Separate names with a comma.
Discussion in 'General Clock Discussions' started by Mike306p/Ansoniaman, Jul 5, 2006.
John, this is the balance stopping device.
Thanks John and Piotr for the information! Much appreciated!!
Hello everyone! I'm attempting to find more information on my Mother-in-law's Gustav Becker clock. We are currently in the process of moving so unfortunately I wasn't able to take a picture of the clock fully assembled. This thread has helped me identify a production date range of 1877-1925 based on the logos but I'm hoping members here can shed some more light on the details of this piece.
In 1919 it was given to the family by a neighbor in Dresden Germany who had used it for some time. My mother-in-law believes it's pre-1900 (she thinks ~1890?)
Serial number (22XXXXX?) is here:
Looks like "2231776"
That serial number is probably January 1912.
Wow, that's great, thanks! Is each number of the serial number representative of something or is there another way you determined the date?
John Hubby is the expert on Gustav Becker clocks. His post here:
Post Your Gustav Becker Clocks Here
is where most information about dating these clocks can be found.
Some photos of progress. The clock is running very strong. But I need to make the case for it. This is a two Jewels clock. The balance wheel pivot holes are jeweled. When I make the case, I will post the photo of it.
Christopher, welcome to the NAWCC Message Board! Thanks for posting your inquiry and the photos of your GB grandfather clock.
As Kurt has already mentioned it was made about January 1912 based on the serial number of the movement. The DRP 171659 stamp refers to a patented "silent rack strike" mechanism for which the patent was granted April 15, 1906 and used continuously by GB on several movement designs until it finally expired in 1922. The "Harfen Gong" (Harp Gong) was patented in 1911 so your clock is one of the earlier ones to have that feature, with four gong rods and a side-striking hammer design.
I notice the movement is vary clean and evidently had been recently serviced. Also the dial and case are in excellent condition and have obviously been well cared for over the years since your family has owned the clock. This clock should give many more years of service and enjoyment to your family.
Hello John! As if i m an owner of GB Hall clock now, i would like to know when they were made. There is no mention of it in catalog 1912 and i don t know is there in the world anotner catalogs of GB. Not the best photos of my clock, but i think informative.
Fialko, welcome to the NAWCC Message Board! Thanks for your inquiry and the photos of your GB Hall clock. Based on the serial number of the movement, it was made in December 1911. This was shortly after the "Harfen-Gong" with the clock was patented so it is one of the early clocks with that feature.
I have not found a similar case in the 1909, 1911, or 1924 catalogs either, so we don't know what model is the clock. Even so, the very elegant Art Nouveau design dial is a distinct feature of the clock, and it appears to have a mahogany case which would be quite attractive.
John, thank you so much! But how could you explain the absenсe of information about this clock in 1912 catalog? Why is there not mentioned all the items?
Fialko, what I have found is that each sale catalog only contains the "most popular" items for sale at the time of publication. GB had hundreds of models and variations for each type of clock, and many of the designs were only published perhaps once or twice. Unfortunately even though they obviously published at least one catalog for almost every year since the mid-1880's until the 1930s, very few have survived and as of this time I have found only 10. These are 1909/10, 1911 (two editions, one French and one Italian), 1912, 1913 parts catalog, 1924, 1926, 1928 Italian, 1932 and 1937 (this last one actually a Junghans catalog).
Your clock is actually more typical of designs of the early 1920s than pre-WWI, however GB had some models that were made for at least 20 years so it isn't all that unusual to find the same clock case made both before and after WWI for example.
John thank you for the detailed response and despite thе fact that the catalogs did not survive GB clocks are still alive! I ve heared that you are writing a book about GB clocks history, is this true? And when we will be able to read it? Thanks
Here are some pictures of a GB longcase I have in for service. Can anyone give any information about the movement or its age?
The clock was made during the early part of 1932, the last year that Gustav Becker produced clocks before being totally taken over by Junghans.
