Post two (or more) related items including non-horological items (one must be an American PW)

[musicguy]

Please post two (or more) related items that includes at least one non-horological
item (one must be an American PW)

I like all things about pocket watches, but I also like how they
relate to other things we may collect. In this thread (if it's successful)
people can show both horological and non-horological items
that relate in some way even if it's a stretch. You can be creative.
It could be a PW with a clock, ephemera that goes with a watch etc.
or just something that has a common link with your watch, but one must be a
PW. It can't be two pocket watches.


I'll start with a simple one. I found this 18 size Plattsburgh, NY Private label a
while back, and it has been a favorite of mine. A few years later while looking at some other
watches, I saw (and bought) this Boss advertising promotional Jewelers
Card from the same Jeweler. It was nice to find.
Funny, the card has the City's name spelled correctly
and the dial (and movement) spelling are incorrect, they are missing the "h" on the end of Plattsburgh.

Front: Card circa 1880's

Back:
This Private Label movement is from a run of Elgin Grade 77 B.W. Raymond's circa 1889.

Rob

 

[Dave Coatsworth]

OK, I'll go... (Great idea, Rob!) When I found my first J. W. Coatsworth (Galena, Ill.) private label in 2008, I set up a permanent eBay search for "Coatsworth Galena". Since that time, I have found seven more watches. Some came from eBay and others came from people who stumbled across the online article that I wrote (https://www.nawcc-ch190.com/newsletters/ChronoTimesNovember2008.pdf) and contacted me about purchasing a watch that they had. But, that eBay search has also revealed other items sold by the three generations of Coatsworths who operated that jewelry store from 1854 to 1903. The photo below shows some of these items. Most common are tourist china items featuring the "Old Grant Home", which is located in Galena. But I have also found several silver and silver plated items sold through the store. Finally, I have found two clocks with J. Coatsworth & Sons (the first generation) labels attached.

 

[Jerry Treiman]

The Lehigh Valley Railroad was a major coal carrier and they named their premier train the Black Diamond Express. One of the highest grades of coal is the anthracite variety that they transported. Here is a piece of anthracite coal that I picked up in Pennsylvania next to a private-label Waltham with an E in a diamond shield. My brother, Larry, whose watch this is, is a railroad enthusiast and he believes this was honoring or commemorating the Black Diamond train.

 

[Rick Hufnagel]

This is fun, good idea. I had this photo handy so will start with this

I paired these two together recently with the idea that they were probably both sold strapped to cards or displays in a hardware store. They are around the same age I believe. The Ingraham Autocrat and a Hammer Brand Toothpick.


We all know what dollar watches are, but there is a similar breed of inexpensive everyman's knife as well. Thin stamped metal, imitation bolsters or "shell construction", celluloid covers.... This Hammer Brand knife was made by Imperial. The celluloid has held up pretty well on this one. Just like a celluloid watch crystal, the celluloid covers or scales on these knives will shrink and offgas causing large gaps or even damaging the steel.


I really enjoy this inexpensive knife as well as the Autocrat

 

[Ethan Lipsig]

Here is a pair:

Non-Horological Item: Roscoe C. McCulloch's badge to the 1913 American National Jewelers Association Convention in Chicago.

Horological Item: Roscoe C. McCulloch's watch, given to him by the Illinois Watch Co. in 1921 in recognition of his service to the American National Retail Jewelers Association as its lawyer, according to his grandson, from whom I bought both the watch and the badge. Roscoe C. McCulloch was quite a distinguished fellow. Among other things he was a U.S. congressman for six years, a position he left to become a U.S. senator.

The watch Illinois gave to Senator's McColloch is also a distinguished one: An "all" aluminum 12-size Grade 525, one of only 50 ever made, and one of three known to survive. It weighs 29.6 grams, cased. In contrast, a nearly identical looking 14k Illinois Grade 438 (another 12-size) in my collection weighs 52.7 grams cased.

 

[luvsthetick]

Rob,

Sounds like a fun thread. Anxious to see what people have to show.

Here is a Columbus PL I have and a picture of yard art at the entrance to the Logemann home.

