Barr & Poole Poole Executive#5 Electromagnetic Clock

Discussion in 'Electric Horology' started by Uhralt, Jan 26, 2020.

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  1. Uhralt

    Uhralt Registered User
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    I just won a Poole Executive #5 clock from about 1927 and I'm looking very much forward to start working on it once a received it. I will probably be back with pictures and more questions then. The clock has a wooden base but is missing its glass dome. Does anybody have the dimensions of the dome so that I can start looking for one? I noticed that some 400 day clock domes are on the (ebay) market and they mention Poole/Barr clocks in their listings. Would one of them fit?

    The clock is also missing the round upper cover of the battery compartment. Any idea how to make one?

    Thanks,

    Uhralt
     
  2. KurtinSA

    KurtinSA Registered User
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    There have been a number of people who have asked the same thing about battery covers for this clock. Search the forum for "poole executive".

    As for the dome, once you get the clock you can measure the diameter and make a better guess as to the height. Timesavers sells a variety of glass domes. For some out of the ordinary, try glassdomes.com.

    Kurt
     
  3. Uhralt

    Uhralt Registered User
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    I think you are right, it is better to wait, measure and then buy the fitting dome. I guess I was a bit too impatient to get started!

    Thanks,

    Uhralt
     
  4. Uhralt

    Uhralt Registered User
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    I just received my Poole Executive # 5 clock. I haven't taken pictures jet but here is a link to the ended ebay auction:

    ANTIQUE POOLE ITHACA NY / ELECTROMAGNETIC CLOCK 2633 / Parts / Repair / Project | eBay

    I noticed that the round, upper cap of the battery compartment, a brass tube, is missing. I will try to make one myself. I have tried to find a good pic on the internet, but didn't find one. I assume that there will be a contact for the plus pole of the battery on the inside of the cap and that somehow there is a contact area on the outside of the cap to which a connector for the electromagnets attaches.

    Does anyone have such a clock and could provide good pictures of the cap, from the outside and the inside?
    That would be very helpful.

    Otherwise the clock seems to be complete but quite dirty. At some point the batteries have leaked inside the brass tube, so I will have to remove the residues so that new batteries can slide in. The brass itself looks undamaged. Lastly, one of the two contacts of the switch triggering the electromagnets has broken off. I assume that the clock will work with only one but at some point I may want to repair this too.

    Uhralt
     
  5. KurtinSA

    KurtinSA Registered User
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    Maybe a moderator can merge this thread with the one previously started.

    Kurt
     
  6. Uhralt

    Uhralt Registered User
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    Kurt,
    With your help I solved the issue of the missing glass dome. Timesavers sells one with a 5 1/2" diameter and a height of 10", that should fit. Thanks you for your help!

    I started a new thread because this is related to a new issue and the old title, which I can't change, would be misleading. That's why I think it will be better to continue with this thread (which I titled more general) and let the previous one rest in peace. This new thread will cover any other issues that will come up during restoration of the clock.

    Uhralt
     
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  7. leeinv66

    leeinv66 Moderator
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    Help me out here guys. I know Arthur Poole started making these clocks ca 1924 and that after his death in 1934 John Barr continued to manufacture Poole electric clocks under trademark. So, my question is, should Poole and Barr clocks be discussed separately or combined?
     
  8. KurtinSA

    KurtinSA Registered User
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    Uhralt -

    Good you found a dome! I guess I didn't the need to split things out. Posting in the other thread would have a running discussion of your progress. In fact in the other thread which has "glass dome" in the title has no information in it that indicates you were successful in finding a dome. If both threads were brought together, brings it all together for a future reader. In the end, not my call...up to the moderators.

    YMMV.

    Kurt
     
  9. Uhralt

    Uhralt Registered User
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    The Barr clocks are almost identical to the late Poole clocks. From my perspective they could be discussed combined.

    Uhralt
     
  10. Uhralt

    Uhralt Registered User
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    Kurt,
    I see your point. I think it would make sense to merge the glass dome information with this more general thread.
    Peter, if you would be so kind?

    Uhralt
     
  11. Uhralt

    Uhralt Registered User
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    I have made some initial progress, meaning that I've got the clock running. First I cleaned up the battery compartment and removed corrosion from inside the wall as good as I could. Than I removed the bottom contact with its coil spring. It was heavily corroded, so I put it in Evaporust over night. The next morning the rust was mostly removed but so was also the coil spring! I made a new one from 0.9 mm pivot steel and soldered it on the bottom washer, like the original was attached. Then I tested the coils for conductivity. There was conductivity but there was also a short with the movement plate. I found out that two of the insulating fiber washers were missing. After a trip to the hardware store I could replace them. Now conductivity measured fine, and no more short. I made a temporary connection from the top of the battery to the plus contact of the clock. I'm still looking for the design of the missing top cap.

    Finally I put on the pendulum, leveled the clock and gave the pendulum a push. Surprisingly the clock runs. Right now there are about 13
    or 14 full swings between impulses. I hope that will improve once I cleaned the clock. I don't know about time keeping yet because I had removed the hands and the dial for better access. Here are pictures of the clock in the current state. They also show my temporary wiring.

    Uhralt
    Poole 1.JPG Poole 2.JPG
     
  12. leeinv66

    leeinv66 Moderator
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    #12 leeinv66, Jan 30, 2020
    Last edited: Jan 30, 2020
    Consider it done :)

    I have also changed the thread prefix "Bar" to read "Bar & Poole" and applied it to this thread. I will search Poole and attach the prefix to those threads as well. Then hopefully a prefix search should bring up any previous threads for both.
     
