Request for Rockford Serial Numbers from 1-255,000 ( now expanded to 500,001)

[Greg Frauenhoff]

Oh!
Well then, I'd like to retract my former panic attack, but if you are open to up to #500,000 then I have like 70-80 to add, so I'll have to get to work.
I'll try and at least get a list of numbers together asap.
The "Our Own" labeled ones that I have, that I posted previously-
#274246
#274294
#276920
#329840
#406405
All of them except #406405 appear to have been 14 jewel. Presuming there was an impulse jewel and jeweled fork, if not, 11J , I guess. Basically what you see is what you get, except for the center wheel. There's no center jewel in the pillar plate.
#406405 is a whole different beast. No center jeweling at all, and only jewels for the balance in the pillar plate. 3rd, 4th, escape wheel and fork are just pivot holes in the pillar plate. No jewels.

View attachment 640859

Neat collection. I have one "Our Own" somewhere. Regarding the jewel count, with one upper center jewel but no lower one the count should be 16 not 14.

 

[Greg Frauenhoff]

Just on another note for those interested, I have been crunching some numbers on production of the Company and how it fits with newspaper & periodical reports of the day. It is glaringly obvious that some of the reports are so far over the top on daily production numbers that they are bordering on farcical. Also some of the reports on the amount of hands employed by the Company appear to be grossly exaggerated by some of these periodicals as well. I just wonder how much influence the Company Management had regarding some of the content in these reports; maybe a lot, just to keep the Company in a good-light for Shareholders?

I can't speak directly to any exaggeration by Rockford of their production, but I did do a detail comparison of Aurora's production based on daily rates reported in period periodicals and that expected from surviving mvts. The results were quite close. It's important to consider that a reported daily production might be that of a particular peak and not that for any extended period of time. Also, one needs to establish when the factory was operating or not. Aurora certainly had a number of shut downs/slow downs and Rockford did as well.

Any way, a crude back of the envelope calculation for Rockford's average daily production from 1876 to 1892 (17 years (beginning about 1893 production declined considerably), assuming 5 1/2 works days per week, no significant shut downs except for a 2 week annual vacation and a total production of about 450,000 mvts during this period) is around 96 mvts per day.

Some of the period reports of output are 100 per day in Dec. 1885, 90 per day in Jan. 1886, 100 per day in Oct. 1889 and 120 per day in Sept. 1888. Reports of the number of employees (which should correlate reasonably well with daily output) are 205 in Dec. 1885, 250 in Apr. 1887, 260 in May 1887, 290 in Sept. 1888, 360 in Mar. 1892.

Rockford reported 290 employees with a production of 120 mvts per day in Sept. 1888. Interestingly, Aurora, at its peak, achieved a similar output with roughly the same number of employees.

 

[Bila]

Thanks Greg, I have seen and have a copy of a news report from the day that 188,000 movements were produced in one year, 1888, that is better than 650 a day, probably should have read 18,000 for that year which is approximately 63 a day. Another where they supposedly did 40,000 movements in 7 months, we are talking about better than 235 a day, every day. Going on preliminary number crunching a good number of the period reports in relation to production totals are just plain wrong. As for the hands employed some of these are a bit out there in the reports, I have some that say 400, 500 hands, even in 1893 as the down-turn came they still were talking 360 hands but one of the Factory records I have show less then 100 employed

The end figure you give for daily production and averaging that is not far off depending on which contemporary view is taken in regard to when and what number they finished at (also, a block or two missing as well were it appeared no production occurred). On our preliminary number crunching it appears that the highest ever average yearly output they achieved was in the vicinity of only 150 per day and that only happened once

 

[Bila]

I also meant to mention above that I came across an article that talks about a dedicated news office at the Factory, this is one of the reasons I mentioned about any influence by Management in one of my previous posts

 

[S.Humphrey]

Can you upload a shot of the dial side of these please, thank you

Pictures for you, front and back.
Hopefully they are going to post up in order.

 

[S.Humphrey]

#254871

 

[Bila]

Thanks for the pics, as Greg said peviously the "Our Own" movements are 16 Jewel, the serial #254871 is an interesting one, looks like some budding hobbyist/watch-repairer has been having a play

 

[34Ford5W]

SN 8,903 18S 15J HC gilt, KW, KS

SN 8,906 18S 15J HC gilt, KW, KS

 

[Bila]

SN 8,903 18S 15J HC gilt, KW, KS

SN 8,906 18S 15J HC gilt, KW, KS

Thank you, can you tell me if those two have a "C" engraved on the barrel-bridge or marked with the jewel count at all, as we are recording these details as well, some photos of the movements would even be better if possible, Cheers

 

[Rick Hufnagel]

81301 is a keywinder with one case screw and 15 jewels. Well.... 15 broken jewels

 

[Bila]

Cheers Rick, you wouldn't happen to have a picture of the barrel-bridge by any chance mate?

 

[Rick Hufnagel]

Sure thing, sorry. Forgot I had this one, it's still torn apart from when I found all the broken jewels, lol. Here you go.

 

[Bila]

Thanks Rick, just needed that Town & State as we have been recording those P/L's as we go

 

[S.Humphrey]

#12678
Grade "A"

 

[S.Humphrey]

#8677
Grade "B"

 

[S.Humphrey]

#9043
Grade "C"

 

[Ethan Lipsig]

#329,067: 18-size, 15j adj. model 8, grade 84 movement in heavy 14k multi-colored gold case with 1/2 carat diamond, probably made by Keller & Untemeyer. D/S WED Roman numeral dial. Blued steel spade & whip hands. 54mm in diameter, cased. 152 grams gross weight.

