Owner built precision regulator

Discussion in 'Clock Construction' started by jhe.1973, May 11, 2011.

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  1. jhe.1973

    jhe.1973 Registered User
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    Re: Owner built precision regulator - the beat goes on - pun intended!

    By rotating the rack around the tooth w/red dot you can see how the wheel only contacts the pinion at the transition from tip radius to flank. It does not actually use the radial flank as it should. If I tried to get more flank contact, the assembly will bind.

    You can also see the trial cuts as I tweaked the setup to radius the tips of the pinion teeth.

    5.JPG 6.JPG 7.JPG

    As a comparison, here are a pinion & wheel for my second generation movement which shows thinner teeth, much deeper meshing & wheel tooth contact on the radial flank of the pinion where it should be.

    11.jpg

    More following…………
     
  2. jhe.1973

    jhe.1973 Registered User
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    Re: Owner built precision regulator - the beat goes on - pun intended!

    Because I vertically set up the wheel & pinion in my depth tool and had to shoot from an angle, I could not get the macro lens adapter quite close enough to focus

    12.JPG

    If you click on each of the thumbnails below and then toggle back & forth between 'Previous' & 'Next' the gears appear to rotate. By following the wheel tooth w/red dot you can see that its contact with the pinion does not vary much from the pitch diameter of the pinion.

    8.jpg 9.jpg

    Notice that because of the high number of teeth of both gears, there is not a lot of rotation of the pinion before the next wheel tooth begins to takes over. Keeping this contact location as constant as possible is a big advantage of high numbered wheels & pinions.

    I am expecting much better results with this next effort.
     
  3. Jim DuBois

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    Re: Owner built precision regulator - the beat goes on - pun intended!

    Great photography! Thanks for the follow up information. Very interesting.

    Another suggested reading if you have not yet checked it out is "The Modern Clock" by Ward Goodrich, first published in 1905. My copy is 2nd edition, 1950. It is a very useful book on several levels. I find chapter 14 (Some Hints on Making a Regulator) to be very helpful. Also, chapter 13 starts off with a discussion of how to make a precision regulator case, or perhaps better put "inherent characteristics" of use. I have seen this book at various NAWCC marts for a a few bucks, maybe $10 or $20 max.

    Just of interest I believe Goodrich states someplace in this book that he was able to obtain high precision timekeeping with 8 leaf pinions and he goes further to say that his max recommended pinion tooth count for regulators is 12. I know that is contrary to a lot of thinking, but we are discussing concepts and outside thoughts, not absolutes I think?
     
  4. jhe.1973

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    Re: Owner built precision regulator - the beat goes on - pun intended!

    Hi Everyone,

    Jim, the book series arrived shortly after my last post but I haven't even been through any of them completely. I just finally opened one of them today. Sure do like them though - terrific quality photos & paper.

    So far I haven't seen any of the concepts that I feel are original to me have been done before, but lots to see still.

    One thing that did seem to jump out though is on page 207 of "Precision Pendulum Clocks, France, Germany, America and Recent Advancements".

    This is the regulator shown on that page:

    James Arthur2.jpg

    It was built by James Arthur in 1901 and uses involute gearing. The text says, "Curiously, Arthur cut his teeth 10% deeper and sized the pinions one-quarter diametral pitch smaller, but cut them to the regular depth".

    The photo is to show the rather large weight used to drive a fairly small seconds pendulum for an 8 day clock. This would, to my way of thinking, be consistent with involute gearing requiring more power to drive it.

    But if it really does provide more constant velocity as claimed in this text and the paper by Mr. Thoen, it may produce a smoother transfer of motion throughout the movement if more backlash is designed into the gear cutting process.

    I find this quite interesting as Mr. Arthur was trained in mechanics & gear cutting (according to the text) and he apparently was aware of the need for more backlash.

    This isn't to debate involute vs. cycloidal, it just seems to offer another view on the discussion.

    Because involute cutters are rather inexpensive, I will likely try it myself. Perhaps even finishing one of my 5 movements with involute seeing as how I lost so many of the pinions I already had made.

    Something I have been finding by developing a movement myself is that friction does not necessarily effect timekeeping IF it is consistent. Conversely, reducing friction will not necessarily lead to better timekeeping - especially if not enough attention has been paid to he pendulum and its mounting.

    An awful lot of authors seem to relate friction to timekeeping as though they are locked together.

    I want to mention another detail that I have recently noticed since I relocated the anchor for the weight at the case top last April.

    Previously, in this house, there was a very slight, but consistent sympathetic swing of the weight when it got to about this position:

    1-27-13.JPG

    I never noticed it in other houses, but I have also reduced the amount of weight quite a bit since living here, so it may not have anything to do with this house.

    Anyhow, its stable now. The tiny swing the weight would get is completely gone.

    I would think that if it had been the result of air movement, the lighter weight should be more likely to swing now.

    I tend to think that it is the result of the pulley being on more of an angle when viewed directly from above and this breaks a harmonic that was setting up in the system when the pulley was in a straight line coming off the drum.

    So that's my story and I'm sticking to it!

    :whistle:
     
  5. Jim DuBois

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    Re: Owner built precision regulator - the beat goes on - pun intended!

    Yeah, no need to get the involute versus cycloidal discussion up and running. From the modifications Mr. Arthur made in his depthing, in the depth of the tooth, and by reducing the DP of the pinions I am not certain it is any longer really involute gearing. I would suggest he took the points of advantage of involute and then attempted to modify the engineering to minimize the limitations of involute gearing. Specifically, by cutting the teeth deeper he reduced the risk of debris in the tooth bottom(s) from affecting power transmission. A second implication is by cutting them deeper he also reduced the width of the tooth thereby reducing engaging friction noted in involute gearing. By reducing the PD of the pinion and also by lesser depthing of the wheel to pinion he should have been able to eliminate engaging friction. One of the major advantages of involute gearing is of course strength, and the strength would be severely impacted by the steps he took, but in a clock mechanism we really do not require a great deal of strength.

    I found the discussions and drawings of the Strasser clocks to be of interest......and a lot more in all 3 books. I have spent a lot of time on the books over the last 10 years or so, and I continue to find something every time I pick one of them up. Enjoy!
     
  6. tok-tokkie

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    Re: Owner built precision regulator - the beat goes on - pun intended!

    The weight swings when it is the same length as the pendulum (measured from anchor to center of weight). The period of the 2 is then the same so it is a case of sympathetic vibration. The force is transmitted through the framework - not air. Hence hanging the pendulum from the wall as against the case reduces the transmitted force and thus reduces the sympathetic vibration.
     
  7. jhe.1973

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    Re: Owner built precision regulator - the beat goes on - pun intended!

