Marine: marine ship chronometer made by Dillon & Tuttle in N.Y. u.s.a. arround 1867

Discussion in 'Chronometers' started by masterwatchmaker, Nov 30, 2016.

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  1. masterwatchmaker

    masterwatchmaker Registered User

    Nov 30, 2016
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    i have this chronometer very rare because made in new york U.S.A.by dillon & tuttle serial number of 640


    Google say about him (Thomas Edward Dillon)
    He left home at the early age of fourteen, and went to Troy, N. Y., where he served an apprenticeship of seven years with Oscar Hanks, at mathematical instrument making. At the expiration of his apprenticeship he left Troy, and went to Albany, where he worked till 1844. In that year he was married to his forst and only wife - Deborah Ann Sharp, of New Baltimore, Green Co., N. Y.

    He moved with his wife to Brooklyn, L. I., and worked a short time with a firm on Broadway, New York City. After leaving there he was engaged by Bliss & Craton, chronometer makers, in Fulton Street, the same city, and worked with them until 1849 or 1850, when he left to go in partnership in the same business with Calvin Kline. They opened a store in Williamsburgh, L. I., and from there moved to Fulton Street; then to 74 Wall Street, where Mr. D. remained until his death. He finally dissolved partnership with Mr. Kline, and took in with him Mr. Silas Tuttle, un the firm of Dillon & Tuttle. In the fall of '67 Mr. Tuttle retired from the firm, and was succeeded by Edward Openshaw, the firm's name being changed to Dillon & Co.




    dillon.jpg dillonmvt.jpg
     
  2. Omexa

    Omexa Registered User
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    Hi antikak, it certainly is rare if it is made entirely by Dillion & Tuttle in New York; I love it. Regards Ray
     
  3. masterwatchmaker

    masterwatchmaker Registered User

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    thank you Ray !

    i seriously think that it may be one of the very first ship chronometer made in U.S.A.1867 is early the famous Hamilton ship chronometer was made long time after mine
     
  4. masterwatchmaker

    masterwatchmaker Registered User

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    i belive it was entirely made in u.s.a. because its say he was engaged by Bliss & Craton, chronometer makers, in Fulton Street, the same city(New-York), and worked with them until 1849 or 1850 then started him self to do chronometer of his own
     
  5. Omexa

    Omexa Registered User
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    Hi antikak, this is some good advice that I got about my Mercer Chronometer: "Hi Ray, It would be basically an Earnshaw spring detent, but there may be some auxiliaries on the balance. Great care needed when dismantling, that detent and the associated jewels are very fragile. Regards Graham."
    "As Graham said, great care... mostly meaning all power must be removed before disassembly, including the maintaining power, which is often over looked. Ralph" Regards Ray
     
  6. masterwatchmaker

    masterwatchmaker Registered User

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    thank you i work a lot with fusee but its my 1st detent i will use extra care i need to redo the balance staff on my lathe you can see my shop in this movie https://vimeo.com/64958844
     
  7. masterwatchmaker

    masterwatchmaker Registered User

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  8. Marco C.

    Marco C. Registered User

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    I am not an expert, but I do not think that in the mid of 1800 there was any other country besides UK and France with a network of craftsmen able to produce a complete chronometer movement. Dillon & Tuttle may have been able to add the regulator, which of course is a very important component, to a British movement (e.g. by Mercer). But I am sure other members can give a more accurate contribution on the matter.
     
  9. gmorse

    gmorse Registered User
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    Hi Marco,

    I think you're right about the possible origins of this chronometer, (although I'd add Germany to the list), but unsure about what you meant by the regulator, because these instruments are free-sprung, and don't have regulators.

    I think antiktak will have a considerable task in restoring this!

    Regards,

    Graham
     
  10. Omexa

    Omexa Registered User
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    Hi antikak, I just realized where I have seen your Dillon & Tuttle Chronometer before, there were six Chronometers for sale on eBay from one seller and I was thinking of buying some of them. Before I could purchase any of them they disappeared off eBay. Regards Ray
     
  11. masterwatchmaker

    masterwatchmaker Registered User

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    a regulator can also be an very precise clock like «a nice jeweler regulator» usuly they had center seconds hands

    and yes Ray your right i saw 4 and i wanned the fletcher one with paladium helicoidal hairspring but didnt win so by dispithefull i then bid on the most complete one (other had no bezel & casing) and it was this one

    i will dismantle the spring from the drum and put all in my ultrasound bath for few hours for to take out that focilized oil (someone must dip it in oil long time ago)
     
  12. masterwatchmaker

    masterwatchmaker Registered User

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    i personnaly think that clock was 100% made in U.S.A.

    why they says ; he was engaged by Bliss & Craton, «chronometer makers», in Fulton Street, the same city, and worked with them until 1849 or 1850
     
