Paper Dials

Bigdaddy56

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After replacing a paper dial do you exsperts paint a clear coat over the paper dial to preserve and protect it or just leave it to the elements?
 

Willie X

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I leave them as they are. If you desire a glossy appearance it would be best to start with a paper that was glossy. Adding a product to "preserve and protect" often leads to something very different like: cracks, crazing, peeling, yellowing, etc.

Even a good paper dial replacement job always stands out like a 'sore thumb'. If anything, I usually add some smudges around the key holes and distress the dial somewhat to take the 'new' edge off.

Now, on the other hand, china/porcelain cased clocks, Vienna style wall clocks, and others look good with a high gloss dial. I had some papers once that were called 'porcelainized'. They had a durable slick surface, sort of like they were laminated with clear plastic. Very nice on certain clocks.

Hope this helps, Willie X
 

R&A

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I used to work for a guy that used a cigarette to antique the finish so it didn't stand out so new. Looked pretty good on some clocks. Clear coat gives a little to much new for me. I have only replaced 2 faces in over 37 years of doing clocks. Not something I practice. I think the older looking the better. Adds to the antiquette of the clock. But then there is those that it just doesn't sit right with the over all look.

H/C
 

shutterbug

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I use the photo software to 'age' the paper with color. You can make them look old but still in good shape. I don't like the dials to look new, and only replace when the old dial is really in bad shape. I don't coat.
 

Scottie-TX

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As others have written; this is a personal preference - how you want it to be. Some dials are sold on glossy paper if that's your preference. As others wrote, I also like to weather them a little so they don't look so blindingly new. How you do that is limited only by your imagination because there are so many ways. One process I used was dragging the dial thru dirty lacquer thinner I used to clean brushes. Scorching works. Dusting with toning lacquer works, etc.
 

Bigdaddy56

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Thank you all for the great ideas. The clock is a Sessions Grand #3. I think Im going to leave it as is and let it age on it's own. The clock is a total restoration and I'll post some picks when it's ready. Its my very first and so Iam taking my time and doing it right. The case is finished and now Im working on the movement and face.
 

moe1942

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I go for the hopefully authentically aged look. Unless porcelain, shiny dials look out of place. And personally, a dial has to be in real bad shape before I replace.
 

shutterbug

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Here's a badly stained one that I replaced two or three years ago. I scanned the original, did the detail work and the paper color on the computer, printed it on card stock (matt) and cut it out with a circle cutter. The original is on the bottom, the new one on top. The goal was to match the aged color. Not too bad. German Dial Restore.jpg
 

moe1942

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Here's a badly stained one that I replaced two or three years ago. I scanned the original, did the detail work and the paper color on the computer, printed it on card stock (matt) and cut it out with a circle cutter. The original is on the bottom, the new one on top. The goal was to match the aged color. Not too bad. 152861.jpg
Very well done...Can that be done on your average printer??
 

shutterbug

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Yeah, just a run of the mill three color, single color cartridge printer. You need a fairly good editing program, capable of "cloning" which acts like copy and paste, but other wise nothing special. I brought the image into a very large format (again, the program feature) and carefully copied small areas of the red designs and numbers that were not stained and pasted them over the parts that were. Same thing with the "white" parts of the dial. When it looks pretty good blown up like that, it will look great at regular size. I imagine I had a couple of hours into the detail work.
 
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moe1942

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Yeah, just a run of the mill three color, single color cartridge printer. You need a fairly good editing program, capable of "cloning" which acts like cut and paste, but other wise nothing special.
I know who to call when I need to try it. Are there any good or suitable FREE editing programs available??
 

Bruce Alexander

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I know who to call when I need to try it. Are there any good or suitable FREE editing programs available??
Here's one that is billed as "The world's most advanced online image editor": http://fotoflexer.com/

Haven't tried it so I don't know if it has all of the bells and whistles you'll need but it sounds good. I use an old application called "Paint Shop". I've taken digital photos of badly damaged paper dials, properly resized the image, cleaned up the visual "noise" sometimes pixel by pixel and printed out an exact reproduction. I don't have a laser printer so I took the photo image to a print shop and had them print out a page of the dial images on off-white "antique" card stock. I then applied the reproduction over the original so that the restoration is completely reversible. It's not hard to do but it is time consuming. You need to clean up and reproduce 0, 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, and 8. From those numbers you already have 9, 10, 11 and 12.

This is a Kroeber China No. 22 circa 1898. It belonged to my Grandmother and as far as I know, she purchased it as a decorative piece. It's completely restored to function now and I intend to leave it to my daughter in due time.

As_Found.jpg Front_After.jpg Dial_After.jpg

P.S., that's some nice work SB. I didn't keep track of the time I spent on my project. I'm kind of glad that I didn't!.
 