 

[Ethan Lipsig]

Here is a Columbus PL I have and a picture of yard art at the entrance to the Logemann home.

What's the connection between these?

 

[darrahg]

Joseph Wathier of Chicago sold many watch brands and jewelry including several Rockford models. Shown here is Wathier's 18s Rockford mdl8 g80 17J Adjusted "Wathier Special Railway Chronometer". The company sold at least models 6, 7, and 8 with two tone patterns.



some ads:

some cards:

 

[luvsthetick]

What's the connection between these?

George Logemann elected to advertise his jewelery business along the driveway to his residence.

 

[noelekal]

Teen-ers

Top: 1915 Waltham Crescent Street with wind indicator with a 1916 Colt Model 1903 .32 ACP.

Bottom: 1918 Hamilton 992 with a 1917 Smity & Wesson Model 1903 .32 S&W Long.

 

[Shawn Moulder]

Here is an 18k gold Waltham 1s that has a private label dial and case for the jewelry firm Bailey, Banks and Biddle. To go along with the watch here is a 14k fraternity ring made by Bailey, Banks and Biddle. I wish the mark was more visible on the ring, but if one sees the mark BB&B on antique gold jewelry it's a good chance it came from this firm.

 

[Shawn Moulder]

Here is another set of related items I have.The trio is composed of two watches retailed by the Hayden Wheeler jewelry firm and a stickpin also by them. The Waltham is housed in a Dubois watch case for Hayden Wheeler while the Elgin is housed in a case just marked for Hayden Wheeler. The stickpin also carries the Hayden Wheeler mark but was most likely made by a different firm.

 

[1908]

Wow, fantastic thread. Great idea Rob.

Stephen

 

[Greg Frauenhoff]

This is stretching things a bit , but here goes.

Rockford for F. J. Hooper , Aspen, Colo.:

Hopper moved to Cripple Creek a few years later and there are private label mvts known for him from there (e. g. Hamilton and Hampden).

And in nearby (to Cripple Creek) Victor, Colo., Lesher circulated his famous "so-called" dollars:

 

[Bryan Eyring]

The Lehigh Valley Railroad was a major coal carrier and they named their premier train the Black Diamond Express. One of the highest grades of coal is the anthracite variety that they transported. Here is a piece of anthracite coal that I picked up in Pennsylvania next to a private-label Waltham with an E in a diamond shield. My brother, Larry, whose watch this is, is a railroad enthusiast and he believes this was honoring or commemorating the Black Diamond train.
View attachment 751066 View attachment 751069

Is that a Bunn Special case?!?

 

[MrRoundel]

I'd like to include these two in the same image, but the 10s AT&Co. is still apart as I wrestle with its various issues. The image is its last known image being whole. Without a case, of course, as I found it.

One day, about 5 or 6 years ago, I was doing an internet search for watch cases made by a particular firm called, "N.G. Wood & Sons". They are not very common. The firm did, however, apparently make quite a few silver and pewter awards pieces. For reasons obvious to the likes of us, the name on a particular simple awards cup rang a bell. The 1901 dated award was presented to a young right fielder on the youth baseball team at a rather exclusive college preparatory school in the east called Groton Academy. The name, which was not mentioned in the ad, is C.L. Appleton. I ended up buying it with the feeling that there was a Waltham connection.

As it turns out, young mister Appleton was a grandson of Daniel Fuller Appleton of Robbins and Appleton notoriety. Those who study the American Waltham Watch Co.'s early years, will know that Robbins and Appleton was important to the growth and development of the American Watch Co. At least that's how this non-historian-like watch enthusiast, understands it. Most certainly the "Appleton" name on AWCo. watches was in honor of Daniel Appleton.

Charles Lanier Appleton lead a rather interesting and, sadly, brief existence. One of his claims to fame was that he was apparently a rather well loved and respected army Major who commanded the 367th regiment of African American infantryman, i.e. Buffalo regiment, in WWI. Tragically, after surviving the war, he died at age 35 of pneumonia, which I believe precipitated from some sort of surgery he underwent.

