Most visitors online was 1660 , on 12 Dec 2020
Still not common though and over 15 times less plentiful than the open face version which I believe had 13370 made.Thanks for that information, Fred. They are not as uncommon as I thought. :-(
Actually, you might call it an American fake. I believe this was made by the New York Standard Watch Co. and was intended to deceive buyers into thinking they were getting an honest jeweled movement.
Quite a few early Howard keywind cases and some early Waltham keywind cases have turned up with the marking "F.M." incused in it. No one has ever been able to definitively identify the casemaker or retailer who used that mark. 4thD's post makes me wonder whether it is possible that a very proud freemason simply elected to mark his cases that way.A. F.&A.M. would be Ancient Free & Accepted Mason and F.&A.M and A.M. would a portion of that term. I would assume the watch belonged to an Accepted Mason in Chicago.-Cort
Paul,A couple of months ago I bought this Hamilton 932 18s OF watch, serial no. 23, at a Jones - Horan auction. After buying my first Hamilton 10 years ago when I first started collecting, I found Hamiltons to be very well made (most 17j and above) and finished. They also, for the most part, kept kept the most accurate time. That and the fact they sold to private jewelers in the early years, along with special damaskeenings, and "Unions", "Union Specials", Presidents and other variations, make them a starting collectors dream in finding a niche for something unusual among the common. Unfortunately most of that lies in the written Hamilton sales ledgers from #1 to 824700 beyond this the written ledgers are lost.
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I do not have it in my hands yet. However based on what I saw, I presume it is. It will be an open face case, yellow gold filled. (Solid gold is out of my reach.)Original case?
Here is my most recent arrival.
I picked it up for a few reasons.
1. The dial.
2. Am'n grade. I wanted to become familiar with this grade in the M88 line.
3. The serial number is low, sort of. I have a M72 Champion in the 4 mil range, so wanted to see this M88 in a similar range.
I would like to know more about the dial please.
This is a lovely movement and dial. I have #4,145,086 -- just ten earlier. It also has an atypical dial, but not quite as fancy as yours. A bigger difference is that mine is marked "NON-MAGNETIC". It has a non-magnetic balance, hairspring and pallet fork. The ledger singles out numbers -081 to -090 as being non-magnetic, so yours may not have all of the NM elements.It is already a little odd because the balance is obviously non-magnetic, but the hairspring is blue...
I did a quick teardown to see if there was anything horrible going on. I can share those details in a separate post.This is a lovely movement and dial. I have #4,145,086 -- just ten earlier. It also has an atypical dial, but not quite as fancy as yours. A bigger difference is that mine is marked "NON-MAGNETIC". It has a non-magnetic balance, hairspring and pallet fork. The ledger singles out numbers -081 to -090 as being non-magnetic, so yours may not have all of the NM elements.
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That is a fairly intense watch!Last found in the mailbox ...
Circa 1891 Seth Thomas, Model 2, Grade Henry Molineux, 18S, 17J, HC, rare factory unsigned two foot fancy dial.
Dueber gold filled case with factory glass cuvette. Just back from restoration, the pictures, though excellent, do not capture the full beauty seen in hand.
From the excellent Seth Thomas Research site:
“The Model 2 was the company's first hunting watch, conceived in 1886 and produced the following year. It was a skeletonized 3/4-plate design with a graceful cantilever over the center wheel pivot that continued the use of the long pallet escapement, and were available in either gilt or nickel, or the rare flashed-gilt and two-tone plates. With the exception of a few key-wind examples, all the rest were lever-set and were available in jewel counts of 7 in gilt all the way up to 20 for the rarest Model 2 of all - the Henry Molineux.”
“Henry Molineux was born in New Hampshire around 1832, managing the Pacific Coast Department of the Seth Thomas Clock Company for 30 years until 1883 as an agent, stockholder and employer. He was a personal friend of Seth Thomas Jr and served the public trust for many years in California as county treasurer, clerk, and recorder of Sierra County. In 1881 he was elected supervisor of the 5th ward, and was also president of four San Francisco Banks during his time in the west. He died in Boston in March of 1900. The company created a grade in his honor, which was the second-highest named grade that Seth Thomas produced, offered in the Model 2 in three jewel counts.”
“Roughly 380 of the Model 2 Henry Molineux were produced in four separate runs. All were lever-set and were offered in several patterns with different signatures. The final block contained both nickel and two-tone finishes. All known adverts list the Molineux grade as Adjusted with no mention of any positions.”
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Congrats on this historical watch.Some History to go with it, I was going to buy this watch to go with my #22 for consecutive number set but I didn't want to spend what you paid for it.
This watch was in Bob Bennett's collection and he offered it to me for $5500 and I wouldn't meet his price because I bought #22 for 3K and also bought #30 for less than that, so old Bob finally got his price & more for it and I am so glad it went to someone who appreciated what it is..
I had a 3 digit one in my hands for about 48 hours maybe I should have kept hold of itand doubt I will ever enter two digit serial number territory ever again!
Steve,An 18s Seth Thomas Model 3, Grade 33 (7 jewel) in a Dueber Silverine case. The Model 3's were apparently made between 1888 and 1898 ( Model 3 | Seth Thomas Research ). I happened to find an 1890 catalogue illustration of an 18s Grade 33 in volume 2 of Tran Duy Ly's book on Seth Thomas Clocks and Watches (3rd ed., 2004).
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Ed, my watch is lever set. That discrepancy between the catalogue description and my watch didn't even catch my attention. Thanks!Steve,
Is your 7 jewel Seth Thomas lever or pendant set? The catalog description says stem set, but most all of the Model 3, grade 33, 7 jewel movements in the database that Kent & I maintain are lever set, except for a few KW/KS.