    Hi Everyone,

    Sorry, as usual, that I can’t get seem to get back here. I just haven’t been able to steal the time away for my clock.

    In fact, this is how it looks at the moment.

    Less Is More1.JPG

    Last evening as I was sitting in the recliner (just barely in the lower right of the photo) I wanted a place to set my tea.

    Yes, that’s it, my tea. :whistle:

    So, I pulled the lowest book (Less Is More) forward and pushed the rest back to form a little shelf.

    Less Is More2.JPG

    I laughed out loud when I uncovered the book’s subtitle. “A Practical Guide To Maximizing Space In Your Home”.

    I never knew maximizing space in the home could be so easy!

    Welcome to the asylum. :cyclops:
     
  8. jhe.1973

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    #58 jhe.1973, Apr 13, 2013
    Last edited: Apr 13, 2013
    Re: Owner built precision regulator - the beat goes on - pun intended!

    Hi Everyone,

    Nothing factual to report just yet but still have some info/ideas to pass on.

    I've mentioned that this prototype is varying in accuracy during the day.

    Soon, I will be purchasing a MicroSet timer w/software so I can plot the performance w/o having to be a slave to the clock during the entire day.

    But a few things have occurred to me because the performance seems a bit too random.

    I think that before I reduced the friction in the train as much as I have, the friction had an averaging effect on the power output to the escapement. If correct, this means that the train irregularities now act more directly on the pendulum and at least some of the errors are the result of circular error when the pendulum has a wider swing.

    Another thing happened to dawn on me though.

    Our city is situated on an ancient riverbed w/a rock shelf about 4 - 5 feet down. Most of the soil above this rock layer is silt w/a high clay content. Clay shrinks when it dries & expands when it take on moisture. Plus, most basements (there are VERY few) in our area have water problems from underground streams.

    Whenever it rains, several of our doors to the house won't shut properly until it dries out - one is about 4 feet from this clock.

    I think that I am reaching the point where I will not be able to really test this prototype until I build a decent footing for it & any clocks that follow.

    Another project for this summer! :whistle:
     
  9. jhe.1973

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    Re: Owner built precision regulator - the beat goes on - pun intended!

    Hi Everyone,

    A few weeks ago I purchased the master clock & slave pictured on the left in this photo:

    4-16-13.JPG

    It is running quite well & it has an invar pendulum shaft. Plus, it's swing is very stable as far as distance is concerned. However, as I am getting it regulated to within a few seconds of a digital WWV clock that I am using for my standard, I am seeing the same kind of drift that I mentioned with my regulator. It can (and does) vary several seconds either way throughout the day.

    I don't have the time to observe both continuously during a few 24 hour periods to see if they are both in step w/each other, but this further raises my suspicions that our house & local geology may have something to do w/it.

    I took this photo because I am planning to move the master clock - perhaps today - & I will see if the clock repeats the drift in the new location. I wanted a 'before' photo & then thought I'd post it here.
     
  10. harold bain

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    Re: Owner built precision regulator - the beat goes on - pun intended!

    Nice art deco IBM 25, Jim. Have you serviced the movement yet?
     
  11. Tinker Dwight

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    Re: Owner built precision regulator - the beat goes on - pun intended!

    When attached to a wood frame house, there are a lot of variables.
    As the house warms and cools, that wall changes its angle slightly.
    Density of the air makes a difference as well. Surprisingly, as the
    humidity goes up the density goes down ( as any airplane pilot
    will tell you ).
    The best you can do to isolate it is to make a boat using some type
    of fluid ( mercury is nice but nasty ), Make a mount that sits on the boat.
    That would isolate it from anything that is related to tilting.
    Tinker Dwight
     
  12. jhe.1973

    jhe.1973 Registered User
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    Re: Owner built precision regulator - the beat goes on - pun intended!

    Thanks Howard, & nope, I haven't taken the movement out yet. Too long a list of things to do before I can get to that.

    It looked really nice & clean & I didn't see any elongated pivot holes. Sooooooo, I ........... (heaven forbid) ........... oiled what I could get to & hoped for the best.

    I can hear the screams already. LOL

    :whistle:

    It's probably only for a month or two so I'm, willing to chance it. Pendulum swings nearly off the scale so I think I'll be OK.
     
  13. harold bain

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    Re: Owner built precision regulator - the beat goes on - pun intended!

    These movements seldom need more than cleaning. I don't recall ever having to bush one. Most of them have gone several decades by just being oiled, as that's what the servicemen normally would do, on their twice a year inspections for those under a maintenance contract. It wouldn't see shop repair til it won't run at all. But, I do recommend cleaning, just for peace of mind:whistle:. It will give you a better appreciation of the quality of the movement.
     
  14. jhe.1973

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    Re: Owner built precision regulator - the beat goes on - pun intended!

    Hi Everyone,

    I feel I have found the problem w/our fixer-upper house that causes the drift I have been experiencing w/my regulator and the IBM master that I showed recently.

    But first, I would like to show that I replaced the IBM master with a Synchronome I recently purchased:

    1.JPG

    With no gear train or escapement the Synchronome is drifting in the same, rather unpredictable manner.

    A little over a week ago the stucco buckled away from an outside wall in a new area. (white arrow below) I knew that there was some settling going on along this wall and wasn't thrilled that the driveway had been built up above the height of the sill w/no visible provision for drainage.

    2.JPG

    In the right close up above, the black outline shows where the Synchronome is located on the inside. I have been digging along the wall to get access to the sill & footing (if there is one) and today got the surprise of my life!

    When I pulled off the lowest siding board I found that, for a 6 foot length from the corner, there are no floor joists.

    Yikes!

    Instead this area has been filled with sand up to the subfloor! My guess is that the sand is supporting the tile surfaced, raised pad for the washer/dryer, hence the drainpipe protruding. Apparently some genius used the framework as a form for the sand & I have no idea where the floor joists now end. But they sure don't support the wall with it's roof load in this area:

    3.JPG 4.JPG 5.JPG

    Here is how it looks w/some of the sand removed & the sill cleaned off:

    7.JPG

    The narrow footing in the foreground is what was added for the stucco. The sill has been rotting/settling separately from this footing casuing the buckling.

    Gee ............. do ya think that this could be one of them thar variables that Tinker mentioned? :whistle:

    While I am on this subject, it is probably a good time to mention that this house & shop building are the primary reasons I can't get here as often as I would like. We were supposed to have $40,000.00 left from the sale of our last house to put into this one.

    Then came the real estate meltdown.

    I still feel fortunate to have a place with no mortgage, but I have to do whatever this place needs myself as we have the time & money.

    One upside in all of this is that I am not going to be so quick to blame my gearing for the drifting. :thumb:
     
  15. Tinker Dwight

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    Re: Owner built precision regulator - the beat goes on - pun intended!

