Need Help Determining E. Howard Pocket Watch Type

Discussion in 'American Pocket Watches' started by jtrockboy, Mar 18, 2017.

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  1. jtrockboy

    jtrockboy Registered User

    Mar 17, 2017
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    New to the forum and I must say, it's extremely informative, helpful, and friendly.

    Despite doing hours of research looking at numerous threads and suggested links, I can't nail down exactly what kind of E. Howard pocket watch I have. As I've learned reading many threads here - serial numbers, manufacture dates, and series types can be confusing and difficult to determine. I'm posting a few pictures, so hopefully someone can set me straight

    IMG_0846.jpg IMG_0847.jpg IMG_0851.jpg IMG_0852.jpg IMG_0861.jpg
     
  2. Tom McIntyre

    Tom McIntyre Technical Admin
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    You have a fairly early E. Howard Watch Co. (Keystone Howard) with 21 jewels and exposed Geneva stop works. These were made around 1908, I think. The exposed Geneva mechanism on the barrel is relatively uncommon. I have a few of these and like them.
     
  3. jtrockboy

    jtrockboy Registered User

    Mar 17, 2017
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    Thanks for the response. For some reason, it looked to me like "17 jewels", so thanks for the clarification. From what I've read, the case is gold filled? Any idea what series it is? Size? And is the serial number "8060423"?

    Thanks again for the assistance.
     
  4. Tom McIntyre

    Tom McIntyre Technical Admin
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    My apologies for misreading the jewel mark. It is 17 jewels. This particular model was also made in 19 jewels but I have not seen a 19J with the Geneva stop works. The serial number is 1061550. It is most often 12/14 size with an oversize pillar plate to make it appear especially thin. The case is gold filled.
     
  5. Dave Chaplain

    Dave Chaplain Registered User
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  6. LloydB

    LloydB Registered User

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    #6 LloydB, Mar 19, 2017
    Last edited: Mar 19, 2017
    The Price Guide (OTOH) describes this one as
    12s series 7.

    The movement serial number is 1061550
    (estimated around 1911, by the same source)
    but the dating of these serial numbers is sketchy.

    Dave, thanks for posting that ad page - lots of
    information there, that I hadn't seen previously.
     
  7. Kent

    Kent Registered User
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    Series numbers were applied to Howard's 12-size watches, as seen in the 1911 catalog page linked to by Dave. If you look at the catalog numbers of the 12-size, 17-jewels watches on that page you'll see that they are all in the 700's, Howard's way of designating them as Series 7. Refer to the section of the Encyclopedia article entitled "Series Number."
     
  8. jtrockboy

    jtrockboy Registered User

    Mar 17, 2017
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    Lots of great info. Thanks to all. So it looks like:

    12-Size
    17 Jewel
    Series 7
    Fitted in "Jas. Boss" Gold Filled Case
    Open Face Plain or E.T.

    What does "Plain" and "E.T." designate? Any ideas which one my watch is?

    What is the "8060423" number listed on the case? I also noticed part of that number, "60423" is outside the movement. Does it designate something specific?

    Thanks again for the responses. I'm finding all this quite fascinating and interesting.
     
  9. Tom McIntyre

    Tom McIntyre Technical Admin
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    Plain means a smooth polished finish to the case. E.T. means engine turned or barleycorn appearance on the surface. Each of the case pieces is marked with some or all of the case serial number to assist in manufacturing.
     
  10. Kent

    Kent Registered User
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    If, after reading Tom's descriptions, you have trouble understanding which your case is (Plain or E.T.), you'll have to post a picture of the outside of the back for use to be able to identify it for you.
     
  11. jtrockboy

    jtrockboy Registered User

    Mar 17, 2017
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    Here you go:

    IMG_0933.jpg
     
  12. richiec

    richiec Registered User
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    Engine turned.
     
  13. jtrockboy

    jtrockboy Registered User

    Mar 17, 2017
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    Thank you.

    Any links to the price guide?

    And one last question to the forum, I'm going to look into getting the watch professionally cleaned and lubricated, and wanted to find out what I should expect as far as a reasonable cost.
     
  14. LloydB

    LloydB Registered User

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    The "Complete Price Guide to Watches" Shugart, Engel and Gilbert

    is printed yearly, and is available in most large booksellers as well
    as many libraries.

    Copies are also offered on that E-auction site.

    It's a good general resource, but not the last word.
     
  15. Kent

    Kent Registered User
    NAWCC Member

    It may be helpful for you to read the Encyclopedia article on [main="Watch Service"]Watch Service[/main] and its related links, especially the one to the message board thread on the subject. The Encyclopedia article on Choosing a Pocket Watch Repair Person may be useful as well.
     
  16. jtrockboy

    jtrockboy Registered User

    Mar 17, 2017
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    I'll check them out, thank you, and much thanks to everyone for their guidance and assistance. I've already learned a lot, and am looking to learn more.
     
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