreciate it. I was thinking I could first try and just insert the new wire with click still in place since I was able to use a tiny punch to push on and then pull out the broken off piece completely. The click is good and tight with the rivet and no slop.FWIW (I’m a novice as well), I just replaced a Sessions click, spring, and rivet. I used Sessions click kit from Timesavers & got 2 of all the parts.
It may be made in India, but the quality seemed ok. It was my first time doing it and it seems very secure - certainly way better than the one I took out. I’m pretty confident in it.
Would you mind looking at your past order with timesavers and let me know exactly what you ordered or maybe a link to the item on timesavers? Appreciate it. I was thinking I could first try and just insert the new wire with click still in place since I was able to use a tiny punch to push on and then pull out the broken off piece completely. The click is good and tight with the rivet and no slop.
Hello, Willie X, Is that you. You're back. I have missed your wonderful advice and comments. I hope you'll tell us of your adventures while you were away.I misread "a couple of teeth on the [great] wheel" for [click] wheel. Sorry
After taking a closer look at the photos. I think the mainwheel might be loose.
Yes, mainsprings can break on their own but it's pretty rare. Stretching the springs out and checking closely for cracks and rust will prevent this to some degree. There is a long list of things to check when you have the ole clock apart.
Hey RC, I’m in the same boat here, and since my click is in good shape, I’m leaning toward reusing it with a new spring, rather than replacing the whole assembly. I don’t really need a big roll of steel spring wire though, as I do this strictly as a hobby. Timesavers offers these click springs, but the description doesn’t specify whether they are brass or steel. I’d prefer steel, but I’m guessing they are probably brass. Have you ever used these, and if so, can you tell me about the material and/or quality? I see they are made in India, which doesn’t inspire a lot of confidence... Click Spring Wire -10 PackHere is the link to the Timesavers part: Timesavers I believe these come with straight brass rivets and brass click springs made in India. You have been warned. It can be difficult to set straight rivets (as opposed to shoulder rivets) and have the rivet be tight and still not bin the click.
Those are steel wire but the quality is poor and irregular with each spring.Hey RC, I’m in the same boat here, and since my click is in good shape, I’m leaning toward reusing it with a new spring, rather than replacing the whole assembly. I don’t really need a big roll of steel spring wire though, as I do this strictly as a hobby. Timesavers offers these click springs, but the description doesn’t specify whether they are brass or steel. I’d prefer steel, but I’m guessing they are probably brass. Have you ever used these, and if so, can you tell me about the material and/or quality? I see they are made in India, which doesn’t inspire a lot of confidence... Click Spring Wire -10 Pack
Thanks for the info on that, Dick. I’ve been spring-slapped a couple of times, and after the last time, when I had purple fingers for a couple of weeks, I decided a spring winder would be a good investment. I always read the entire thread with interest, but I’m choosy on whose advice I ultimately take. I’m not in favor of “smack downs” for relative newcomers offering advice, though. I have(with the intention of being helpful and sharing my experience)offered some less-than-sage advice here a few times myself. It’s all part of the learning/growing experience, and I think most people reading these things are smart enough to separate the wheat from the chaff.Those are steel wire but the quality is poor and irregular with each spring.
Regardless of why you repair clocks, it is important to have the click assembly work every time.
There has been much misinformation and poor assumptions stated about clicks/springs in this thread.
I would suggest you not take advice from people with little experience and limited knowledge.
The cost of a roll of quality spring wire will be less than 5% of the charges to stitch up one's hand after being injured.
This is from an E. Ingraham of my own and shows an unusual click failure. Made me a little paranoid at the time so I installed an extra click as a backup. Overkill? Several years later I notice that only one was clicking. I believe that some new Hermle movements are now coming with dual clicks.Thanks, RC! I’m building this one for my girlfriend, so I want to make sure it’s right! I’ll check locally, and if I don’t do any good there, I’ll order from McMasters.