    I find that unbelieveable that someone did that
    with the sand. Well Jim, you have your work cut out for
    you for some time.
    Between termites and rot, a lot of work to do.
    Tinker Dwight
     
  16. jhe.1973

    jhe.1973 Registered User
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    Re: Owner built precision regulator - the beat goes on - pun intended!

    When I started I figured on replacing the sill along this wall & picked up 5, 12 foot steel 'H' beams from craigslist 'cuz I have to lift/support the house & possibly need to pour a decent footing.

    This isn't the first house I've saved from collapse. But now that I have to hunt for floor joists, I think I get more steel while the seller still has more beams.

    So far, no evidence of termites (fingers crossed) but my summer has definitely changed!

    Hmmmnn, maybe I should write a book about all that I have been through to try & keep my 30+ year dream alive of building regulators.

    :)

    This is also a good time to thank all of you who are following this thread.

    It REALLY helps keep me going at times, knowing that there are others who have an interest here.

    It helps me fight off feelings of, "Why me?"

    :bang:
     
  17. jhe.1973

    jhe.1973 Registered User
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    #67 jhe.1973, Oct 7, 2013
    Last edited: Oct 7, 2013
    Re: Owner built precision regulator - the beat goes on - pun intended!

    Hi Everyone,

    I'm still alive in case any of you were wondering. :D

    I still don't know when I can get back here on a regular basis, but I felt that this was too good to wait with.

    In case some of you hadn't seen it, I posted an update to the Nano Oil thread back on 9-3-13 here:

    https://mb.nawcc.org/showthread.php?94121-Nano-oil-test-results-update/page2

    I showed the fact that the pendulum had picked up a noticeable amount of swing & I mentioned that we had a recent thunderstorm.

    Actually we had one of the rainiest months in years. It wasn't perhaps the wettest, but it was day after day where we had rain, even if it didn't last.

    For the last week or so, the pendulum has settled back to where it usually has been running in this house - but now the ground has dried out to where it usually is during the year.

    I'm not going to try to explain that, other than to repeat that we have a silty soil that has a high clay content.

    Gee, I wonder if there is a connection.

    So this was just an update about the unusual swing increase/decrease last month.

    Yesterday however, I noticed that the pendulum had a slight swing even though I pulled the movement out the day before.

    I am taking the movement w/me when I give a presentation to a NAWCC chapter in California next weekend.

    Last night the swing had stopped.

    Today I noticed that the swing had returned & I posted a YouTube video of it here:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ey0o0aPoQlQ

    This only shows me the futility of trying to get precision timekeeping when this house is moving as much as it does.

    Hmmmmm ............ You think perhaps I should turn the regulator into a seismograph?

    :confused: :D
     
  18. Jim DuBois

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    Re: Owner built precision regulator - the beat goes on - pun intended!

    Just a passing opinion, and we all know about opinions, but it seems you are pushing a long rope up a steep hill in regard to the movement you are seeing generated by your structure and how it affects your clock's timekeeping. From all the efforts you have already made to stabilize your clock I imagine you are fully cognizant of the issue. I have re-read this thread to see what all you have done to date. I remain impressed with your dedication and your precision craftsmanship. Also, from the thread there has been discussion in regard to Ward Goodrich's The Modern Clock and chapter 13. I find the discussion around the Waltham Watch Companies precision regulator clock and the efforts they made to make it's foundation rigid, useful. There are many other steps discussed that they took to achieve the most precision timekeeping possible in their day, many of which are of interest to those desiring precision mechanical timekeeping. But, it all starts with a very firm foundation.....

    My last "regulator", which was an IBM master clock similar to yours, I had it mounted on a thought to be rigid support affixed directly to a large concrete mass (my floor). Using the Microset timekeeping variations could be seen immediately when I ran the garage door up and down. I was surprised to put it mildly. Given your structural issues you picture above I understand why your clock has a couple of anomalies, I am sure you do too.....how is the work on the house progressing if I may ask?

    And as to what I learned from my experiments on the IBM? Mostly, a concrete pad with rebar reinforcement, measuring 40'x30' ranging in depth of 4" to over 24" at the footings, is not rigid enough nor vibration proof for precision mechanical timekeeping. My first hypothesis is it functions more like a drum head than a truly rigid footing. And a clue on that was the Microset would report slight variations when I walked across the concrete floor. When I used the 13" lathe or my larger mill it was even more affected. I am talking very small variations, but still measurable and certainly affecting timekeeping. Of course there is some possibility that the minute variations were caused by disruptions in air currents more than the transmissions of vibrations by the concrete?
     
  19. jhe.1973

    jhe.1973 Registered User
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    #69 jhe.1973, Oct 23, 2013
    Last edited: Oct 23, 2013
    Re: Owner built precision regulator - the beat goes on - pun intended!

    Hi Jim,

    Thank you so much for your thoughts and kind words about my efforts!

    :thumb:

    You are right about the task I have ahead of me (rope analogy). I have found that I thrive at tasks that seem huge and will keep going long after most others would give up. This can get me in trouble by taking on more than I can handle, so I have to careful of that downside.

    I’m not that good at it yet, but getting better.:whistle:

    As a person gets closer to perfection in anything, the challenges become greater and I find that fascinating and stimulating.

    I am reminded of the NAWCC bulletin article from several years ago where the author used a computer to review the results that Shortt had with his free pendulum clock. Shortt always felt it should have been better than it was. The reviewer made a good case that the variations Shortt was seeing were caused by the wobble of the Earth on its axis.

    Speaking of the work on the house, I have the critical area (where I discovered the sand) supported well enough to leave it for now & finish a machining project. I learned that my problems were not from underground streams (sinkholes) so I could take that breather.

    I am familiar with the Waltham example & probably won’t go quite that far. However, seeing as how I have so much foundation work to do with the house & know that I will hit a limestone shelf at 4 to 5 feet down, I will likely incorporate some type of rather massive footing for more experiments.

    My thoughts are to dig to this shelf and pour a concrete cap about 6 inches to 1 foot thick to get a level surface. Then use some type of resilient pad(s) to support another 3 to 4 feet of concrete. This major concrete mass will not touch the surrounding ground or building to further provide the isolation that Tinker mentioned above.

    That ought to do it. :D

    Recently when investigating seismometers, I read that steel rebar isn’t used in footings for them because it transmits vibration through the concrete. I found that interesting, especially in view of your experience with your floor. I am sure you are right about it acting as a drum head and perhaps the rebar contributes to magnifying your footsteps enough to show up with the Microset.

    When I attended the Precision Timekeeping seminar (1994 maybe?) in Ohio there was a lot of discussion and audience contributions to the subject of rigid footings.

