Post Your Gustav Becker Clocks Here

Discussion in 'General Clock Discussions' started by Mike306p/Ansoniaman, Jul 5, 2006.

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  1. John Hubby

    John Hubby Principal Administrator
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    Dennis, thanks for posting your GB Grand Sonnerie Vienna that was made at the GB Braunau, Bohemia factory about April-May 1906 based on the movement serial number. Pleased to see you have found a supplier for the missing pediment and lower finials, that will certainly give you a complete and well made example. For info, the GB 3-weight grand sonnerie models were only made commercially in the Braunau factory, which had its own set of serial numbers beginning in early 1888 when the factory opened. These numbers, if used for dating from the Karl Kochmann numbers that were for the Freiburg factory, will indicate manufacture from 18 to 25 years earlier than the actual date, and to say the least that causes a lot of confusion. I have posted the actual dating info for both the Freiburg and Braunau factories in THIS POST for everyone's info and personal use.

    Your movement is different from the standard grand sonnerie in that it has booster springs mounted on an extension of both the quarter and hour strike winding arbors. This evidently was added to compensate for insufficient weight to drive the quarter and hour strike trains on some clocks. The earliest known example used a movement made in 1890, however it appears this was retrofitted in 1903 prior to introduction of production versions that year. Then, the next examples appear in 1906 and each year afterward through 1912. It is curious why only a relative few clocks were made with this addition, when an obvious solution would be to increase the amount of weight needed to operate the clocks. I have not been able to access enough of these to find out whether GB did increase the weight size on most of their grand sonnerie clocks, since the very large majority do not have these springs. For info they also added a spring on the strike train of some of the 2-weight bim-bam striking models.

    I will merge this thread with the main "Post Your Gustav Becker Clocks Here" thread so we won't have any confusion where to go for GB clock info.
     
  2. John Hubby

    John Hubby Principal Administrator
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    Piotr, this is the first time also I have seen this stamp. The movement serial number shows it was made at the beginning of 1888, one of the first movements with only the GB Freiburg circle logo. I have only one other movement in my data with earlier serial number, 653566 made end 1887 but with only the GB Freiburg logo, it is a 2-train time & strike clock spring driven. It appears your movement is spring drive also, is that correct?

    It may be that GB tried to represent this as a quality movement, but for some reason did not continue with the stamp. At least, I've not seen any others made after this one.
     
  3. NTimken

    NTimken Registered User
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    I have always wanted to own a Becker Grand Sonnerie, but they have been out of price range. Yours is exquisite. Enjoy it in good health!
     
  4. Piotr

    Piotr New Member

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    Hello,
    A few months ago I bought GB movement. You helped me with this movement. You find its name, born date, etc. It is GB "Mignon" movement Westminster Chime clock. I have designed and built the new case for this movement. I have also designed and made the new hands of the clock. Currently the clock works correct and the chime sounds beautiful. This is the first clock restored by me. I am looking for next movement.

    IMG_20181216_125326.jpg IMG_20181216_125454.jpg
     
  5. Isaac

    Isaac Registered User

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    That's a beautiful case you made for it. Very nice job!
     
  6. Martin Vance

    Martin Vance Registered User

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    Hi. I have attached photos of a Gustav Becker spring-driven wall clock I have recently purchased. The door and glass were in pieces but the movement seems fine with the exception of the suspension spring.

    I have refit the door but I so far haven’t been able to find a matching suspension spring. If I can’t, I wonder if I can find one close in size and cut or grind it to match? The closest matches I have found are two, #47 from Timesavers and Urgos #301 from Rowell Clock. Neither have the bottoms sloped back like my Becker suspension spring. Does anyone have experience with either finding or modifying a suspension spring?

    I’m also curious about the date. The back plate of the movement has information but I am not confident about interpreting it.