 

[34Ford5W]

Thank you, can you tell me if those two have a "C" engraved on the barrel-bridge or marked with the jewel count at all, as we are recording these details as well, some photos of the movements would even be better if possible, Cheers

 

[Bila]

Thank you 34Ford5W

 

[Nigel Harrison]

3140

 

[Nigel Harrison]

5084

 

[Nigel Harrison]

80

 

[Bila]

Great to see the images Nigel, thank you.

 

[Bila]

#329,067: 18-size, 15j adj. model 8, grade 84 movement in heavy 14k multi-colored gold case with 1/2 carat diamond, probably made by Keller & Untemeyer. D/S WED Roman numeral dial. Blued steel spade & whip hands. 54mm in diameter, cased. 152 grams gross weight.

Thanks Ethan.

 

[Bila]

#12678
Grade "A"

#8677
Grade "B"

#9043
Grade "C"

A nice collection and thanks for uploading the images

 

[Jerry Treiman]

Here are several more movements -

18-size #303195, 387541 & 406220


16-size #382,008, 382419 & 386743


6-size #394184

 

[Bila]

Excellent Jerry, thank you, just wondering if you would have any under dial shots at all of those?

 

[Jerry Treiman]

Excellent Jerry, thank you, just wondering if you would have any under dial shots at all of those?

Here are the ones I have already in my photo file. I can pull dials and can shoot others if needed.
303195, 382419 & 406220

 

[Bila]

Here are the ones I have already in my photo file. I can pull dials and can shoot others if needed.

Thanks very much Jerry, if you have time to do the others that would be appreciated, cheers.

 

[Bila]

That gilt model 8 Jerry has an interesting lever arrangement to what you normally would see.

 

[Jerry Treiman]

The camera is already set up, so no time like the present -

382008, 386743, 387541 & 394184

 

[Bila]

Thanks Jerry, that sorts out the confusion I had with that setting mechanism, I had mixed up the photos

 

[StanJS]

Since you asked for serial numbers up to 500,000...

You've seen all these before. Here is a Model 8, 18s, 15J, HC, Grade 79, S/N 270932, 200 made.

 

[StanJS]

Here is a Model 7, 18s, 15J, OF, Grade 87, S/N 359203, 5500 made.

 

[StanJS]

Here is a Model 1, 16s, 15J, HC, Grade 101, S/N 376534, 2300 made.

 

[StanJS]

Here is a Model 7, 18s, 15J, OF, Grade 76, S/N 389004, 500 made.

 

[StanJS]

Here is a Model 8, 18s, 9J, HC, Grade 93, S/N 413266, 19,000 made.

 

[Jerry Treiman]

For all of you Rockford fans, Darrah Artzner is giving a talk on 18-size Rockfords this afternoon -

https://mb.nawcc.org/threads/horological-happenings-in-the-nw-march-7-2021.177334/

 

[S.Humphrey]

Just realized I have #372680 sitting around here waiting for some love, too.

 

[viclip]

Here's my Rockford SN 292,424 M7 Gr67.

It's an 18s lever set, stem winder (with 11j according to the PWDB site).

 

[Rick Hufnagel]

Thanks for the link. Great presentation Darrah, thank you.

 

[Bila]

Since you asked for serial numbers up to 500,000...

You've seen all these before. Here is a Model 8, 18s, 15J, HC, Grade 79, S/N 270932, 200 made.

Here is a Model 7, 18s, 15J, OF, Grade 87, S/N 359203, 5500 made

Here is a Model 1, 16s, 15J, HC, Grade 101, S/N 376534, 2300 made.

Here is a Model 7, 18s, 15J, OF, Grade 76, S/N 389004, 500 made.

Here is a Model 8, 18s, 9J, HC, Grade 93, S/N 413266, 19,000 made.

A nice bunch of Rockford's, just gotta love those Tu-Tones

 

[Bila]

Just realized I have #372680 sitting around here waiting for some love, too.

Here's my Rockford SN 292,424 M7 Gr67.

Cheers, thanks for the pics and numbers

 

[S.Humphrey]

#277039
D. F. Sullivan, Club Watch.

 

[Bila]

#277039
D. F. Sullivan, Club Watch.

Cheers!

 

[vintageguy]

Bila, I have a small sub-collection of 16s Model 1:

356851


360544


383374


384404


386946

 

[Bila]

Bila, I have a small sub-collection of 16s Model 1:

Thank You.

 

[Lee Passarella]

Here are the last of my Rockfords that fill the bill. Including one that went beyond the mark, Bila. I thought you asked for up to 550,000. Anyway, we have 330239, 432680, and 438214.

 

[Bila]

Thanks Lee.

 

[CZHACK]

Hi All,

I have one to contribute, #28662. According to the pocket watch database, a 9J gilt movement in a hunter case. Nice clean movement in an attractive coin silver case.

View attachment 588368 View attachment 588369 View attachment 588371

Nice movement and case. I particularly like the case and eagle. Do you have info on the case? How is it marked? Weight? Date? I have two cases with very similar eagle on hunter covers and only marked "Warranted Coin Silver" and number marks (6 and 9 ounce cases). Thanks Mike