    One person mentioned that the company he worked for built a building for some type of sensitive equipment. They found that the rising sun would put an uneven pressure (expansion) on the wall footings, starting at one end and moving towards the other as the day progressed. This daily variation was picked up by their equipment!

    Another person shared that he had a wall clock in a high rise office building and after several years he pulled the movement for cleaning/oiling. While the movement was out, the pendulum had more swing than it had when complete, so the movement was actually acting as a brake!

    My favorite quote from that seminar was from the person sitting next to me. He said, "I just realized that we are at the cutting edge of an obsolete technology."

    Ain't it great?

    :cyclops:
     
  20. Jim DuBois

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    Re: Owner built precision regulator - the beat goes on - pun intended!

    I love your quote, i think i will steal it and use it in my signature line…"at the leading edge of obsolete technology". It fits what we do very well I think. Regards your comments above, it sounds like you are well ahead of me in your considerations of "rigidity" and how to best accomplish a proper foundation. I was not aware that rebar might well transmit substantial vibration, it makes absolute sense now that you identify that possibility. We have a bit different problem here, no bed rock as much of this area floats on a combination of sand and red clay. I spoke with a well driller recently, he commented he could often drill 200 or 300 feet and not hit bedrock in areas around here. I was looking at drilling hole for several concrete piers which would comprise a solid foundation so I thought, but not the case...just a floating foundation, so it did occur to me that geology would also come into play if I were to build a really precision timepiece. I am not that good a clockmaker to build a mechanism accurate enough for all these more arcane issues to come into play, so it has become an exercise in futility I fear. Most recently I have been pursuing tidal equation solutions via mechanical means.....Sir Issac Newton is on record as saying such an effort was "above his reasoning abilities" and after some fair number of quick starts and quicker discovery of blind paths I understand why he took that position.
     
  21. jhe.1973

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    #71 jhe.1973, Oct 25, 2013
    Last edited: Oct 25, 2013
    Re: Owner built precision regulator - the beat goes on - pun intended!

    I just wish I could take credit for the quote.

    I have noted the irony - going through great pains to develop a regulator & use a MicroSet timer to check it when it would be so much simpler to use the same electronic technology to drive the pendulum.

    :cyclops:

    I also wonder about the solid foundation concept when it appears that Bernie Tekippe has apparently accomplished outstanding accuracy while breaking so many of the rules. i.e. a fairly light pendulum oscillating unenclosed and suspended from a rather light movement instead of a massive mount.

    http://nawcc.org/images/stories/2010/articles/2010/385/385_131.pdf

    It could just be that a light pendulum and not so rigid mount have a relationship similar to that of the balance wheel to the mass of a high-grade chronometer. The rigid mount idea may not be the last word after all!

    Corrections:

    I forgot to mention that the downward push of the wall would distort the concrete floor with it - like a membrane (drum head).

    Also, the Time Seminar was in 1992 - not 1994 as I had posted.

    I looked at your thread on the Tidal Calculation Time and found it VERY interesting. Just wish there were more hours in the day to look more deeply into it. I'm glad that you received those excellent responses.

    :thumb:

    I hope to get here a bit more often now that winter is approaching and I have finished a presentation that I delivered for 2 NAWCC chapters.

    For those of you that might be interested, here is a link to the outline I elaborated on for my talk entitled, "Enhancing Your Creativity and Applying it to Tool and Clock Making".

    http://higherlogicdownload.s3.amazonaws.com/NAWCC/bec93bd8-c8ca-4aa9-a17b-89a8cc6a3e0e/UploadedFiles/Presentation1.pdf

    Is that a shameless plug or what?

    :whistle:
     
  22. Jim DuBois

    Jim DuBois Registered User
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    Re: Owner built precision regulator - the beat goes on - pun intended!

    Jim, your outline of your talk is most impressive, and even more than being impressive it is quite useful. It is nice you have a background as a machinist. I don't have that background, and unfortunately it shows too much, being entirely self trained...and my instructor has often been wrong about so many things.

    You would laugh at my efforts this week of constructing a set of motion works for a street clock. Kinda' round and partially concentric are two terms that come to mind. Why are my duplicate parts so different? Oh well, I continue to learn. Need to get back in the swing of things and focus on doing things right the first time.

    Regards the Bernie Tekippe paper and clock. I have carefully read the paper several times, I have looked over the subject timepiece in person when he had it in Houston at the regional in I think 2011.

    He has some good ideas and seems to get outstanding results. I think the proof of the pudding would be others duplicating his designs and obtaining similar results. This is not intended to be a cheap shot at him or his work, just a recommendation to follow scientific methods in evaluation of the published results.

    All I care to say further is "innovative" and the recorded results "defy conventional wisdom".

    And just for grins attached is one of my efforts at a lecture for making a rack...I discovered there were only 3 people in the world interested in making racks, and I was one of the three....
     

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  23. jhe.1973

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    Re: Owner built precision regulator - the beat goes on - pun intended!

    Hi Jim,

    Thanks for viewing the outline and I am glad that you found it useful. Even though we never seemed to have had the latest of anything, I always felt privileged to have access to my dad's shop and his knowledge.

    Your mention of your instructor reminds me of my experience with the person who I learned clock repair from. He was not wrong with what he knew and did great work, but I could see before long that he was not able to answer many questions that I was asking due to his not being a builder.

    This is not to disparage clock repair persons nor ignore the fact that great repair/restoration work requires great craftsmanship.

    I had the items on display for my presentation that are in the photos of the outline. I mentioned that I knew quite a few skilled tool & die makers, mold/pattern makers, machinists etc. who could duplicate anything I had done, however it was another thing to come up with designs of their own.

    Laugh at your efforts? Never, I feel that’s a sure way to discourage people.

    I forgot about this until you mentioned, “Kinda' round and partially concentric” cuz’ that describes the pinwheel in my prototype.

    After cutting the installed pins to their center (to reduce the drop) I found that some were cut deeper than others were. I still don’t know which setup created the eccentricity.

    Only when the pendulum is just barely unlocking the escapement can you clearly hear the movement go in and out of beat. Once it has ¼ degree of run or more it sounds fine.

    I tend to agree with your position about others duplicating the reported results of the Tekippe regulator. At the end of the Bulletin article he said, “The design of the Simple Regulator is presented here so it can be further developed.” I already have a few ideas about how to incorporate some of his features into my second-generation movement.

    I put my copy of the April 2010 bulletin aside so I would one day do just that. Now I can’t find it since we moved! It will turn up one of these days.

    Your rack cutting looks to be pretty much the way I would do it if I ever had to.

    Only 3? Really? :D
     
  24. jhe.1973

    jhe.1973 Registered User
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    Re: Owner built precision regulator - the beat goes on - pun intended!