After reading about the young man, and knowing a bit about the American Watch Co. and Waltham watches, I feel quite honored to possess his Groton baseball trophy from 1901. And who doesn't love Appleton Tracy & Co. grade Walthams? A particularly appropriate, "Salud".

Edit: I should note that N.G. Wood & Sons did not make the case I was thinking of. It was made by Depollier and marked and sold by N.G. Wood & Sons.

 

[musicguy]

Most certainly the "Appleton" name on AWCo. watches was in honor of Daniel Appleton.

It was Daniels older brother James who is that Appleton of Appleton Tracy not Daniel
James was also connected to Waltham and Robbins.





Rob

 

[musicguy]

Sing Sing, NY was a town on the Hudson river(just north of New York City) where
the famous prison is located. "As the prison became notorious, the village
tried to distance itself from the prison's harsh reputation and changed its name to
Ossining on March 25, 1901."

Here are a few artifacts from pre 1901 when the Town was still called Sing Sing.
When I was a kid I dug up these vintage glass bottles in the woods
near our house. Much more recently, I found this watch from Sing Sing, NY.
I really thought it was cool to have items from a town that no longer exists
with that name.

The funny thing is that these old looking bottles are about the
same age as the Watch.

Rob

 

[MrRoundel]

It was Daniels older brother James who is that Appleton of Appleton Tracy not Daniel
James was also connected to Waltham and Robbins.
Rob

Like I said, I'm no historian. And as such, I should know better than ever using the word, "certainly". However, I see that there was a James, aka General James Appleton, but he was said to be the father of Daniel Fuller Appleton. I saw no mention of General James being involved with Robbins and Appleton. Here's an excerpt that I base my feelings on:

"Young and full of entrepreneurial promise, Daniel worked for watch importer Royal E. Robbins, which later became the firm of Robbins & Appleton. In 1857, the firm bought the watch works at Waltham, Massachusetts, and for more than 50 years led America in manufacturing clocks and watches. Daniel became the first Appleton to derive the largest sources of his income from his industrial career, rather than from the farm."

This came from a history that I saved but doesn't seem to be available anymore at trustees.org

But there are these:

Daniel Fuller Appleton

Gen'l James Appleton

I suppose that Daniel may have put the name on in honor of his father? Certainly possible, I suppose.

So...I don't know...Cheers.

 

[1908]

Sing Sing, NY was a town on the Hudson river(just north of New York City) where
the famous prison is located. "As the prison became notorious, the village
tried to distance itself from the prison's harsh reputation and changed its name to
Ossining on March 25, 1901."

Here are a few artifacts from pre 1901 when the Town was still called Sing Sing.
When I was a kid I dug up these vintage glass bottles in the woods
near our house. Much more recently, I found this watch from Sing Sing, NY.
I really thought it was cool to have items from a town that no longer exists
with that name.

The funny thing is that these old looking bottles are about the
same age as the Watch.

View attachment 751206
View attachment 751207


View attachment 751197



Rob

Love the story behind the bottles. Lovely pocket watch too.

Stephen

 

[musicguy]

James, aka General James Appleton, but he was said to be the father of Daniel Fuller Appleton. I saw no mention of General James being involved with Robbins and Appleton.

James is the son of General James Appleton. James is Daniels older brother who Daniel worked for before Waltham.

Check out this thread
Waltham Mod. 57 Private Labels | NAWCC Forums

From the 1860 Boston directory

Rob

 

[MrRoundel]

Interesting. Well, as a great uncle of C.L., it's a very close association nonetheless. Thanks.

 

[luvsthetick]

This post is a tribute to my Uncle Joseph.

Joseph was my Mom's oldest brother and as far as I know worked for the railroad his entire working career.
My fondest memories of him are the times he would take me on the train with him when time permitted. These train trips make him my favorite uncle.
He and his wife did not have any children. When he passed my aunt gave me the two Hamilton watches he owned at the time. In the box with one of the watches I found his 25 year member pin. The Hamilton 992B shown was in his pocket the day he retired.

