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Rusty Parts

ChrisCam

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Hi, so its time to put the cuckoo clock (now apparently sorted) back into its box. The clock though vintage has no real value so I stained the thing ebony which to be fair looks very nice. Only thing is I have this old pendulum which I can and will stain as the box but i need to in some way treat the rusty parts. I am not minded to buy a new pendulum. My initial thoughts, I have scraped most surface rust off and think hammerite would look ugly, so am looking for a coating that prevents further rust forming. could just use wax or oil or is there something that dries and will do the job.

rusty.jpg
 

mauleg

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I use a product called, "Amazing Tsuron Rust Buster", from Mission Laboratories in Los Angeles California, USA. It's a rust converter that has an acrylic component, so no top coat is needed. It seems, however, that it is not widely distributed, but I believe that RostFort is essentially the same; similar products should be available in your area. Once you apply the converter, it will change the metal to black and will dry quickly, leaving a tough coating behind. It dramatically reduces rusting, even in tropical marine environments. I recommend using a wire brush to remove all surface rust before treatment.
 

ChrisCam

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I use a product called, "Amazing Tsuron Rust Buster", from Mission Laboratories in Los Angeles California, USA. It's a rust converter that has an acrylic component, so no top coat is needed. It seems, however, that it is not widely distributed, but I believe that RostFort is essentially the same; similar products should be available in your area. Once you apply the converter, it will change the metal to black and will dry quickly, leaving a tough coating behind. It dramatically reduces rusting, even in tropical marine environments. I recommend using a wire brush to remove all surface rust before treatment.
Thanks Mauleg, we are of the same mind that a rust converter is the answer, then possibly a wipe over with bee's wx or (boiled) linseed oil for extra paranoia.
 

mauleg

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Thanks Mauleg, we are of the same mind that a rust converter is the answer, then possibly a wipe over with bee's wx or (boiled) linseed oil for extra paranoia.
If you want extra EXTRA paranoia, apply a coating of appliance-grade epoxy paint over the converter; that's how I keep major appliances looking new in the salt air...
 

ChrisCam

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If you want extra EXTRA paranoia, apply a coating of appliance-grade epoxy paint over the converter; that's how I keep major appliances looking new in the salt air...
You've gone too far! (lol)
 

THTanner

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This is the product I use for large parts that are not part of the movement. I think it is easier to find than the Tsuron - but also quite expensive.

I like the liquid much better than the spray version -but some prefer the spray
Pour a little into a dish and either submerge or brush it onto the part. Let it dry - do a second coat - then rinse with water and dry.
It also converts the rust into some sort of plastic / epoxy like compound.
Do not pour the liquid back into the container as it will contaminate the rest of the bottle.

Mar-Hyde 3513 | eBay
 

bruce linde

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i'm a big evaporust fan... dumping metal parts in for even an hour or two removes significant (if not all) rust. surfaces turn a dark gray that can be buffed off easily, wax or lacquer to prevent re-rusting.
 

THTanner

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Have you tried Evaporust?
I use Evaporust on all parts that are inside the clock. But I don't know how long it protects.

Marhyde on external case parts will derust and protect for many years. I have used it a long time on old cars and so far no sign of failure.
 

bruce linde

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I use Evaporust on all parts that are inside the clock. But I don't know how long it protects.
i don't think it's supposed to protect... it just does some chemical reaction magic to remove the rust.
 
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THTanner

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i don't think it's supposed to protect... it just does some chemical reaction magic to remove the rust.
Interesting chemistry too. There are two different chemical reactions involved. One takes the rusted iron off the metal and binds it to the first chemical. Then a second chemical in the solution removes that iron from that first chemical and restores it to work again. Which is why you never pour it out. I am not sure what happens to the iron and the second chemical, but eventually I suppose it gets saturated?
 

novicetimekeeper

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Chemically the choices are conversion coatings or selective chelation. Converting the surface to iron phosphate with phosphoric acid gives you a black protective coating. Selective chelation binds with and removes the ferric oxide.

Evaporust is in the latter camp, so, apparently, is black molasses. Something I think that is more available in the US than the UK.
 