    Hi Jim,

    I forgot to ask if you are aware of the Home Shop Machinist forum. I am as active as I can be on that one also and feel that it is the best one on the web for finding a community of knowledgeable people willing to help out those looking for machining help. I split my online contributions between this one and HSM depending on subject matter and where the interest lies.

    Case in point. I started a thread on both forums on 8-1-13. On the HSM forum it now has 9918 views and 69 responses. On the NAWCC forum it has 490 views and I am the only one to respond to it when I updated it once. Here is the HSM thread where I continued to post because of the greater interest:

    http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net/threads/60225-Modified-Spindex?highlight=Modified+spindex

    When I started contributing to forums I was on a different machinist one and lost interest. It clearly had some great talent, but it reminded me too much of some of the shops I have worked in where egos got in the way of helping others. :whistle:

    I just received my Home Shop Machinist magazine and noticed an ad for the NAWCC so our organization is aware of theirs.

    Hope this is of some help.

    :thumb:
     
  25. Jim DuBois

    Jim DuBois Registered User
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    Re: Owner built precision regulator - the beat goes on - pun intended!

    Jim,

    I have been a long term subscriber to the Home Shop Machinist, as well as the Digital Machinist, and Machinist's Workshop. I have not been a subscriber to forum however. I joined today....awaiting moderator approval. Appreciate the recommendation. I am pretty well read on many things mechanical, and I have done much clockwork, wheel cutting, making of clock parts, construction of clock mechanisms, building of cases, restorations of many antique clocks...but all that said, I am a sorry machinist compared to the work you and others do. And I have seen your spindex modifications someplace, maybe it was here. Very nicely done.

    I moved into CNC gear cutting many years ago using equipment I built or modified running a DOS based SW program a friend wrote for me, so most of my dividing heads and spin fixtures are long gone. I use the CNC mill. a Tormach, for cutting gears and pinions and the like and still use an older CNC mill by Light Machines, Manchester NH to cross out wheel blanks, cut out rack blanks, engrave dials, and generally make repetitive parts with....here is an example of a dial in progress as well as installed on a tower clock. The short story is the CNC machine is a far better machinist than I will ever be....but your work reminds me of what I am still missing......

    I also understand your meaning regarding the different response between the two sites you cite....I have noticed a drop in activity here, have not attempted to verify it, just an opinion. I am not very active here, or elsewhere, as it frequently seems to be an exercise in teaching pigs to sing.....it seems to waste my time and irritate the audience....so.......
     

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  26. jhe.1973

    jhe.1973 Registered User
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    Re: Owner built precision regulator - the beat goes on - pun intended!

    Hi Everyone,

    This last year has been a blur with all that has been going on!

    Thank you all for continuing to view this thread and I am sorry that it has take me so long to get back here.

    About a month ago I FINALLY got a new roof over my shop so I could remove the tarps from all my machines & tools.

    Yes, it was that bad.

    I am now able to set up a floor plan as I want, not as roof leaks dictate. :excited:

    Lately I have been involved in helping strip an 8000 square foot underground structure last used as a communications hub. It will be a private residence.

    DSC02793a.jpg

    I sure wish I was rich 'cuz the raised concrete floor is vibration isolated from the rest of the building. It would have made a great lab for precision timekeeping experiments.

    However I am excited about this prize:

    DSC02795a.jpg

    At 22 feet down and weighing close to 14,000 pounds its a wee bit more than I need, BUT, the vibration isolation should be a big help in my experiments w/o all the work I was thinking of doing.

    It has a large steel channel frame within the outside frame and is isolated at each corner with 2 rubber mounts as shown here:

    DSC_0036a.JPG

    Salvaging the outside frame and mounts is relatively easy and I will be able to cut it down to something more manageable for my clock experiments.

    I realize that the genset vibration isn't the same as ground tremors, but it seems that it should be a good starting off point to create an isolated platform with considerable mass. After all, the rubber mounts have already proven themselves able to support 7 tons!

    There is also a lot of electrical misc. and all of it was vibration isolated. I think that there is quite a bit of stuff that will lend itself to measuring ground tremors & comparing them to the platform surface where I will mount my clock movements.

    So, life continues to be interesting...................to say the least.

    I feel like Dr. Frankenstein setting up his lab! :screwball:
     
  27. jhe.1973

    jhe.1973 Registered User
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    Re: Owner built precision regulator - the beat goes on - pun intended!

    Hi Everyone,

    I just found that I never posted my original sketch that I followed for the construction of my prototype.

    I did use it in the presentation I mentioned in post #71 and thought I had it here too.

    OOPS!

    So, here it is in all it's glory and sophistication. :whistle:

    Original sketch2.JPG
     
  28. jhe.1973

    jhe.1973 Registered User
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    Re: Owner built precision regulator - the beat goes on - pun intended!

    Just trying to keep up with all that is going on.

    At my shop, this is how I unloaded the outer frame from the generator I showed above:

    IMG_1339a.JPG

    I sure like my tow truck. :excited: Doesn't everyone need one for clock building? :whistle:
     
  29. harold bain

    harold bain Registered User
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    Re: Owner built precision regulator - the beat goes on - pun intended!

    I don't know about clock building with a tow truck, Jim, but I could have used one last month after our big ice storm. But I managed to pull it off with a rope on my trailer hitch.
     

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  30. jhe.1973

    jhe.1973 Registered User
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    Re: Owner built precision regulator - the beat goes on - pun intended!

    Hi Harold,

    Oh yeah, ice storms. I remember them well. We didn't have them too often in Wisconsin where I grew up but in March 0f '76 we had a doozy.

    On the north side of our house, where the freezing rain came off the roof, we still had ice on the ground a few inches thick in June!

    Did that limb miss your SUV?
     
  31. harold bain

    harold bain Registered User
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    Re: Owner built precision regulator - the beat goes on - pun intended!

    Yes, not even a scratch. I had to pull the branch towards the road until it dropped off the tree to be sure it wouldn't run along the side of the truck when it fell. Next year's fire wood.:)
     
  32. jhe.1973

    jhe.1973 Registered User
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    #82 jhe.1973, Jan 20, 2014
    Last edited: Jan 20, 2014
    Re: Owner built precision regulator - the beat goes on - pun intended!

    Hi Everyone,

    Just going thru some of my files and I came across this one for my prototype that I use as a quick reference when I have another hair-brained idea. It saves me having to re-figure this stuff if I need to calculate a modification.

    Winding Drum & weight Specifications.JPG

    This is the Word doc. itself:

    View attachment Winding Drum & weight Specifications.doc

    By printing this out you can actually use it to ignite kindling in a stove, or at a campfire.

