Most visitors online was 4107 , on 14 Jan 2023
Thanks John..Openers worked great..Get yourself some paint can openers. I have 2 with a slight curve and 2 with more curve. They work great for removing stubborn chime disks and gathering pallets.
I have a Webster winder, just do not know how to contain the spring on the shaft and slide it into this type of barrel in order to get it hooked on the pin inside..A spring winder is best but they can be wound by hand.
I have an Ollie Baker which has sleeves to contain the spring. Do you have sleeves?I have a Webster winder, just do not know how to contain the spring on the shaft and slide it into this type of barrel in order to get it hooked on the pin inside..
Yes. I think I have it figured.. I'll it a go and let you know the results.. Thanks- JamesI have an Ollie Baker which has sleeves to contain the spring. Do you have sleeves?
Thought I had it figured however the barrel slides on the same as the sleeve..I have an Ollie Baker which has sleeves to contain the spring. Do you have sleeves?
As you have discovered, these springs that are in "spring boxes" (stationary brass cans and not true spring barrels) present a problem. The main gear is attached to the arbor and is in the way of the retainer sleeves. The usual solution is to make a temporary assembly arbor (with no gear) that is also long enough to accommodate the sleeve and fit your spring winder. Begin by removing the original arbor and gear assembly by turning it backward and pulling - it should release and come out. Then install the temporary arbor in the spring winder and slip the sleeve over it. "hook" the spring with the temporary arbor and wind it, then capture it in the sleeve. Reassembly is the reverse - wind the new spring on the temporary arbor and capture it, then put it in the spring box making sure to catch the anchor. Hold the spring box and wind the spring and remove the sleeve. Unwind and remove the temporary arbor and install the original arbor and gear. I find it easier to hold the spring box if both are left screwed to the bracket. Yes, these are a PITAThought I had it figured however the barrel slides on the same as the sleeve..![]()
Dick, Thanks for all the input.. I will do a though inspection as you suggested. I live in Vista, Ca. and there is a local chapter near me. The only problem is they meet on Saturday night at 7:00pm and I have another commitment at that time. Looks like RC has the solution with a temp arbor. Once again, thank you...JamesThe sleeve you use should be smaller outside diameter than the inside diameter of the barrel. If you are unsure, find the directions to your spring winder and study those. Because of all the energy stored in that wound spring, a mishap can cause injury. You are wearing leather gloves and eye protection when messing with springs, aren't you?
You may have additional problems beyond the broken/unhooked spring.
When springs release quickly, the shock force can and will bend the arbor on the second wheel and maybe the third. That shock can also bend or rip teeth off of the barrel, the second pinion, etc. Before reassembly of the movement, those all should be checked and proper repairs made.
Then comes the big news. At times, the spring failure is secondary damage. Secondary because of a click assembly failing. If you fix all of the other damage and not the click assembly, the click may release again causing the same problem that you just repaired.
Carefully inspect the click for a loose pivot rivet, a weak spring, or a damaged ratchet wheel and any distortion to the click itself. If you find one needs repair, it is well to remedy problems on both click assemblies. If failure was from use, it makes good sense that both springs have been wound the same number of times. Click assemblies must work every time over the lifespan of the clock movement.
For many reasons, a mentor would be a great help to you. Is there a possibility? Your profile does not say where you live. Maybe someone from this board or the NAWCC could help out.
My feeling is that you are into this project well beyond your capabilities.
Best Regards,
Dick
RC.. Thank you. That should do the trick.. The main problem I have is making a temp arbor.....JamesAs you have discovered, these springs that are in "spring boxes" (stationary brass cans and not true spring barrels) present a problem. The main gear is attached to the arbor and is in the way of the retainer sleeves. The usual solution is to make a temporary assembly arbor (with no gear) that is also long enough to accommodate the sleeve and fit your spring winder. Begin by removing the original arbor and gear assembly by turning it backward and pulling - it should release and come out. Then install the temporary arbor in the spring winder and slip the sleeve over it. "hook" the spring with the temporary arbor and wind it, then capture it in the sleeve. Reassembly is the reverse - wind the new spring on the temporary arbor and capture it, then put it in the spring box making sure to catch the anchor. Hold the spring box and wind the spring and remove the sleeve. Unwind and remove the temporary arbor and install the original arbor and gear. I find it easier to hold the spring box if both are left screwed to the bracket. Yes, these are a PITA
RC
RC, Friend of mine made a temporary arbor. Followed your instructions...All went well..Thank you, JamesAs you have discovered, these springs that are in "spring boxes" (stationary brass cans and not true spring barrels) present a problem. The main gear is attached to the arbor and is in the way of the retainer sleeves. The usual solution is to make a temporary assembly arbor (with no gear) that is also long enough to accommodate the sleeve and fit your spring winder. Begin by removing the original arbor and gear assembly by turning it backward and pulling - it should release and come out. Then install the temporary arbor in the spring winder and slip the sleeve over it. "hook" the spring with the temporary arbor and wind it, then capture it in the sleeve. Reassembly is the reverse - wind the new spring on the temporary arbor and capture it, then put it in the spring box making sure to catch the anchor. Hold the spring box and wind the spring and remove the sleeve. Unwind and remove the temporary arbor and install the original arbor and gear. I find it easier to hold the spring box if both are left screwed to the bracket. Yes, these are a PITA
RC
Dick, Just wanted to let you know that purchased "This Old Clock by David S Goodman" and it is great for a beginner like myself..Thank you very much for the suggestion.Yes, most gathering pallets are press fit on the arbor. Normally those can be pried off with two thick screw drivers or small pry bars. Be careful not to bend the arbor.