Nice looking movement...I suspect the chimes are very nice.
Fialko, a year ago I thought I was about a year away from publication. Unfortunately due to personal situation it's still about a year away at best. I'll post an update from time to time.
Luke, thanks very much for posting the photos of this GB dual chime Westminster-Whittington movement. Kurt gave its correct age based on the serial number. A little tweak on the history however, is that Junghans completely took over GB in May 1930, but continued operation of the GB Freiburg factory with GB ex-employees until the end of 1932 when it was closed and all operations moved to Junghans headquarters in Schramberg.
This was movement model No. HWW as seen here:
This movement was first seen about August 1922.
Do you have photos of the case? Will be interesting to see what this one called home.
Hello Kurt & John,
Thank you both for your information, it's great to have that detail for the owner. I'll try to get a photo of the case when I return the movement.
A friend asked to get information about a GB clock. It has a logo, but no serial number. It does have the P-48 for the pendulum length. The case is 33" X 12" X 61/2". It does have the Harfen-Gong. It is not running, but I believe a good disassembly, cleaning and adjusting will do wonders. Any information about the years it could have been produced and anything of interest would be appreciated. Here are the pictures.
Hi all, first time poster, what a fascinating website and discussion area you all have here!
Back in the early 1970s my parents bought a grandfather clock. For a couple of years before I went off to college, it sat just outside my bedroom door and embedded it's two-tone chime deep into my subconscious as a pleasant memory. I moved on, time has moved on, and this past weekend I took a road trip to sort through my father's belongings in preparation for his transition to a nursing home. Now almost 45 years later that clock is again sitting just outside my bedroom, chiming away once more. It still works perfectly and keeps good time.
I've done some internet homework, found this discussion group and discovered this clock is a Gustav Becker. I'm not sure where any serial number would be, or if I could see it without disassembly. So...anybody know what model / year this is (I'm guessing the late 1920s)? Any maintenance suggestions? Thanks!
Here it is:
JB, thanks for posting. I've provided info about the possible age of this clock in the Clock Repair forum, will post again here for info.
I said there:
This information is still good, however after seeing detailed photos of the case of your clock I think it was more likely made before WWI. There are similar design cases in the 1912 GB sale catalog that aren't shown in the 1924 catalog, and the style and construction are more typical of pre-WWI clocks. That would place it being made between say 1913 and 1916; GB stopped production of this type of clock except for certain military wall clocks from about mid 1916 to the end of 1918.
Also, I need to explain that the letter "H" I mention in the quote stands for "Hohltreiben" which is German for Lantern Pinions. Prior to May 1925 GB had two grades of movement, this one which has lantern pinions and the "SILESIA" grade that had solid cut pinions. The GB logo for the SILESIA grade had that word stamped just below the GB anchor logo.
Ricky, welcome to the NAWCC Message Board! Thanks for your inquiry and for posting the photos of your GB grandfather clock. I agree it is likely from the 1920s based on the case design. There should be a serial number on the movement from which we can give you the exact year it was made. That will be at the bottom center of the movement back plate and you might be able to see it using a mirror and flashlight. If made before May 1925 the number will be seven digits, if made after that date it will be from 1 to 4 digits. Actually removing the movement isn't all that difficult, just remove the pendulum and weights, then slide the movement toward you from the case. There may be thumbscrews holding the board that supports the movement in the slotted wood mounts at each side of the case; you will need to loosen those if present. Putting it back is just the reverse.
You have what is called a "Bim-Bam" striking movement, which strikes twice to mark the hours and half-hour. You may have what is called a 3/4 striking movement that marks the quarter hours, however your description indicates it only strikes hour and half-hour. Let us know and also if you can obtain the serial number that would be perfect.
If your clock hasn't been serviced in several years, it would be worthwhile to find a repair person to clean and lubricate the movement so it will continue to run for many more years without problems.