    :whistle:

    P.S. I just realized that if you have a large format printer and enlarge it to fill the bigger paper you can wrap fish w/it also.

    Gosh, I'm on a roll!

    :screwball:
     
  33. jhe.1973

    jhe.1973 Registered User
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    #83 jhe.1973, Jan 21, 2014
    Last edited: Jan 22, 2014
    Re: Owner built precision regulator - the beat goes on - pun intended!

    Hi Everyone,

    I believe I warned everyone that I have a bizarre sense of humor, if not consider yourself warned:

    Spent a few hours today at the underground building I mentioned. This caught my eye & gave me a chuckle.

    IMG_1345a.jpg

    At first I thought it funny that it would have a test button for a nuclear blast detector & then thought it even funnier that it would have a reset button.

    "Gee Frank, that last blast didn't go so well - let's push the reset button and restore civilization."

    :D
     
  34. harold bain

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    Re: Owner built precision regulator - the beat goes on - pun intended!

    Any instructions with it, Jim? Something like "if this device activates, remain in building for 6 months minimum"?
     
  35. jhe.1973

    jhe.1973 Registered User
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    Re: Owner built precision regulator - the beat goes on - pun intended!

    Nope Harold, no instructions that I saw but 6 months wouldn't be a bad idea.

    :thumb:
     
  36. jhe.1973

    jhe.1973 Registered User
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    Re: Owner built precision regulator - the beat goes on - pun intended!

    Hi Everyone,

    A couple of weeks ago I contributed to a thread that tok-tokie started asking for data concerning the power to drive clocks:

    https://mb.nawcc.org/showthread.php?108078-What-power-needed-to-drive-various-clocks#top

    I mentioned that I was going to remove two lead filled pendulum tubes from my clock to see if the lighter pendulum would require less weight to run the clock. As I was getting ready to do the experiment, I realized that, to be as accurate as possible, I should keep the pendulum bob as close the same shape when it was lighter.

    I dug around and found some electrical tubing that only needed a small amount of material to be removed to be the same O.D. as my pendulum tubes. I also made aluminum caps for the bottom of these tubes so the overall shape would stay the same.

    Here is the before photo w/weight at 26.9 pounds:

    Before.jpg

    Here is the finished lighter assembly at 13.9 pounds:

    Lightened.jpg

    This is a view of the maximum travel before the test:

    1-23-14 before2.JPG

    The original weight at the start of the test was 5 pounds, 15.4 ounces. I was quite surprised to find that it took 6 pounds 5 ounces to bring the pendulum back up to the above shown swing.

    At tok-tokie’s thread, kdf mentioned that the weight of the bob should have no effect on the weight required.

    I’ve heard this through the years but because of so many of my experiments required me to remove driving weight when my pendulum travel would increase I was not ready to accept this.

    Clearly my experiment showed I was wrong but I couldn’t figure out why until I realized that the power to swing the pendulum is not supplied by the clock movement. The person starting the pendulum swinging supplies it and the movement only supplies power to keep it swinging.

    The additional power required for the lighter bob is probably explained by the lighter bob having a harder time with the air resistance than the heavier bob.

    At least that’s my guess.

    :whistle:
     
  37. jhe.1973

    jhe.1973 Registered User
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    #87 jhe.1973, Feb 6, 2014
    Last edited: Feb 6, 2014
    Re: Owner built precision regulator - the beat goes on - pun intended!

    For my next trick....................

    I spent a few days installing ball bearings on both ends of the great wheel arbor and the front of the second arbor. This is a view of the inside of the front plate:

    5.jpg

    Here is a close up of the bearing mount showing the relief so that the inner race cannot contact the bottom:

    6.JPG

    Here is the setup in my mill where I was centering the spindle over the second arbor pivot hole. I was pleasantly surprised to learn that after 30+ years of fairly steady running, all 3 holes showed absolutely no wear with a .001 inch dial indicator. I could easily keep the needle steady all the way around the hole:

    7.JPG

    Here I just finished boring the great wheel hole in the rear plate:

    8.JPG

    While set up in the mill, I transferred the screw holes for the old sapphire endstone holders to the bearing mounts I had made first:

    9.JPG

    To turn down the arbors in my regular lathe, I supported the right end in a brass piece held in the drill chuck - a sort of poor man's steady rest:

    10.JPG

    More to follow..........................
     
  38. jhe.1973

    jhe.1973 Registered User
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    #88 jhe.1973, Feb 6, 2014
    Last edited: Feb 6, 2014
    Re: Owner built precision regulator - the beat goes on - pun intended!

    When I assembled the plates with these 2 arbors I was back where I was 30 years ago with binding teeth.

    Way back, I mentioned the slight curve I ended up with after milling the teeth and it once again was causing a problem. The binding was between the great wheel and the meshing pinion.

    I hoped that by thinning the wheel I could possibly save some work. I held it like so, and took 1/8 inch off this side and cut the round groove to save a bit of weight:

    12.JPG

    I also cut a similar groove in the opposite side:

    13.JPG

    I still had binding so.................time to start filing teeth again. Lucky for me I have a stereo microscope now so the task was MUCH easier. Still time consuming, but easier:

    14.JPG

    The tiny file I use is shown laying on the plate at an angle. Here is a close up where you can see where I marked binding teeth with a fine point marker:

    15.jpg

    This is a view through the eyepiece to show where the filing is needed at each place the black is scraped off. The file looks like a rasp at this magnification:

    16.JPG

    Here is the result of my efforts:

    2-6-14 after w-6 lbs.JPG

    The pendulum has LESS power than it had before I started as seen in my above post about the lighter pendulum.

    Quite a disappointment!

    I even took the movement apart to clean the tiny amount of Nano oil I put on the ball bearings, thinking that maybe the Nano particles were acting as dirt interfering with the rolling action of the balls.

    The power went down a bit indicating the Nano oil wasn't the problem.

    The next time I get a chance to get into this I will open up the bore slightly of the bearing holders opposite the gearing. I have endshake at each bearing, but MAYBE if the bearing is allowed to slide in it's bore it will self-align a bit.

    This principle is used in some high-speed spindles to allow for expansion so its worth a shot.

    I'm not holding my breath though because the lack of wear in the pivot holes indicates I did something right.

    The hard bronze bushings and hard endstones may be difficult to beat w/o using jeweled bearings.

    I can see my next change coming now. :screwball:
     
  39. tok-tokkie

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    Re: Owner built precision regulator - the beat goes on - pun intended!

    So keeping the same aerodynamic shape but reducing the mass (and thus the inertia) has required an increase in drive weight to give the same amplitude of swing. The inertia was about halved but the drive weight had to be increased about 6% to restore the amplitude. I don’t understand why that should be as the air resistance is unchanged & that is all there is taking energy from the pendulum once it has settled down. Clearly, from your result, a change in weight has an inverse effect.

