Moon Dial Help

Dman

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Apr 3, 2020
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I am working on a grandfather with a moon dial that I have not seen before. If I understand it correctly I think the arm in the middle lifts the arm on the left, which ratchets up a tooth (or several teeth?) and then when it is released it pulls down on the tooth, turning the wheel. Is this correct? If so does the bottom elbow/arm do anything? The problem I am seeing is that the left arm slips under the wheel (from this angle) and so does not grab the teeth. how would I go about rectifying this?
thanks!

IMG_1300.jpg
 

shutterbug

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To me, it looks like the upper arm is activated by the hour wheel in some way, and the bottom one just serves as a counter weight to keep the upper part next to the dial. I believe you are correct about the direction of movement. I think the upper arm has to be positioned correctly and tightened down so it doesn't move on its own. And the whole assembly has to be free to move except for the pivot point. The spring should allow the vertical arm to move over the teeth as it rises. It looks like that part has been soldered. It also looks like the spring is forcing the arm away from the wheel, but it should be pushing it the other way.
 

NEW65

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I’ve seen a fair few and really clumsy and unreliable mechanisms to operate the moon dials and this one looks like one of them!
Normally there is a moon gear fitted on the hour pipes that drives the moon disks. Looking at this one I’m not understanding what operates the mechanism unless it’s a cam that’s pushed on the hour pipe?? I don’t get this one! I’ve seen a few others like this with lever assemblies but you have to ensure that everything is tight (not sloppy!) but free to move. Sorry I cannot advise further .
 

Dman

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Okay so I believe I have that part figured out, but now when the clock is running, as the pin on the hour wheel comes around to lift it , it stops the clock (see photo, it is sideways). I have put bushings in already so I don’t think that is the issue. Any tips? E19B94A0-5707-451E-B5AF-7C3D984B7525.jpeg
 

Dick Feldman

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From your first photo, I noticed a tag from Kuempel Clock Company. The dial and moon dial are a product of the clock company rather than the movement company. The Kuempel Chime Clock Company was in Excelsior Minnesota and is no longer in business. Kuempel operated from the early 1900's till 2008. Kuempel sold clock kits as well as assembled clocks. During parts of their existence, they used Jauch movements and at times had those movements manufactured to their specifications.
I have found the moon dial drives on Kuempel clocks to be sort of mysterious and no two seem to be alike. The best way to determine what should happen is to run the minute hand forward with the dial in place while watching the moon dial drive. It looks like someone has done some bending adjustments on the moon drive on your clock as there is paint missing.
If the moon drive actuating is stopping the time train, I would guess there is some interference when the moon is being advanced.
If I remember, there is or was a Kuempel specialist still in existence.
He has/had parts which he acquired when they went out of business.
You might find some help by Googling the Kuempel Clock Company.

Best of luck,

Dick
 

shutterbug

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Check to see how easily it will move when you do it manually. It needs to move without a lot of effort. If it seems to move easily, then the time train might have a power issue, or the pin and lever are not smooth enough.
 

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