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shutterbug

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I know who to call when I need to try it. Are there any good or suitable FREE editing programs available??
There's a good one with a rather large learning curve, called Gimp. Learn about it here.
 

Bruce Alexander

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Windows "Paint" program may have all the basics you need to get started. It doesn't have a lot of bells and whistles but there's no steep learning curve either. I think you can re-size, edit, flip and manipulate images enough to do what usually needs to be done...it just won't be "fast". What do you think S.B.?
 

shutterbug

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Windows "Paint" program may have all the basics you need to get started. It doesn't have a lot of bells and whistles but there's no steep learning curve either. I think you can re-size, edit, flip and manipulate images enough to do what usually needs to be done...it just won't be "fast". What do you think S.B.?
I never tried it. If it will allow you to magnify the image and manipulate it small pixel sized areas, it should do the job :)
 

moe1942

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Thanks y'all. Looks like play time..Have a friend at another forum that's in to photo shopping. I'm sure she would even do the job if I talk jas right..:)
 

Jay Fortner

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Here's one I want to repair,belongs in the hall of shame. Tried Gimp,WAY over my head. Just tried that fotoflexer but couldn't get it to work for me(not surprised). I've been using a windows 2000 version of picture it express but it doesn't want to play well with this dell and xp.
clock dial 016.jpg
 

lpbp

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If I replace a paper dial, as last resort, it depends upon using a glossy dial or plain paper. I prefer plain paper, and the I antique it. Staining with tea etc, leaves a solid look as opposed to one that had aged naturally. I use paste wax, and darken with a little powdered anilin dye. Rubbing it one the dial gives it an antique uneven naturally aged look, also adds a degree of protection.
 

shutterbug

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Jay - is that paper? Looks like metal. If so, the dial house might be a better option.
 

Jay Fortner

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Jay - is that paper? Looks like metal. If so, the dial house might be a better option.
Yeah it's zinc. That's an E&A Ingraham beehive made between 1852-56. It was one of eight clocks that I rescued from a total hack.
He had pulled the original New Haven movement and installed a elcheapo chinese kitchen clock movement in it,hence the extra winding holes. I figure I'd reproduce a rag(linen) paper dial and lay over that swiss cheesed dial. I've searched for a year now trying the find a used dial but they aren't very plentifull. Hmmm! just had a thought(that's scary),I'll get back to you.
 

Diana G.

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Here's one that is billed as "The world's most advanced online image editor": FotoFlexer - Free Online Photo Editor
Bruce: This is to update the reference to FotoFlexer. Apparently, it's been "upgraded" and now has only very basic tools. :(

"During upgrading, almost all the functions from a previous FotoFlexer version are deleted.
"The problem is that now the program can do almost nothing. Having uploaded the image, I saw a quite plain interface. Used to be here range of tools, such as basic, effects, decoration, animations, beautify, distort, layers, and geek."
<FotoFlexer Photo Editor Review: Is It Worth Using?> accessed 27 July, 2020

Diana G.
 
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Bruce Alexander

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Hello Diana

Bruce: This is to update the reference to fotoflexer. Apparently, it's been "upgraded" and now has only very basic tools. :(
Things change quickly these days. Honestly I was surprised to find out that the link was still active.

This Editor is supposed to be quite powerful: GIMP - GNU Image Manipulation Program I have no experience with GIMP. It reportedly doesn't have "Layers". (Edit, it's been around for quite a while too)

I use a pretty old program called JASC Paintshop Pro (has Layers). I've found it to be very useful. My program still chugs along on the latest version of Windows. As long as I can still use it, I have no intention of replacing it.

Here's a pretty current review of some of the available free editors.

Forget Photoshop: Edit Images With These Top Free Photo Editors

Hopefully you'll find something powerful and intuitive to work with.

Good luck with your project.

Bruce
 
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Rod Schaffter

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Bruce Alexander

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I use GIMP and it does indeed have layers...
Thanks Rod. My mistake. The review states
  • Lacks layer grouping, adjustment layers, and some other common Photoshop elements.

How do you like GIMP? How's the learning curve with it?

I'm sure it is more than sufficient to quickly properly re-size and clean up a dial image file.

Bruce
 
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Rod Schaffter

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How do you like GIMP? How's the learning curve with it?

I'm sure it is more than sufficient to quickly properly re-size and clean up a dial image file.

Bruce
Hi Bruce,

I just do basic stuff with it. It's not hard to use, but some things are awkward (like choosing layers!). If you run into a problem, Google is your Friend. :)
 

shutterbug

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I found Gimp to be rather difficult to learn compared to paid for editors. I hope the video make it clearer :)
 

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