 

[Jerry Treiman]

First is a full page ad from the October 1913 issue of Cosmopolitan for Waltham watches featuring "watches cased under Matalene patents". H.W. Matalene was a New Jersey case maker and inventor of watch case improvements.


Next is a detail of one of the watches, with the actual watch depicted.


If that does not qualify as a pocket watch, here is another Waltham cased by Matalene that is very similar to the one in the middle of the ad -


Matalene commissioned a bronze medallion with his bust on it, probably as an item to give to his better customers (I know of 3 examples). The medallion was sculpted by the famous sculptor and medallic artist Julio Kilenyi.


H.W. Matalene's older brother, Leo, worked as a jeweler in St. Louis and, later, in Chicago. This is one of Leo's social calling cards that I found on eBay.


In later years, after retiring from case manufacturing, Henry Matalene was still inventing, as evidenced by this U.S. patent granted to him in 1940.

 

[musicguy]

Jerry this example is really something special!

Rob

 

[Greg Frauenhoff]

I've posted this previously, but here it is again. A watch and related ephemera.

Here's some info on one of my favorite railroad watches.

Aurora mvt #72739:



It's a grade no. 16 made in 1888 or 1889 and, being adjusted, etc., was one of the grades referred to as being "especially adapted to the requirements of railway service" in the 1888 Aurora ad below.



In 1889, the CB&Q began a watch inspection program and from their circular (below) we can see what type of watch they required.



And from the June, 1890, CB&Q monthly report of watches is service, we can see that Aurora #72739 was in use by one of their employees and was running 2 seconds slow over 7 days.





So, Aurora #72739 was RR grade, met the CB&Q specs, and it was used in actual RR service. A bonafide no ifs-ands-or-buts RR watch.

 

[Mike M.]

Pyper Watch Company Indianapolis, Ind. 16s Hamilton 972 loaner #117 plus empty 18s case #127

 

[Steven Thornberry]

A Hamilton 17J private label for C.R. Smith & Son in Philadelphia.



The front and back of a small notebook, which is essentially an advertising item for the same firm.

 

[Nick23]

This avenue is a few hundred yards from my home in Lancashire, England.

 

[Ethan Lipsig]

Here's another pair.

Non-Horological Object: A copper printing plate for an Elgin C.H. Hulburd ad.

Note that I flipped the photo so as to show a mirror image of the plate to make it more easily readable. I no longer own this plate. I gave it to a collector-friend some years.

Pocket Watch: A C.H. Hulburd like the one on the copper plate. I may have 13 C.H. Hulburds, all different, but I don't have one that exactly matches the watch on the plate.

 

[musicguy]

Ethan, Great Elgin Cobo!!

You prompted me to post this duo
Os Elgin, and 0s Elgin print block for jobbers catalogue






Rob

 

[Ethan Lipsig]

I'm having to stretch to find any more pairs in my collection. The 18k cigar cutter and related 18k Matelene-cased Waltham shown below would certainly qualify but for their misfortune of being Siamesely-twinned, a stretch for which I apologize.



Jerry Treiman has some great examples of these conjoined twins.

Pocket watches that also have a non-horological role, such as my cigar-cutter pocket watch, deserve their own separate thread, but there might be too few of them to warrant that. The only other example I have is this master key for the Hotel Touraine in Boston.



But for this thread's U.S. watch limitation, this key (ignoring the watch in it) would qualify for this thread because of a related Patek Philippe. I set forth that pair's story in "I Got a Right to Sing the [Covid] Blues", but Let's Talk About Interesting Items in Our Collections

 

[Greg Frauenhoff]

Personal watch of D. A. Mills. It is a private label Rockford made for Hooper Bros. of Aspen, Colo., and is in a 14K Keller & Untermeyer box-hinge case.



D. A. Mills obituary:

One of his mines was in Red Cliff, Colo., and this is a stock certificate for such held by his widow.



He was a Mason and this is very likely a souvenir spoon (made from Colorado Silver) he was given/purchased at the 1892 Conclave in Denver.

 

[Lee Passarella]

Here is a pair:

Non-Horological Item: Roscoe C. McCulloch's badge to the 1913 American National Jewelers Association Convention in Chicago.