    Merry Christmas
    Martin

    79DEBD63-B022-4C89-8E64-04A727B44C77.jpeg 2F5ABB7F-9DD0-4DA2-89C7-1390FB8C7987.jpeg 33713535-F7EE-4DD7-BA93-D7D88E2C73DA.jpeg
     
  7. Sergio Vasquez

    Sergio Vasquez Registered User

    Oct 21, 2018
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    Hi Martin

    I'm not an expert, but I bought at Timesavers #38 suspension spring. They sold it as for Gustav Becker clocks. In my case this is the size my clock has.

    Regarding the date, your clock has a serial number that can identify when was built. As I know the clock that have a serial number were built at Braunau. The seal can reveal a period of years when was built.

    Let's wait to the expert that can review this information and guide you in the exactly suspension spring fits to your clock.

    Sergio
     
  8. KurtinSA

    KurtinSA Registered User
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    The DRP number appears to be granted in 1906 as indicated in this post:

    Gustav Becker Pendulum Leader

    If I see the serial number correctly, the clock was built in Freiburg in the first third of 1920.

    Kurt
     
  9. John Hubby

    John Hubby Principal Administrator
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    Kurt has provided the correct date for this Bim-Bam striking spring driven movement. The patent is for a silent rack strike design that was patented in 1906 as Kurt has also noted and used continuously from 1906 to 1920. Of interest is that this patent was applied to a number of movement designs including this spring driven bin-bam design, also to spring and weight driven time and strike movements, hall clock movements, etc.

    Regarding the suspension spring, the shape of the lower block is not critical, it can be rectangular and still work properly. The main characteristics are for the spring to be the correct overall length and not too strong.
     
  10. Tatyana

    Tatyana Registered User

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    Hi all!

    I'm going back to the topic Post Your Gustav Becker Clocks Here
    I want to share another combination of GB and Kienzle. Here again all parts of the clock except the movement belong to GB; movement Kienzle again without a stigma.

    a24bIMG_0559.jpg 06eeIMG_0560.jpg 3fc0IMG_1084.jpg 41feIMG_0585.jpg 5576IMG_0561.jpg ec97IMG_1087.jpg

    My understanding of statistics is that these four clocks represent at least 2-4 thousand wall clocks sold in this combination.
    Another interesting fact - all these clocks found me on the territory of Russia. In other countries such combination has not been delivered?

    BR, Tatyana
     
  11. John Hubby

    John Hubby Principal Administrator
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    Tatayana, very interesting indeed. I don't recall seeing this in clocks found in other countries than Russia, however I also have not found any of these in my own searches so I don't have any basis for saying where they would have been sold. Do you have an estimate of the time (years) in which these four you have found would have been made?
     
  12. Sergio Vasquez

    Sergio Vasquez Registered User

    Oct 21, 2018
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    Hi Tatyana

    I have a similar situation with my clock (that is in my avatar). The movement, watch dial and bells system are Gustav Becker, but not the the wood case. I found in the web the same model in Germany and the USA built with different woods. A model arrive to Chile where my grandfather bought it the first quarter of 20th century. This is an example that this model wasn't unique for one country.

    At the moment I haven't found any information where the wood case was built. The case hasn't any sign that can help me on this.

    Regards,

    Sergio
     
  13. Tatyana

    Tatyana Registered User

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    John thanks for Your reply!

    Most movements Kienzle (patent 147023) look like this:
    • the pendulum stops are located below,
    • the length of the pendulum is indicated only by numbers.

    нижние_ограничители.jpg

    About 15% of movements
    • the pendulum stops above,
    • the length of the pendulum is indicated with the addition "cm".
    Therefore, I assume the manufacturing date of these movements 1912/13 +.
    These movements were often used late signature Kienzle

    мех_тыл_.jpg

    If the patent number is not written on such movements, then the movement is made 1914+.

    без_патента.jpg

    As a rule, the case design of these сlocks is late art Nouveau.