  13. Uhralt

    Uhralt Registered User
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    Looks good. Thank you!

    Uhralt
     
  14. Uhralt

    Uhralt Registered User
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    Good news! After cleaning of the movement the number of oscillations between triggering the electromagnet is up to 29 - 31. That seems to be quite acceptable. According to old information from Poole, the clocks needed to run cycles of 16 to 22 oscillations in order to achieve a one year runtime on a set of batteries.

    I'm still looking for information on the top battery cap. If anybody has pictures or could give other advice how to make one, that would be much appreciated.

    Uhralt
     
  15. sophiebear0_0

    sophiebear0_0 Registered User

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    Uhralt

    I own a couple of Poole clocks, but they are different models. My clocks have the solenoid mounted parallel to the dial and have a "semi" end cap.

    I have attached a stock photograph of what I believe your end cap should be. But unfortunately I can't provide any further information.

    Hopefully one of our members will be able to provide more detailed information.

    I'm pleased the you have clock running. My experience is that you have to be very careful with levelling to be able to regulate the Poole clock.

    Best regards,

    Peter

    Poole end cap 1.jpg Poole end cap 2.JPG
     
  16. Uhralt

    Uhralt Registered User
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    Peter,

    Thank you! I do have the model on the left, with the twin magnets. Your picture is helpful for the overall design of the cap. I start to think that it might have a metal top and some insulating material beneath. It would be great to see the underside of the cap to confirm this. Maybe somebody has such a picture.

    And you are right that leveling of the clock is very important. My example doesn't have a level mounted to the base so I went by the indication mark on the plaque. Then I put thin card board shims under the leveling feet, one after the other. After each test I counted the number of oscillations to see if there was an improvement or deterioration. This way I could come close to the "ideal" position without disturbing the clock by lifting it up.

    Uhralt
     
  17. sophiebear0_0

    sophiebear0_0 Registered User

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    #17 sophiebear0_0, Jan 31, 2020
    Last edited: Jan 31, 2020
    Uhralt

    I have attached a copy of the original Poole patent which may be helpful. There is also an article by Turner which seems to show more detail.

    My model has a brass strip contact that attaches to the underside of the end cap. The 3 D-cell batteries are held in place solely by the springy nature of the brass strip.

    Regards,

    Peter
     

    Attached Files:

  18. Uhralt

    Uhralt Registered User
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    Peter,
    Again thank you very much. The patent is very interesting as a whole and it also shows how the cap works from an electric circuit point of view! I think I will be able to come up with something that will work. I had found the article of Turner on the NAWCC website. It is one of three articles that were published in the Bulletin. Up to now it was the best information I had about the appearance of the cap, now trumped by the patent!

    I will show what I came up with as soon as I made it.

    Uhralt
     
  19. Uhralt

    Uhralt Registered User
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    Made some further progress. I made a temporary cap from materials I had lying around, a brass bob and a stainless steel ring of appropriate dimensions. The bob provides some weight and the ring has a profile that allows the clock's plus terminal to snap in. I screwed a piece of brass sheet on the inside of the bob as a contact and put some insulating tape on the bottom of the steel ring. It seems to work well.
    With a set of fresh batteries the clock runs now with 38 oscillations between impulses.
    Next will be regulating the clock and looking for a suitable material for a permanent cap. I also need to fix the second hand with the long side of the hand being broken off.

    Uhralt

    Poole 3.JPG Poole 4.JPG
     
  20. sophiebear0_0

    sophiebear0_0 Registered User

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    Uhralt

    That's good progress. With 38 oscillations the clock is running very nicely. I am sure you will be able to regulate it without any problems.

    Peter
     
  21. gloos

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    IMG_20200201_103755003_HDR.jpg IMG_20200201_103742350_HDR.jpg This is the cap from my Poole Executive, the material may be bakelite, looks kind of fragile. The dome is 5 3/8" ID 5 1/2" OD by 9" high.
     
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  22. Uhralt

    Uhralt Registered User
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    Thank you very much! Very helpful. The picture of the inside is most telling. I think I can make something similar from wood by sandwiching two pieces together with the brass contact between the layers.

    The dome I have ordered from Timesavers is 10" high. I will see how it looks. If necessary I will ask a glazier if he can safely cut off an inch.

    Uhralt
     
  23. Uhralt

    Uhralt Registered User
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    Here is what I came up with for the cap. Inspired by the original design, but I made it from hardwood. I cut off a piece of a wooden globe and another thin piece of a wooden rod. Removed some material from the inside of the globe piece to make space for the brass contacts and sandwiched the two pieces together as shown in the picture. Then painted the wood a reddish brown and finished with a layer of protective lacquer. Not quite as nice as an original, but it works and it doesn't look bad.

    Uhralt
    poole 5.JPG Poole 6.JPG Poole 7.JPG
     
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  24. Uhralt

    Uhralt Registered User
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    By the way, just for completeness, the serial number of the clock is 2633. It is embossed on the movement back plate and on the plaque that is used to level the clock.

    Uhralt
     
  25. Uhralt

    Uhralt Registered User
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    The glass dome just arrived. The diameter fits perfectly on the base and I think it looks good as is, so I will probably not try to cut off an inch. I also repaired the broken second hand by inserting the tip of a very thin minute hand for a French clock. It is still a hair thicker than the original hand but looks presentable. I would probably break it when I try to make it thinner. Overall, I think I have a nice looking and well functioning Poole now.

    Uhralt

    Poole 8.JPG
     
  26. leeinv66

    leeinv66 Moderator
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    Nice work! I'm just a little jealous :)
     

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