View attachment 751074

Horological Item: Roscoe C. McCulloch's watch, given to him by the Illinois Watch Co. in 1921 in recognition of his service to the American National Retail Jewelers Association as its lawyer, according to his grandson, from whom I bought both the watch and the badge. Roscoe C. McCulloch was quite a distinguished fellow. Among other things he was a U.S. congressman for six years, a position he left to become a U.S. senator.

View attachment 751073
The watch Illinois gave to Senator's McColloch is also a distinguished one: An "all" aluminum 12-size Grade 525, one of only 50 ever made, and one of three known to survive. It weighs 29.6 grams, cased. In contrast, a nearly identical looking 14k Illinois Grade 438 (another 12-size) in my collection weighs 52.7 grams cased.

View attachment 751072 View attachment 751077 View attachment 751075 View attachment 751076

Great watch and associated items, Ethan. Just to note that McCulloch's namesake was something of a scamp, who died in the great Blizzard of 88.

 

[Ethan Lipsig]

McCulloch's namesake was something of a scamp, who died in the great Blizzard of 88.

Lee, I know nothing about that scamp and couldn't find anything about him. Please post some details.

 

[noelekal]

We'll try posting the photo a second time.

Teen-ers!


Top: 1915 Waltham Crescent Street with wind indicator with a 1916 Colt Model 1903 .32 ACP.
Bottom: 1918 Hamilton 992 with a 1917 Smity & Wesson Model 1903 .32 S&W Long.

 

[Jerry Treiman]

[ . . . . ] ... I don't have one that exactly matches the watch on the plate.

If I may piggyback on Ethan's post, here is the 1923 catalog page that used that copper plate -

(ad image courtesy of diveboy)

I believe the watch shown in the box is this model. This is the only surviving example I have seen.


And here is a 1922 National Geographic Magazine advertisement that describes the distinctive "Mecca" bow -

 

[Clint Geller]

Cool idea for a thread. Here are a watch and sword presented to US Navy Assistant Engineer Charles Jabez Coney on October 16,1861. Coney's background and service history are available in the attached pdf

 

[Clint Geller]

Here is a watch presented to Brigadier General William Jackson Palmer, war hero, industrialist, and philanthropist, by the officers of the 15th PA Cavalry at their first reunion in Philadelphia in 1868. Jackson was a Medal of Honor recipient and founder of the Denver & Rio Grand Railroad and the city of Colorado Springs. The 15 jewel Appleton, Tracy & Co. Grade KW16 movement includes a custom aftermarket stem winding and pin setting mechanism, which is not an Abbott's conversion. The 18K case is by Eliashib Tracy & Co. It is accompanied by a cigar boxtop from the 1880's with Palmer's likeness on it, and a bronze participation medal from the 15th PA Cavalry's final reunion at Palmer's estate, the Eyrie, in Colorado Springs in 1907. The attached pdf fills in many of the details of Palmer's life and service.

 

[Lee Passarella]

Lee, I know nothing about that scamp and couldn't find anything about him. Please post some details.

Glad to, Ethan. Here is an entry in Wikipedia. Much, much more available on the internet.
Roscoe Conkling - Wikipedia

 

[Lee Passarella]

A Hamilton 17J private label for C.R. Smith & Son in Philadelphia.

View attachment 751315 View attachment 751316

The front and back of a small notebook, which is essentially an advertising item for the same firm.

View attachment 751318 View attachment 751317

Heere is the same address in my native city today (according to Google Maps). I suspect it is very different now.

 

[Greg Frauenhoff]

Anna Lacy worked for the Aurora Watch Co., reportedly in the jewel department, beginning in 1884. (Photo in author's collection).



This is her loupe (author's collection):



On Sept. 28, 1888, she purchased a 6 size grade no. 33 (s/n 150127) directly from the Company.



Here are the grade descriptions for Aurora's 6 size product line in 1891 (author's collection).



Here is an example of a grade no. 33 (s/n 151653). (Photo in author's collection).

 

[Greg Frauenhoff]

I've posted this previously, but here it is again. A watch and related ephemera.