    I assume the date of manufacture of "GB-Kienzle" clocks with Dom-Gong during the WWI.

    BR, Tatyana

    P.S. Very rarely there are movements made before the official start of the patent until 1904.
    They have a difference in design in the place of fastening of the hammer.

    Patent.jpg Patent angemeldet.jpg
     
  14. Tatyana

    Tatyana Registered User

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    Hi Sergio!

    I will assume that your case could have been made in Chile. Given the huge distance that separates Germany and Chile, it looks economically viable.

    BR, Tatyana
     
  15. c_bach@bellsouth.net

    c_bach@bellsouth.net Registered User
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    My first Gustav! Nothing fancy, just liked how it looked and wanted to see what a Gustav looked like in person. Can anybody date the clock?

    IMG_0871.JPG IMG_0874.JPG IMG_0873.JPG
     
  16. KurtinSA

    KurtinSA Registered User
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    Welcome to the message board, c_bach! You've got yourself a nice old one for sure. The serial number should date this to the middle of 1894:

    Post Your Gustav Becker Clocks Here

    Kurt
     
  17. czerralf

    czerralf Registered User

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    Hi, I have found a nice Gustav Becker clock, unfortunately incomplete. Rare stamp from 1898, which was probably only used for 2 years. One of the more rare signatures used by GB. I am showing this clock as a curiosity. Take note at unusual way the mechanism is hung on the clock case. Decorative clock dial and pendulum.

    IMG_20181228_223512498.jpg IMG_20181228_223522612.jpg IMG_20181228_223534569.jpg IMG_20181228_223549042.jpg IMG_20181228_223723388.jpg IMG_20181228_223943416.jpg
     
  18. Sergio Vasquez

    Sergio Vasquez Registered User

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    Hi Tatyana

    This is a very good point and sounds viable. I thought it at the beginning because it is a very rare case, not found frequently in the web. But I disagree.

    Surfing in the web, I found pictures with identical wood cases in the US and Germany. There are 2 Freischwinger in Germany, that have the same case in the upper part as well.

    It is hard to believe that someone imported to Chile original GB movement, dial and bell system and the plans to build exactly the wooden box with all it details in Chile. My theory is that a company included in the VFU built the wood cases in different woods.

    Anyway it is an interesting challenge try to discover if it was built in Chile.

    I'm including some pics of the models found in the US, Germany and the Freischwingers.

    Regards,

    Sergio

    GB2 (1).jpg GB3 (1).jpg GB5 (1) 1915.jpg GB6 (1) 1913.jpg GBF1 (1) (1909 - 1933).jpg GBF2 (2).jpg GBF3 (1) 1900.jpg
     
  19. Jim Andrews

    Jim Andrews Registered User
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    Everyone,

    I have only 4 German/Austrian clocks in my herd and would like a little info on them if possible. Two are unmarked two weights, so there's not much to say about them. The other two are a Lenzkirch single weight that I'll post on that thread and a single weight Becker. I got the Becker on Ebay last year and did a little restoration work on him, glue and clamp etc. It seems that I researched what I could from the serial number and came up with a circa 1870 date of mfg. I'd like to present it to the learned sources here for their review and identification please. Thanks

    GB left.JPG GB Right.JPG GB serial.JPG GB Serial 2.JPG
     
  20. KurtinSA

    KurtinSA Registered User
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    According to John Hubby's notes, the serial number for Freiburg dates to about May 1866. His listing of logos suggests this logo was used from 1867 to 1879. So that seems to makes sense with general dating.

    Kurt
     
  21. Jim Andrews

    Jim Andrews Registered User
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    Thanks KurtinSA
     
  22. gintarasb64

    gintarasb64 Registered User

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  23. slim766

    slim766 Registered User

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    After many years of wanting a GB clock I finally broke down a got one. If I am dating it correctly it was made sometime in 1876. The seller assured me the clock was all original, but on a clock this old who really knows. Anyway, I really like the clock and just wanted to share it with all of you.