Why are you replacing the main springs?
Unless they are broken or cracked, there is seldom a reason to change main springs. The replacement springs will be of lesser quality than the ones you are taking out. Main springs are often thought to be a problem but most times are not. If the clock is not running full term, the real problem is likely low power due to friction due to wear. If you are dead set on replacing the springs, make sure you release and contain the energy before taking the pillar nuts off of the movement. If you do not, the movement parts will fly out like shrapnel. A danger to you and the clock parts.
Reassembly of a movement is much more difficult than taking one apart. If you have never done that before, it would be a good idea to study up. A good book is This Old Clock by David S Goodman which should be in your local library or for sale on eBay or Amazon.
Best of luck,
Dick
I tried to wind by hand, then had super strong hubby try to wind by hand. No joy. The problem is the barrel is too small, spring too strong. The "backwards" springs are a bear!I have a Webster winder, just do not know how to contain the spring on the shaft and slide it into this type of barrel in order to get it hooked on the pin inside..
works fine on the half hourIt is not lifting high enough for the rack to drop. What does it do on the half hour?
This is a little embarrassing, I just rechecked the half hour and it is not striking.. Does that alter your suggestion? Also, why does it lift high enough when I manually move the minute hand?The lowest tooth on the rack is keeping it from dropping. You will need to carefully bend either the lifting pin on the cam or bend the pin on the lever out away from the rack teeth until the rack drops on the hour.
In your video you made it drop with your hand, not by turning the hand on the arbor. It does drop when you turn the hand?This is a little embarrassing, I just rechecked the half hour and it is not striking.. Does that alter your suggestion? Also, why does it lift high enough when I manually move the minute hand?
Thanks
The video shows the minute hand past the strike point and it did not strike. Then I made it drop by hand.. I does drop when I turn the minute hand manually..In your video you made it drop with your hand, not by turning the hand on the arbor. It does drop when you turn the hand?
Okay, I'll give it a try and get back to you all...To me, it looks like your snail is way out of position and the rack tail is hitting the edge of the 12:00 shelf. Turn the hands around a few times until the snail is dropping at 10:00 or 11:00. That will show more. But my initial feeling is that you should reposition the snail so the rack tail hits the center of the 11:00 shelf (not the 12:00) That should make things better. However, it doesn't explain why it's dropping manually, because that should just duplicate the problem.
The strike is now okay. I re positioned the snail however the problem with the rack dropping is still a mystery. Sometimes the rack drops as it should. Also sometimes when minute hand is manually advanced the rack doesn't drop properly.The video shows the minute hand past the strike point and it did not strike. Then I made it drop by hand.. I does drop when I turn the minute hand manually..
Okay, I'll give it a try and get back to you all...
Thanks
James
Okay thanks, I'll give it a try and let you know..I think your gathering pallet needs to be turned about 1mm CCW. It appears to be stopping close to the rack teeth and that's probably stopping the rack from falling.
I moved the gathering pallet ..Looks like the rack hook come back before the rack has a chance to drop.Okay thanks, I'll give it a try and let you know..
Okay.. I'll get a pic and get back to you. Thank you..A pic of the rack and rack tail resting on the snail at 11:00 would help. That sounds like the problem area.
When you say the strike side "gets thrown off" what do you mean? Does it strike the wrong number of times?The clock has been running fine. However, after winding the strike side the strike gets thrown off. It does correct within a few hours but I would like to know why this occurs..I'd send photos but have no idea of what..
Thanks,
James
After winding at 10:00 ----- At 11:00 it struck 2 times, at 12:00 1 time, 1:00 1 time, 2:00 1 time, 3:00 2 times, 4:00 4 times,When you say the strike side "gets thrown off" what do you mean? Does it strike the wrong number of times?
It happens every time I wind it. I just completed a complete cleaning but will check it out. Also will get the picture you asked for regarding the 11:00 position.Sounds like your rack is sticking. It might have freed itself, but the problem might surface again. There could be several reasons, but likely the post and related tube need a good cleaning. No oil.