Here's some info on one of my favorite railroad watches.

Aurora mvt #72739:



It's a grade no. 16 made in 1888 or 1889 and, being adjusted, etc., was one of the grades referred to as being "especially adapted to the requirements of railway service" in the 1888 Aurora ad below.



In 1889, the CB&Q began a watch inspection program and from their circular (below) we can see what type of watch they required.



And from the June, 1890, CB&Q monthly report of watches is service, we can see that Aurora #72739 was in use by one of their employees and was running 2 seconds slow over 7 days.





So, Aurora #72739 was RR grade, met the CB&Q specs, and it was used in actual RR service. A bonafide no ifs-ands-or-buts RR watch.

Another very rare ephemeral bit regarding Aurora railroad watches:



BTW, contrary to the nonsense circulated on the internet that Aurora specialized in "medium and low grade" watches*, Aurora marketed their product heavily towards the emerging 1880s market for quality watches for use in RR service. Their better grade 18s full plate mvts competed favorably with those made by other makers such as Elgin, Rockford, etc.. For example, in Sept. 1889 of some 2986 watches in RR service on the Burlington Route there were the following: Aurora - 232; Elgin - 573; Hampden -304; Rockford -243; Waltham - 950. Keep in mind that in 1889 Aurora made about 100 mvts per day as compared with around 1500 per day for both Elgin and Waltham (and they both had been making watches for many many years before Aurora started).

Further, approx. 43% of Aurora's 18s production was 15 jewel grades. By comparison, c. 1888 Elgin made about 19% (15j 18s), Waltham 50% (15j 18s) and Illinois 3% (15j 18s) (note: there are certainly some guesstimates and assumptions made in getting these approximate percentages).

Sorry if this post is off topic. Feel free to delete or move it.

*The origin of this obviously inaccurate statement is a comment by Crossman that was picked up by Townsend.

 

[Clint Geller]

Further, approx. 43% of Aurora's 18s production was 15 jewel grades. By comparison, c. 1888 Elgin made about 19% (15j 18s), Waltham 50% (15j 18s) and Illinois 3% (15j 18s) (note: there are certainly some guesstimates and assumptions made in getting these approximate percentages).

One more data point: E. Howard & Co.: 100% with 15 jewels until 1893; 100% with at least 15 jewels thereafter

 

[CentreKeystone]

Two Hamilton Pacific Electric 926 watches on a Los Angeles Pacific Electric map with a model of their business car "Commodore"

 

[Bila]

*The origin of this obviously inaccurate statement is a comment by Crossman that was picked up by Townsend.

Inaccurate writings are not just concerning Aurora's Greg, it appears with a few other Companies as well concerning Crossman, also many an incorrect fact by Henry Abbott (George Hazlitt) in his writings. A lot of incorrect info by both have been carried continuusly through some of the Contemporary Research and on a lot of internet websites.

 

[topspin]

Ok, I'll play. I'll keep it short & sweet. The photo shows a decent but unremarkable Waltham 1883 (running nicely), and a small purple rubber ducky. So, what links them? They were both among the objects that I retrieved earlier in the week, when I went into the office to hand back my work pass (etc) and clear out my desk. Yup, I'm part of another IT redundancies statistic.

 

[johnbscott]

Post #28, above, shows Hamilton 16s 859629. Here is Hamilton 859630. Both watches were retailed by C R Smith of Philadelphia. I think that makes a pair!

 

[musicguy]

Here are a few items from the John Wanamaker Store (photos Wanamaker catalogue 1905 from google books).
Two watches and a Clock with some Wanamaker advertising showing the watches and clock.

4.5-inch Private Label John Wanamaker Couaillet Freres Carriage clock from circa 1900-1915
with two Elgin's (12s and 0s).
19j 12 size John Wanamaker Private Label Elgin grade 193
and 17j 0 size circa 1906 John Wanamaker PL Elgin grade 264(with Gold escape wheel).

Not the same carriage clock as above, but it is an example from the 1888-9 Wanamaker Catalogue.

Rob

 

[johnbscott]

Those PL Elgin watches are quite something!