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Retainers for suspension springs (?) What's it all about?

Betzel

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Dec 1, 2010
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Greetings.

I am repairing a "between the Wars" Junghans wall clock, which came with this contraption covering the cradle where the suspension spring "top" sits.

I suspect this thing slides on to retain the suspension spring in-situ during negative-G manuvers like so many clock owners might do after removing the pendulum and hook from the bottom pin - if they are good owners. My questions are: Are these standard items? Do they do anything else? Is the correct position with the pin facing out - as shown assembled?

Many thanks if you have an idea!

IMG_3641.JPG IMG_3640.JPG
 

Uhralt

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Sep 4, 2008
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I haven't seen these before and may be wrong, but it looks to me that it should slide all the way down the rod to secure the suspension spring in its holder.
the suspension spring seems to have a cross bar on top that fits into the cut-out of the holder rather than being secured with a tapered pin through a hole.

Uhralt
 

RJSoftware

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Looks like an old pen clip for securing a ball point pen to your shirt pocket. Sometimes people stick stuff on thinking it's gotta be a clock part.
 

disciple_dan

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the suspension spring seems to have a cross bar on top that fits into the cut-out of the holder rather than being secured with a tapered pin through a hole.
Yeah, that clip would prevent the entire suspension system from coming out if you are just trying to take the pendulum off. Original or not it's a good idea. Danny
 

Betzel

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Okay, thanks.

It is not pinned, just a v-slot, so this holds everything in place. The clock is around 1930 (give or take) so maybe it has been a good idea for some time if you do not pin the top? Seems like it would go on the other way, but it does not. Maybe a replacement stolen from another clock?

Works well enough as-is. Maybe it's a finger-handle, like a pin in a grenade?

I'll let it be...
 

chimeclockfan

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Dec 21, 2006
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This is how some of the Junghans movements were made during the 1930's. They have that little brass collet which slips over the suspension spring, retaining it instead of the more common tapered pin. I just repaired a Junghans (HAC brand) wall clock with the same collet:

DSCN1599.JPG
 
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Betzel

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Must be original then :)

Nice escapement there. And, I hope it sounds as cool as it looks!
 

chimeclockfan

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The Junghans/HAC clocks weren't the finest out there (compare: the splendid Vedette) but they're solid, good quality, problems can be worked with, and they keep good time. I like these Junghans/HAC clocks very much and it's been a joy not to just research them but also to fix some of them up. The clocks that were taken good care of tend to age better... clocks left in barns or that fell off walls suffer more problems to fix.

It is a grand sounding clock, sounds just like Lourdes cathedral tolling out the hours. This one plays Ave Maria on the hour and strikes the quarters. It belongs to Salsagev and will be documented in more detail after I tune the new rods for my Trinity chime wall clock:

 
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Betzel

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Very nice even at this stage. And I like the version. A duo from Poland recently gave a performance of every version of Ave Maria out there. So many to choose from.

Agreed these clocks were like my Volkswagen Passat. Not the best, but comfortable, reliable and affordable enough to get you where you're going in enough style with no back pain to have a little pride. I shall look up the Vedette. So much to learn...

I think we all wander off topic in fabulous ways, and look forward to your completion post.
 
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Betzel

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I can start another thread if it's preferred, but thought I would just piggy-back to this one, now that the movement is ready to go. Because the original is missing, I will need to find a new suspension spring.

I see this Junghans suspension post is notched to accept a spring which is pinned at the top, permitting a "drop-in" with centering by gravity in an orientation perpendicular to the swing, as shown by chimeclockfan. My guess would be that the original used a straight pin for this purpose, rather than a taper, but this might be less important than I am imagining? Can't quite see the detail on the repair done by chimeclockfan in the image above.

I also understand from another thread that the "ideal" flex-point" for the spring to bend would be at (about) the anchor pivot center-line. But, I believe close enough is probably okay?

Finally, the leader hooks up and on to a second pin the same manner, to what I would think would be a second small, straight pin. If true, this would make the spring "double-pinned," and therefore rather hard to find. Also, difficult to find one with the distance between pins just right to get the bend at the arbor, about 11mm down from the post, so maybe 22mm between pins/holes. I can make a straight pin for the top, or use a taper if it is commonly accepted practice.

What do you all think: Look for one with two pins, or make a second pin?
 

Willie X

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Feb 9, 2008
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You're overthinking this. :)

Any spring that's similar to the old one will work just fine. The important thing is that the crutch pin (or fork) is free to move about on the leader. There can be no binding at this point.

Willie X
 
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Betzel

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Thanks, Willie.

Since I don't have the old one, I got to thinking about all of it. Too much!
 

Willie X

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Nothing wrong with that! I usually have the opposite problem. :rolleyes:

I've see little clips like that but yours seems to be way to long. I think they were used to keep the little cross pin in place. This is totally unnecessary; I would remove it and leave it in the bottom of your case.

You can get a very close reading on the required pin to hole distance by simply holding the leader, with the crutch pin (or fork) centered while carefully measuring the pin to hole distance where the suspension spring goes.

Something like Merritt's #P-21.3, #P-21.4 or #P21.5 will probably do it.

Good luck, Willie X
 
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