    Have a great night,

    Kris



    20190119_172008.jpg 20190119_172000.jpg 20190119_171955.jpg 20190107_183005.jpg
     
  24. rgmt79

    rgmt79 Registered User
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    Very nice Kris, beautiful case and I like the separate seconds dial, or is it a calendar? How did you acquire this clock and from where?

    Richard
     
  25. slim766

    slim766 Registered User

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    Thanks Richard. I purchased the clock from a seller on Ebay over in Germany. What looks like a seconds hand actually completes a rotation in 45 seconds. I believe this is by design as I have seen it on a few other clocks. If anyone has further info on the second hand I would be interested in hearing about it.

    Kris
     
  26. KurtinSA

    KurtinSA Registered User
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    A bit of discussion on why 60=45 in this thread:

    GB math 60=45

    Kurt
     
  27. John Hubby

    John Hubby Principal Administrator
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    Kris, thanks for posting! Your clock was made at the Freiburg, Silesia factory about mid-1876 as you have found already. The movement serial number. appears to be 117943, please confirm the actual number if this is not correct. Very nice example!!
     
  28. slim766

    slim766 Registered User

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    Kurt, thanks for the link. It was interesting reading.

    Kris
     
  29. slim766

    slim766 Registered User

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    John, thanks for your response. You are correct on the serial number.

    Kris
     
  30. czerralf

    czerralf Registered User

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    #2980 czerralf, Jan 24, 2019
    Last edited: Jan 24, 2019
    Hi Kris, this was a very good purchase, in my opinion one of the nicest and better made GB clocks. These clocks were different from item to item, often differing in small details. It is a very pretty clock and it truly looks original. Check out mine, it is very similar to yours, although a little older.

    IMG_20190124_184434638.jpg IMG_20190124_184444994.jpg IMG_20190124_184451379.jpg
     
  31. czerralf

    czerralf Registered User

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    #2981 czerralf, Jan 24, 2019
    Last edited: Jan 24, 2019
    Another item in my collection, a bit later model from around 1880-1885.

    IMG_20190124_184312082.jpg

    Few more interesting GB clocks:
    View attachment 514337
    IMG_20190124_184632449.jpg IMG_20190124_184740141.jpg

    One of my oldest GBs: Number under 50000. It need renovation, and the upper-middle finial is broken. Rest is original. Take notice at the lower finials which are very small and were used only in older models. Dials are controversial, but I made the minute one by my own. Hourly one was there when i bought it but i am not sure about its originality. could change it but i'd rather leave the clock in the condition i bought it in.

    IMG_20190124_191631010.jpg IMG_20190124_191649621.jpg IMG_20190124_191709501.jpg IMG_20190124_192622819.jpg IMG_20190124_192633462.jpg
     
  32. Koshky

    Koshky Registered User

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    Hi, Kris! Hi, Czerralf!
    A friend of mine in Moscow has a similar clock. But it's movement is not made by GB. There are some reasons to say the clock all original.
    We try identificate by whom it was made on Russian watchs forum, but stil there is no result.
    Sapose somebody here to help us?

    Ups... What does it mean: "You can not upload attachments. You do not have enough posts yet"
     
  33. Koshky

    Koshky Registered User

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    Let's try again...

    image.jpeg image.jpeg image.jpeg
     
  34. Koshky

    Koshky Registered User

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    ... and movement..

    BF1A70A0-6AE7-45D8-827A-CEACBBABB8B1.jpeg AC6B6A83-6D83-4204-A356-70A51A535E9A.jpeg
     
  35. Koshky

    Koshky Registered User

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    I have got another one (it’s mine) in really fine condition.
    I think the upper-middle finial is not original.