    In the case of the clock I am making I too have a poor drive train. Mine is a gravity escape. The advantage of a gravity escape is the impulse from the pallet is unaffected by the condition of the drive train – the impulse is not provided directly from the drive train as the drive train raises the pallet while the pallet is detached from the pendulum. Later the pendulum collects the raised pallet which then gives the pendulum its impulse. However the problem is that when the pendulum unlocks the escape the force required is affected by the drive train & that is why my clock is erratic. It varies about 4 seconds/day. I am currently making a remontoire so that the torque at the escape wheel will be really consistent so the unlocking force should be consistent and, hopefully, the clock will be consistent. I would like a second per week and would love a second per month.

    But I have learned a lot from this. The simple pendulum equation T=πSQRT(L/g) made me think all I need to do is provide temperature compensation so that L remains constant & T would be constant (since the other 2 terms are constant). I know about circular error so I have a scale rule so I can read the swing to about 0.25mm & it does vary a little but the corresponding circular error is insignificant compared to the 4 second/day variation I am experiencing. So, it seems to me, that variation in the load to unlock the escape affects the period of the pendulum without materially affecting the swing. I am going to build a timer that lmester is making. Then I will be able to really see what is going on. I am disappointed but also intrigued by what is going on in my clock.

    You have found the required drive weight has changed. Have you also found the same result as i have = changed drive weight alters the forces at the escape & those alterations also affect the period of the pendulum even though the length & amplitude do not change? I appreciate that in a pin wheel (or dead beat) it is mainly the impulse that changes when the drive weight changes.

    My gears are obviously much worse than yours as, when I reduce the drive weight to be marginal, I can hear & even see the escape struggling to index. I am able to adjust the depthing of my train – even while the clock is running – but even so I can’t get an even load at the escape. Rather than make a new set of gears I have elected to fit a remontoire. Not least because it will be an interesting addition to the clock & all the mechanism will be on display. But I was interested and impressed by your equipment and method of adjusting the gears. Sad to see that you thinned the wheel. It does surprise me that the amplitude reduced after the train was corrected. My experience with my clock has been that I need to increase the drive weight significantly after each disassembly & let the clock run for 2 or 3 days like that during which it settles down and seems to adjust itself. Then I can go back to the usual drive weight. If I start with the usual drive weight the clock slowly settles down over about a week – increasing the drive weight seems to shorten that period.
     
  40. John MacArthur

    John MacArthur Registered User
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    Re: Owner built precision regulator - the beat goes on - pun intended!

    The first item above is somewhat counter-intuitive, but actually makes sense. The restoring force on the pendulum (from the ends of the arc to the center, which is what "keeps it swinging") is reduced when the bob mass is reduced, and so the bob is more affected by the viscosity and bouyancy of the air. The more massive the bob is, per volume, the more self-sustaining it is, and the less driving force it requires. A friend of mine has made a pendulum with a large tungsten bob, which is terrifically stable, and much less affected by air density changes.

    The second item above is also a little complicated. The dead-beat escapement, depending on the impulse face angle and the condition of the dead face surfaces, can actually reduce in pendulum amplitude when more driving weight is applied. In other words, sometimes, the drag on the dead faces has more effect than the increased impulse, in terms of the arc, when more drive weight is applied. This has caused much hair-tearing and gnashing of teeth.


    John MacArthur
     
  41. Jim DuBois

    Jim DuBois Registered User
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    #91 Jim DuBois, Feb 7, 2014
    Last edited: Feb 7, 2014
    Re: Owner built precision regulator - the beat goes on - pun intended!

    While a reduction in pendulum mass would generate a reduction in amplitude might well be explained by a loss of "Q" in the bob itself could it not? The attached article suggests that could be the cause of this apparent anomaly in your mechanism as I read it. Just a thought....and the article should give us all cause for additional thought...
     

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  42. jhe.1973

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    #92 jhe.1973, Feb 8, 2014
    Last edited: Feb 8, 2014
    Re: Owner built precision regulator - the beat goes on - pun intended!

    Hi tok-tokie,

    Thanks for checking in here. I was having a bit of a hard time deciding where to address this (your thread or mine) and hoped to get to your thread to let you know of these tests.

    I feel that John & Jim have both contributed more complete info as to the matter of air resistance vs. bob mass. I hope that this has helped - it has for me and I thank both of you.

    I really can't add anything to your details about your gravity escapement 'cuz I have no experience w/one.

    Your remontoire idea sounds quite interesting and I would like to see that along with your movement if you have the time to post photos. I'll check your thread to see if you post views. I think it would be a better fit there.

    The only results I can comment on concerning the weight and pendulum came from any/all experiment(s) to reduce friction, measured by the increased pendulum swing. When the swing would get too large, around two degrees in each direction, I would have to reduce the weight to avoid the pendulum shaft hitting the hook I made to catch it in case of a suspension spring failure.

    I haven't found that the period was altered (other than probable circular error) but never went looking for that possibility either.

    I'm in the same boat as you concerning the quality of the gearing. Rather than making new wheels I chose to remove the binding areas.

    We are just looking to different methods to deal with what we know isn't quite right.

    My experience with the drive weight when first started is identical to yours. In each of these last two tests I ran the clock for two days with 8 pounds to accelerate the settling down process.

    Way back in this thread I mentioned that the biggest improvement I first found in reducing the friction was the addition of endstones to the great wheel arbor.

    Because of the above, I am suspecting that the drop in power that I have found with the ball bearings has to do with one or more of them having a side load.

    The arbors were crowned on the ends and highly polished so that the endshake was at the center of the arbor.

    If the ball bearing(s) have a side load, the contact of the balls is at a larger distance from the center of the shaft. As the endshake contact moves farther from the arbor center, the friction has more leverage & a greater effect. Plus, having more contact area with several balls doesn't help either.

    The thought has occurred to me that I could make a new great wheel that has a slightly larger in O.D. so that I could cut a better shaped tooth that would mesh more correctly with the pinion.

    However, I am at a point where I am asking myself how much more I should play with this first movement seeing as how I have the second generation one 70 - 80% completed and I know the new one has MUCH better gearing.

    I agree that the wider gear looked more impressive so I was a bit sad also to thin it. But I was looking for a quick way out to eliminate the filing. Still had to, but at least it wasn't as much.

    There is plenty of merit in keeping each wheel as light as possible to reduce the flywheel effect as each arbor has to be accelerated from a dead stop with each tick. That's why I cut the grooves I showed while I was narrowing the teeth anyway.
     
  43. jhe.1973

    jhe.1973 Registered User
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    Re: Owner built precision regulator - the beat goes on - pun intended!

