More Ansonia Strike Train Help Needed

Savageblunder

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C6486B05-4CB4-4C86-99EE-3848F9BA0E3C.png Hello clock gurus. I posted before for help on this Ansonia mantle clock 5.5 movement & strike train. So the little gear that drives the stop wheel was just spinning on its’ arbor (gear C below pic). The press fit was “stripped”. I knurled & Loctited it and that worked. Reassetmbled - and now a new issue.

The strike train sticks. It seemed to run ok before. I double checked I didn’t bend the arbor the gear I repaired is on when I knurled it. Spun it in a drill and it looked strait. Seems to be plenty of power in the spring. Nothing is jammed; as the strike train will run under a little assistance; takes off - then peters out before It locks. This is holding the locking levers up manually - so it’s not an issue there.

It looks to me like the lantern pinions are worn(pic above). Wondering if this could be the issue? The bushings all seem ok. Something is binding a bit; but not jammed or seized. It also looks like the gear I worked on (C in pic below) is rough. Probably hard to see in the pics; but it looked a bit rough before I was working on it. All teeth are there.

Another possibility is the arbor that the gear I repaired is mounted to looks like it barely may be coming into contact with another brass wheel (circled in black and red - last pic). That arbor seems overly thick to me - I’m wondering if it was replaced at one point? It’s so close to the brass wheel - it’s hard to tell if there is an air gap or not between the two. I tried to file that arbor down a bit where it looks to possible contact the brass wheel - and it seemed to help. However, I oiled the bushings as the same time; so not sure what helped?

Any ideas before I tear this apart again?

9AFE7092-41C6-425B-B535-9C3F19C8732A.jpeg

8D8B98CD-C9C4-4D35-83E5-B39599609A1F.jpeg
 

Kevin W.

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The stop wheel you are refering to is it the fly? If so it should and has to be able to move, it acts as a clutch. I see afair bit of corrosion on lantern pinions. I dont understand filing a arbour. Are you sure you assembled it correctly?
 

Savageblunder

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Nov 10, 2019
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Yeah
The stop wheel you are refering to is it the fly? If so it should and has to be able to move, it acts as a clutch. I see afair bit of corrosion on lantern pinions. I dont understand filing a arbour. Are you sure you assembled it correctly?

Yeah. I’m sure it’s assembled correctly - the best I can tell. I took before pics and compared. The stop wheel I mean is actually the strike wheel. The wheel with the deep teeth every so often that the locking lever goes in. That doesn’t seem to be an issue; as it’s the same with the locking lever lifted and held up manually.

The arbor I’m referring to seems weird? It’s the arbor that the little brass gear is on that drives the strike wheel. The arbor I repaired with Locktite. The arbor where the little brass gear gear spun freely I had to repair with Locktite. That arbor is thick. Looks significantly thicker than other arbors.

That and the fact that the the whole reason an initial repair was necessary was because a pressed gear spun freely on this arbor makes me wonder if someone messed with it or changed the arbor.

Anyway, I know it’s very difficult to see in pic above, but when the strike train is assembled it’s difficult to tell if that arbor is ever so slightly contacting a brass wheel on another arbor. They are close, so close that you can visually tell if there is an air gap between the two. So, I tried filing that arbor down a bit just at the point where it looks like it possibly is contacting a brass gear on another arbor.

If anyone has one of these Ansonia open escapement 5.5 movements (not the round plate style - but square plate style) is there one thicker arbor on the strike train side? The solution may be to take a drive to Merritts and look for a junk one to compare and take parts off of...
 
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shutterbug

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Check the fan pivots. They are very easy to bend during assembly. You can probably slip the fan out without completely splitting the plates.
 

Bruce Alexander

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Savageblunder,

This may be obvious so my apologies. I don't mean to offend but how is the end shake with "C" after your work on it?

In one of your photos, it looks like it may be in contact with the Front Plate.

If it is rubbing, even intermittently, that could rob enough power to cause problems for you.

Good luck with it.

Regards,

Bruce
 

wow

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Like Bruce, it looks to me like C is rubbing on the front plate. I may have that movement in my bone pile. Please photo the whole movement and post it. I need to know what a 5.5 looks like.
Will
 

R. Croswell

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......... It’s the arbor that the little brass gear is on that drives the strike wheel. The arbor I repaired with Locktite. The arbor where the little brass gear gear spun freely I had to repair with Locktite. That arbor is thick. Looks significantly thicker than other arbors.

That and the fact that the the whole reason an initial repair was necessary was because a pressed gear spun freely on this arbor makes me wonder if someone messed with it or changed the arbor........
The "repaired" gear may or may not be the problem but should be suspect. If the gear was cracked, knurling the arbor will cause the crack to spread open when the gear is pressed on which will cause the teeth at the crack to become further apart which may be causing partial binding and excess friction at that point. If the cracked gear is to be used (instead of a healthy replacement part) and soldered or Loctited in place the arbor should not be knurled and hole in the gear should be opened for a slip fit and the crack allowed to close.

If the above is not the problem, one trouble shooting method when a train runs for a bit then "peters out" is to wait until it has petered out and stopped then mark each gear with a felt tip marker. Help it to get running again and when it peters out again look for the gear that is in the same place again and that is usually where the problem is.

As already mentioned, make sure all the arbors have some end shake. I believe the next step will be to disassemble the movement and put back the strike train wheels one pair at a time until you come to one that causes a slow down and stops repeatedly in the same position after being spun.

RC
 

Bruce Alexander

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In this earlier thread: Ansonia Strike Train Help Requested you stated the following...

Since the count wheel doesn’t turn on its own, obviously the strike train either doesn’t stop striking or doesn’t start. The count wheel can’t do its job.
...was that an observation or just a theory? In other words, the Strike Count should now be properly regulated but has the Strike Train's running behavior changed since you worked on the Count Wheel Pinion/Gear?
 
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