    13061A31-BCE1-43F5-A962-DC7A09FC1DAF.jpeg
     
  36. czerralf

    czerralf Registered User

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    #2986 czerralf, Jan 27, 2019
    Last edited: Jan 27, 2019
    Hi Koshky, from what I can see, this looks like a German movement, most likely Endler. You'd have to check the exact model yourself. These cases were used by a couple of makers, as I wrote earlier they only differed in small details. Movements were similar as well. Hre's an example of two old mechanisms, Becker and Endler from early production years. Notice that the signatures were similar. Endler's signature with anchor is uncommon. Regards.

    IMG_20190127_215117406.jpg IMG_20190127_215715549.jpg IMG_20190127_215654691.jpg
     
  37. Koshky

    Koshky Registered User

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    Hi, Czerralf.
    Thanks for your reply.
    We have considered the version of Endler on Russian forum. But there are some differents in details say that it’s not Endler. For example: counting wheel in Endler movement is on the main axis.
    I had got an Endler watch and had an opportunity to compare. It’s very similar but different in details.
    Somebody of Freiburg makers across the street.
     
  38. chimeclockfan

    chimeclockfan Registered User
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    While this isn't my clock, it just has to be shared given how obscure this thing is. The clock belongs to a Vietnamese collector, involved in their active regional clock trade.

    It's a variation of the VFU/Gustav Becker HW No. 14 movement, playing the Westminster chime on a set of chords. The Tran book does illustrate this movement but this is the first time I've ever run across any example in a collection. I do not know how long this movement was made but I am guessing production numbers were low.



    20150321_133627.jpg
     
  39. brian fisher

    brian fisher Registered User

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    that one is indeed an oddball. I had to listen to it twice. I'm certainly no expert in chime tunes, but it sounds to me like the notes are in the wrong order?
     
  40. chimeclockfan

    chimeclockfan Registered User
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    It's the strangest attempt at any company changing up the Westminster chime. The notes are right when compared to the catalog's music score but it make such a sound... acoustics all over the place. Though the rest of the clock isn't shown it would not be any different from the typical German hall clock of the period. Despite being such an oddity I can appreciate GB's attempt at changing the otherwise-common Westminster chime. You don't see this kind of innovation with the newer clocks.
     
  41. twl1066

    twl1066 Registered User
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    I am re-posting from 'Your Newest Acquisition':
    Hello, I am new to the forum and jumped in heavily with many clocks, looking for my mid-life crisis hobby and future retirement activity. I enjoy reading through the postings and seeing the unique clocks and the wealth of information provided by the community.
    I found the following Gustav Becker floor clock, but it is missing the coil gong. The movement was rebuilt and is currently ticking away. I was told a US Serviceman brought back many clocks in the early 1960's, which were sold and gifted to family and friends. This clock was sitting, the movement sitting loose probably since then. The case has been re-finished (primed and repainted a lighter brown). The glass is the cabinet appears original and the movement has a art-deco style that was very appealing to me.
    The movement has a serial pointing to the early 1900's.
    I am looking for help to confirm its age and identify gong information. I would like to obtain the actual gong that could have been in it. However, a period specific would be good as well.
    Thanks in advance for your assistance!
    -Tim

    20190125_00000.jpg 20190210_213442.jpg 20190210_213511.jpg 20190210_213530.jpg 20190210_213548.jpg 20190210_213643.jpg
     
  42. franz2t

    franz2t New Member

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    Hi,

    could anyone help me identify better my Gustav Becker clock? Any comment will be very welcome. Thank you very much!

    20190221_192745.jpg 20190221_192757.jpg 20190221_192802.jpg 20190221_192829.jpg
     
  43. steamer471

    steamer471 Registered User
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    I recently picked this one up at our local antique barn. Very dirty but I saw the GB logo and snapped it up. Got it home and was a little disappointed in the quality of the case. The wire over the glass is barely installed and the wood seems like pine. The logo on the movement dates it between 1909-1926 and has no lantern pinions. Possible war clock? The rear plate looks different from the wheels in the picture but might be due to something sprayed on it. Only my second GB. Any info greatly appreciated.