Bim-bam is an excellent description of this clock's tone. It only strikes on the half-hour and hour, not 15 minutes before or after the hour.
Who needs mirrors and flashlights when one can stick a cellphone up in there and take a selfie? The result is a little blurry, but definitely "112". There's also some kind of other (alpha?)numerical marking done by hand in one corner of the plate... "?7-90", maybe "67-90"?
Great idea!! Will do that myself next time I need to capture what's on the back. The alpha/numeric item scratched into the plate is most likely a repair date or repairer's mark, the "90" probably being 1990.
The 112 is the pendulum length, looks like there is a "P" just before the number which would be correct. IF there is a serial number, it will be directly below the P112 right next to the board the movement sits on, a small area now hidden behind the board. I'm going to guess it will be a 3 or 4 digit number.
Even better than jamming a cellphone into dark corners is putting a borescope in there. We have one of these where I work, I'll bring it home tonight and have a better (and hopefully more focused) look.
Amazon Best Sellers: Best Borescopes
Well, I very systematically scanned the entire backplate surface with the borescope, concentrating on the area below the "P112" marking that was hidden in the previous pix I posted. All I found were better-focused versions of the photos I previously posted and no additional date code number. Maybe it's on some other surface? I looked where I could on the other side and on the front plate and found nothing. Maybe the origin year on this clock is just going to remain a mystery....
Ricky, thanks for the extra effort. IMO there is no question the "PE 7 90" is a service date of July 1990. From what little I can see of the movement and gong it appears to be a GB original, however it could also be a Junghans or HAU movement that is stamped with a GB logo. I will have to see the entire movement to be able to tell for certain what you have.
Here's the reason there is a question:
After the GB Freiburg factory was closed at the end of 1932 Junghans continued sale of the remaining inventory of completed GB clocks. They also assembled incomplete movements, cases, etc. for as long as they had GB parts stocks available, and they also made parts for some movements as needed. How long this lasted depended on the stock when Freiburg was closed. In the instance of clocks such as yours this continued from the beginning of 1933 to about mid-1935. When all the leftovers were used up they continued selling the same models but substituted Junghans (or sometimes HAU) movements stamped with the GB logo and on the dials. Now IF it was either a GB or Junghans movement there is no serial number but they did stamp a manufacturing date on the back plates, such as "33-11" indicating being finished on November 1933. IF it was a HAU movement, no date stamps were used to the best of my knowledge, so to really know what you have we would need to see the complete movement and also a good photo of the gong mounting base to see if there are any markings there.
There are other side stories that go with this, including that most if not all the assembly work after the Freiburg factory closed was done at what had been the GB Braunau factory. Too long to go into now but will post more about that at another opportunity.
Back to the cellphone camera. The mechanism photos are taken from the left side of the mechanism as you face the clock, with the cellphone jammed in beside the "9" on the clock face. The door only opens 90 degrees, which precludes taking equivalent pictures on the right side.
Just recently (?) google books published "Official Catalogue of the New-York Exhibition of the Industry of All Nations. 1853"
Among German producers is Gustav Becker from Freiburg, Baden (Freiburg in Breisgau?), offering 8 day clocks. Baden is probably mistake. Was this first visit of Gustav Becker from Freiburg in Schlesien in America?
Official Catalogue of the New-York Exhibition of the Industry of All Nations. 1853
Unexpected GB acquired at Hamburg flee market about a week ago - no visible losses (except for one winding hole grommet). For data base. 1900?
Yes, likely November 1900.
Nick, thanks for posting your absolutely gorgeous GB clock! Kurt has provided the correct date about November 1900, and as best I can see you have a completely original clock. Where did you find the catalog image? I have not found anything made this early from any catalog I have access to.