Uhralt

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One issue is that the rusted parts are attached to the wooden pendulum. You wouldn't want to soak the wood with aqueous solutions. Maybe removing the rust with a Dremel wire wheel followed by coating with a lacquer is the most appropriate. Removing the rusted parts from the wood is awkward, especially the piece that is attached to the top of the pendulum rod.

Uhralt
 

novicetimekeeper

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can you not suspend the pendulum rod above the solution so that only the iron is immersed?
 

THTanner

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I think I would pull the parts and put them back on. It is not too difficult and on these if you have to move it just a bit to use fresh brad holes it does not make much difference.
The reason I would pull them is because the side you cannot see is probably just as rusty. To take off the visible rust and ignore the rest seems a bit strange.
A dremel wire brush on the edge of those pieces - in my hands - would chew up some of the wood. So that also affects my thinking about how I would approach this.
 

ChrisCam

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you can use renaissance wax to protect it.
well at the end of the day some bloody good advice and ideas here thank you. i ended up scraping of the rust then using a rust converter with a tiny pain brush. It for whatever reason dried ugly i.e not even, probably me so i wiped it. however rust gone metal looks fine / black in places where rust treated. Have just stained wood ebony and then will wax or oil metalwork. will look into renaissance wax as the name is compelling?
regards
Chris
 

Old Rivers

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i'm a big evaporust fan... dumping metal parts in for even an hour or two removes significant (if not all) rust. surfaces turn a dark gray that can be buffed off easily, wax or lacquer to prevent re-rusting.
Add me to the Evaporust fan club. An amazing product, works extremely well and is reasonably priced. Also it's reusable and environmentally safe.

Bill
 

bruce linde

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well at the end of the day some bloody good advice and ideas here thank you. i ended up scraping of the rust then using a rust converter with a tiny pain brush. It for whatever reason dried ugly i.e not even, probably me so i wiped it. however rust gone metal looks fine / black in places where rust treated. Have just stained wood ebony and then will wax or oil metalwork. will look into renaissance wax as the name is compelling?
regardsChris
I got some of the renaissance wax… It’s better on smooth surfaces… I don’t love it as much as I thought I would from the name! :)
 

bangster

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Not a very helpful response, nov. The link was particularly unhelpful since, fortunately, I am not a chemist.

Nevertheless, Google did produce quite a bit of information.

Tea does contain oxalic acid, but not much of it. But enough to produce the chelation effect: it converts non-soluble iron oxide into a soluble compound that can be flushed away with water. Contrary to certain beliefs, tea does not contain tannic acid, though it does contain tannins. Tannic acid mostly comes from oak bark. No information on how tannic acid would work to remove rust. Some talk of other organic acids --citric, acetic, etc. but nothing very interesting. The best acidic rust remover is phosphoric acid, the stuff in naval jelly. Also in Coca Cola. And apparently in molasses.

A more robust source of oxalic acid would be rhubarb leaves, though not always as readily available as tea. Oxalic acid has numerous industrial uses; but they don't get it from tea, they manufacture it with chemical magic. You could probably buy some, and whomp up a solution without wasting tea bags.

The tea method generally mentioned is quite simple. Brew up a batch of very strong tea--5 or 6 teabags per quart of water. Put it in a bucket or other container, and submerge the rusted object in it for 8-12 hours. Take it out and wipe it dry. I didn't learn whether this leaves a protective coating on the de-rusted steel. Or whether the tea can be re-used, or quickly wears out.

Anyhow, that's what I learned today. :)
 
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kinsler33

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I drove my tea-loving and very patient spouse Natalie nuts with my de-rusting experiments. The scientific result was that I now have a gallon of Evapo-rust on the shelf, and it works quite well.

But I would have removed the rusted parts from that pendulum. Those parts had Volkswagen-in-Cleveland-grade rust.

M Kinsler
 

novicetimekeeper

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Google is without doubt your best source, as I work in Physics not Chemistry.

Phosphoric acid is used for a conversion coating to Iron phosphate, it is a relatively stable surface preparation for another finish as it gives a mechanical key as well as preventing oxidation. ( I did work for a long time in the metal finishing Industry and also as a steel buyer)