    From the article that Jim provided, "Is your bob in better shape?" I typed the second paragraph that pretty well sums up the relationship of mass to "Q" of the pendulum:

    "The Bateman experiments

    For pendulums, improvements are possible by two direct methods. One is to increase the density of the bob for given volume to increase the stored energy, and the other is to decrease the air resistance. Both methods improve the ratio of stored energy to the energy lost per period - in other words the quality factor, Q. Both changes will be seen as common sense as, if nothing that, reducing the air resistance could reduce the driving weight and stress on a train."

    It was a bit too blurry for me & I had to enhance it in a photo program to read it. Hope this is of some help!

    Thanks for posting it Jim!

    :thumb:
     
  44. Jim DuBois

    Jim DuBois Registered User
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    #94 Jim DuBois, Feb 8, 2014
    Last edited: Feb 8, 2014
    Re: Owner built precision regulator - the beat goes on - pun intended!

    apologies to all, here is the PDF version which is a bit more useable.......
     

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  45. tok-tokkie

    tok-tokkie Registered User

    Nov 25, 2010
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    Re: Owner built precision regulator - the beat goes on - pun intended!

    I am pleased you posted the tests with your clock rather than the power thread I started. This is a seriously delightful clock.

    I have a copy of that pdf. that Jim posted. My bob is now ellipsoidal but only filled with lead. It was only when I considered Allan’s query about his bob that I realised that making tungsten/lead ‘concrete’ would give a superior bob & I have plenty of old tungsten carbide milling cutter inserts that I could have used. https://mb.nawcc.org/showthread.php?98369-Building-a-Strasser-Regulator-Clock/page5 The Q of my pendulum is 16 500.

    I have started making the remontoire. It is based on a Huygens endless belt; a variation on the Robin remontoire as described by Mark Frank here; http://www.my-time-machines.net/horz_2_train4.htm. I posted a video of my clock years ago when I first got it to tick: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AuIZe-7dcRs It shows the general tower style clock. At that stage it was on a shelf jutting out from the top of an old fridge in my office/store with a jerry can of water as the drive weight. During that video the clock was being heavily over driven yet you can see it almost stalls at one point. I was surprised that a 30 legged version of a gravity escape had not been made previously so I wanted to place it on public record so that the idea would be associated with me. I have started to draft a thread for this board but it will be many months before I am ready to post it.
     
  46. tok-tokkie

    tok-tokkie Registered User

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    Re: Owner built precision regulator - the beat goes on - pun intended!

    I was thinking about the endstones and your thoughts about axial load on the bearings. In engineering installations only one bearing is trapped axially. The other bearing can move axially so that as the shaft expands & contracts because of temperature changes the one bearing can move otherwise huge forces could develop. In a clock the shaft length is small and, with thermostatically controlled homes, the temperature range is very little so the amount of expansion is little. We have both found that our clocks settle down after a few days after dismantling. I attribute it to exactly that - the bearings moving under the axial loads so the forces reduce and the clock runs more freely.

    Here is a link showing the installation of a shaft in two ball bearings. http://www.rbcbearings.com/thinsectionbearings-industrial/mounting.htm
    In my clock only one bearing on each shaft is firmly fixed - it has been more by accident than intent but I have matched the bearing hangers deliberately to give that arrangement.
     
  47. jhe.1973

    jhe.1973 Registered User
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    Re: Owner built precision regulator - the beat goes on - pun intended!

    Hi Everyone,

    Well, I finally stole some time last week to play with my movement.

    On the second arbor I bored the front bearing hole .005 inch deeper and polished the arbor for a slip fit. For the great wheel arbor I already had a slip fit for the bearing O.D. and just needed to polished the arbor for the slip fit.

    It made no difference.

    :confused:

    AAARRRRRRRGHHHHH! There, I feel much better now!

    When I put just one ball bearing on the second arbor a couple of years ago, it made a big improvement. I am thinking that now, w/the additional ball bearings, the arbors are held more precisely so my not so good a tooth shape has more negative effect.

    I may try using the sapphire end stones again (w/the ball bearings). This might tell me if the larger diameter radius the balls run in is adding friction.

    I just want to mention that I found the settling down issue years ago, long before I installed any ball bearings. So, I have to look elsewhere.
     
  48. jhe.1973

    jhe.1973 Registered User
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    One more thing.

    I finished the outside work on the house, where I showed last year, and discovered another area needing attention along the wall where my clock is mounted.

    I'll get to this new spot this summer.

    Just the other day I was sitting in my recliner and I noticed the weight swinging again when it was down near the pendulum.

    I mentioned this had stopped when I relocated the upper pulley at the case top - so my curiosity was up.

    Then, while I was standing in front of the clock to be sure that the weight was actually swinging I heard a large gust of wind outside and realized that we were having one of our usual spring windstorms.

    Problem solved! Rubber house strikes again!

    :whistle:
     
  49. jhe.1973

    jhe.1973 Registered User
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    Hi Everyone,

    Sorry that I haven't been back here lately. Besides my regular work, I now am responsible for removing the generator from the underground building that I showed in back in post #76. I have moved it to another area of the building so work can continue where it was.

    A few weeks ago my clock stopped & I figured it was just time for a cleaning.

    When I went to re-start it, the pendulum was hitting the beat plate slightly at the end of it's travel (it is slightly concave).

    Turned out that the wedge I had between the cabinet & the wall (at the bottom left of the case) had worked its way down due to building movement. This pushed the cabinet forward & into the pendulum.

    10-4-14.jpg

    I've grown (or should I say groan :cyclops: ?) weary of trying to obtain precision time with the problems that this house has. So I have started building a stand that will hold the clock independently of any walls.

    Stand2a.jpg

    I'll post more as I can get more shop time.
     
  50. jhe.1973

    jhe.1973 Registered User
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    Hi Everyone,

    For the last month or so, it seemed to me that the pendulum has been swinging a bit more than it had since my post back in February & I FINALLY got around to checking on it.

    To save having to scroll back & forth here is the photo from then with the date added:

    2-6-14 after w-6 lbs.JPG

    Here it is today:

    11-19-14.JPG

    For those of you who remember, I have learned that it takes over a pound of additional driving weight to gain this much swing.

    Or stated another way, reducing the friction to accomplish this much additional swing would be the equivalent of a pound or more driving weight at the great wheel.

    Seeing as how I have done nothing to this movement since February, I suspect that over the past months slight binding, that I could not feel in the gearing when I was filing teeth (the clock's - not mine :cyclops:), is being reduced by 'wearing in'.

    I think this is especially noteworthy because the lubrication will certainly have dried out a bit, especially at the pallets.

    So, I feel a lot better about the work I did to install the ball bearings.

    :thumb:
     

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