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  44. KurtinSA

    KurtinSA Registered User
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    From John's notes, this appears to be the Amerikaner movement, made with solid cut pinions. I haven't seen what the lone "P" stands for, but the other P42 is the pendulum length is centimeters. Not sure if the date of manufacturer can be narrowed down further from what you have shown. As for the case, this is likely a "box clock" in which the movement was fitted to a case much later in life.

    Kurt
     
  45. NTimken

    NTimken Registered User
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    John could narrow this down, by the fact that it is marked "Silesia" and does not have the Gold Medal marking, which I believe came later. The leaded glass is a nice feature.
     
  46. steamer471

    steamer471 Registered User
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    Thanks guys. i did not know what an "Amerikaner" movement was till now and searched the site here. Learn something new everyday. This case has spacers on the side to make the movement fit so it may be a transplant. I like the no lantern pinion part of it.
     
  47. Estefania

    Estefania New Member

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    Hi! can you help dating and any information you have about this clock?
    bEIXXeSWNZdGkYH5u7J34ITcNmFlfuWBd1Kdyjg164vA2HqLrSrIH3qmX8imRaXoZxEuI1H6yn2eqjUyX8I=w370-h657-no.jpg 03WWUSgYJX19_y60CklIidlQcUGYJX1Chw3i3FqVf1D4P2W2CHMn9feWSMg-BcokJp6Xc1elmhSpGNIDgM=w1168-h657-no.jpg EB-bHPOgb34ollPtqIG3Qo3msBRBgBMq2u-5ZkXBjNkf4YfQUApi825HIjMpkkLEC-JpFEmidpbWxjUThn_=w370-h657-no.jpg
     
  48. KurtinSA

    KurtinSA Registered User
    NAWCC Member

    Nov 24, 2014
    3,087
    88
    48
    Aerospace Engineer (Ret.)
    San Antonio, TX
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    Welcome to the message board! From the logo that is on the back plate, it appears that the clock dates to 1910 plus or minus a couple of years. I don't see a long serial number, so can only use the logo.

    Does the clock run? I'm totally familiar with all of the cases, but I'm wondering if it's missing some finials on the top and/or bottom. Are there any holes indicating something might be missing?

    Kurt
     
  49. Royce

    Royce Registered User

    Oct 8, 2018
    48
    7
    8
    Male
    Retired
    Houston
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    Just picked up my first GB today from an estate sale for $40. They indicate it doesn't work but I know the strike side works but haven't really looked at the time side. I've attached pictures. No serial number on back plate.
    #1 - Dial
    #2 - Movement - GB Trademark with Silesia beneath - Left Side shows a P over the P 48 pendulum length
    #3 - GB Trademark
    #4 - P over the P 48 pendulum length
    #5 - doesn't show up well - the number 207013 is scribed on the top right side - no idea what this is.
    #6 - Case. Missing head piece
    #7 - Gloria gong
    #8 - gong, movement mounting bracket & side opening with wood inserts
    Based on the Trademark info in this MB, it appears to be manufactured between 1906 - 1925.

    Any additional information would be most appreciated. I haven't been able to find another GB with this case, but I have limited resources and haven't look very long since I just go it.
    Thanks, Royce

    Gustav Becker - 1.JPG Gustav Becker - 2.jpg Gustav Becker - 3.jpg Gustav Becker - 4.jpg Gustav Becker - 5.jpg Gustav Becker - 6.JPG Gustav Becker - 7.JPG Gustav Becker - 8.JPG
     
    Dave T likes this.
  50. macaw

    macaw Registered User
    NAWCC Member

    Jul 23, 2014
    626
    8
    18
    Minnesota
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    P3040021.JPG P3040019.JPG P2190099.JPG This is one of 8 I recently picked from it's long time storage
     

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