The pendulum crutch on your clock was an original design by Germania Regulatorfabrik, for which they were granted DGMS 103274 protection about 1 November 1898. The original design had a beat adjusting lever mounted on the pendulum rod, and the crutch had the folded over and slotted oval at the bottom end where the pin from that lever fit to operate the clock. Yours is the second design that has the same basic crutch design but with the beat setting device part of the pendulum hanger. This design first appeared on Gustav Becker clocks made from December 1898 but with the same DGMS number as was found on the "not much earlier" Germania clocks. Also this design added the trapezoidal shaped pendulum hanger clasp that had been patented earlier by Willmann (1890) that was transferred or licensed to GB near the beginning of 1898.
The case of your clock is a very classic and especially elegant design, with a flavor of the Baroque styles that were popular around the turn of the century.
Kurt and John, thank you so very much for the details!
As for the image, I have discovered it in 1912 catalog compiled by Any400Day owner (Victor Tang?) on the page 343. You should have overlooked it.
One customer brought in two Gustav Becker clocks. One a 400 day and this..
This movement is a GB Amerikaner design made in March 1926 . . note the "c 26" stamped at the upper right corner of the front plate. It should have solid cut pinions on all the gears, as there is no "H" stamp that would indicate lantern pinions. I'm still deciphering what the "K" stands for. Can we see the whole movement please so it will show whether it is time & strike or possibly bim-bam strike. Also photos of the case, dial, gong, and hands if you have those in the shop with the movement.
I'm not at work today but I'll look through the photos I have taken. The gong is attached to the clock as well as the case. The gong is elaborate as other GB gongs are. So yes it is striking a single gong. I will attempt more photos on Monday. Thaks for explaining the markings. It is a mantel clock which also has a window so as to see the pendulum swing.
Clock Gustav Becker catalog model 4017 (1912).
The movement is very similar to Kienzle, the length of the pendulum is 48.
Kienzle was of length ..., 34, 43, 45, 46, 54, ...
Could this be the product of cooperation of Kienzle and GB during the WWI.
Oops. forgot the hands.. and the pendulum. The hands are in the envelope leaning on the case. The pendulum is likely laying on the bottom of the case.
Gustav Becker Mantel or shelf clock Serial 2233424 with the Freiburg and Medaille D'Or stamps. P18 and another P on the back plate. 1912 I think from other posts. Very dirty and the pendulum hanger is missing. Perhaps I can fabricate a replacement. I have seen a couple of versions of the hanger in other posts. It appears to have a deadbeat escapement although I haven't split the plates yet. The flies are very elaborate with springs and weights incorporated.
Still forgot the hands and pendulum but was bushing it today. Someone seems to have replaced a banking pin with one in a different position. Roughly done as well. I'll look at fixing that while I have it apart.
hi everyone just want to know the meaning of gewidmet-von-den
1.4.1926, engraved at the front of the gustav becker clock... thanks
Vin I think it translates as "Dedicated to friends of the town department" . I believe you have misread "arteilung" it should be read as "abteilung". I any case you should wait for a German speaker to confirm the translation.
john this is moe schmidt. did you get my pictures in the Gustav Becker thread. nov 14. i finished the clock and it is running very good and the case looks good now. the movement did not come in this case. had to move the gone over 1 inch to get the becker hammer to strike the gone. this clock has never ran after some one tried to work on it. they lost the pen. leader and some other parts. put all the parts back together that were broken on the case and cleaned it. on the movement i order some missing parts and a 4 inch penulum leader ,not becker, had to make some parts. cleaned and oiled the movement. the plate is marked P 48 centimeters. the penulum has to be 14.75 for the clock to run on time...using P 48 the pen. length came out 18.86 inch. the pen. bob had to be raised about 2 inches. this did not look good. i installed the 4 inch leader and the total length was 18 inches which is 45.7 cenimeters, now the clock keeps good time. is this normal? here is some pictures. moe
John, finally, I converted an octagon flower pot to this Gustav Becker marine clock case. I need to make a back panel to finish the project. I appreciate so many members landing helping hands. Without the helps, I could not have gone so far.
Something like; devoted to my comrades in the department/division of the stadium?