  13. masterwatchmaker

    masterwatchmaker Registered User

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    i just find out that it was made 100% in amerika

    [SIZE=+1]EARLY CHRONOMETERS[/SIZE]

    [SIZE=+1]Almost certainly John Bliss and Frederick Creighton had the manufacture of chronometers in mind when they became partners in 1835. Chronometers are very accurate portable timekeepers developed around 1780 which until recently were essential for navigation at sea. By 1839 they were in production; in 1840 they had submitted nos. 501 and 506 for trial at the Naval Observatory in Washington D.C. I suspect that no. 501 is the earliest serial number for a Bliss chronometer as I have not seen any lower. As noted by Whitney, chronometer makers never started with 0, as who would buy something that was obviously a maker's first attempt? It should also be noted that once made, chronometers took several months to several years to settle down to a regular rate so they weren't sold fresh off the bench. Nos. 501 & 506 apparently didn't meet Observatory standards, supporting my view they were among the first produced by Bliss & Creighton. In the beginning they used rough parts made in England but by 1848 they had outfitted their workshop with the machinery needed to make all parts themselves, and then advertised that their chronometers were entirely American made. I believe they were the second company to make chronometers completely in America, William Bond and Son of Boston being the first in 1812. Bond's first chronometer is in the Smithsonian and their chronometer shop is on display there (at least it was when I last visited). Bliss & Creighton was one of the very few American companies capable of making chronometers completely from scratch. John Bliss & Co. later claimed they were the only company able to do this, but it's pretty certain T.S. & J.D. Negus, and perhaps others, also could make chronometers completely in America[/SIZE]
     
  14. masterwatchmaker

    masterwatchmaker Registered User

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    #14 masterwatchmaker, Dec 1, 2016
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 31, 2017
    Bliss and Creighton
    John Bliss and Frederick Creighton were distinguished chronometer makers who worked in New York from 1837 to 1855. They imported rough movements (also called unfinished movements, movements in the grey, and ébauches) from England and finished them in New York; however, in 1848 they exhibited several of their chronometers at the American Institute's Exhibition in New York that they promoted to be entirely made in America (Randall, 87). John Bliss apprenticed about 1808 to Benjamin Lord in Rutland, Vermont and prior to the partnership with Frederick Creighton worked at 135 Water Street, New York (Voss).


    Few examples of pocket watches made by Bliss and Creighton are known. A movement signed Bliss and Creighton, serial no. 19225, is in the American Clock & Watch Museum in Bristol, Ct. The museum also has a movement signed John Bliss, serial no. 2556 with an up-down indicator in its collection. This example is pictured in Cooper's article: John Cairns (1751-1809) and Other Early American Watchmakers (Cooper, 36).
     
  15. masterwatchmaker

    masterwatchmaker Registered User

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  16. masterwatchmaker

    masterwatchmaker Registered User

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    the 1st all american ship chronometer was made in 1812 by mr Bond in Boston then the second one made by mr Bliss so mr Dillon one would be the 3rd one chronometer made from scratch in america
     
  17. gmorse

    gmorse Registered User
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    Hi antiktak,

    I believe I owe you an apology, your instrument does appear to be an entirely US product.

    Good luck with your restoration, and I hope you'll let us see the end result.

    Regards,

    Graham
     
  18. masterwatchmaker

    masterwatchmaker Registered User

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    thank you Graham apologie accepted but it was ok there was no offence

    i learn my self also like all the readers my passion for all american chronometer grew alot

    here look at a movie about me the special watchmaker with a broken internal clock
    https://vimeo.com/64958844

    but its in french ! but you will see my shop in downtown montreal (i dont own it anymore)
     
  19. masterwatchmaker

    masterwatchmaker Registered User

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    mr Norman Bliss curator of the virtual John Bliss museum http://blisschron.org/jbliss.html

    told me that my dial looks like the dials of Bliss chronometers made by Kullberg after Bliss & Co

    so the date of 1867 is more probable for my movement

    if my movement was dipped into oil like i think in the ultrasonic bath it will come back like new and i promise you that i will show the photo after my work

    i am exited to restore some americana historic piece
     
  20. masterwatchmaker

    masterwatchmaker Registered User

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    if the Bliss chronometer started at 500 like explained in the virtual museum maybe mr Dillon use same strategy and mine in fact could be no 140 in reality
     
  21. Tom McIntyre

    Tom McIntyre Technical Admin
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    There were many chronometer makers in the United States including the ones you listed above. Is that text yours or are you quoting someone else?

    All of the chronometer makers worked exactly like their English and European counter parts. i.e they made some instruments in house and had many instruments delivered to them by a chronometer house, typically in the UK, with their own name engraved. The reason was that they could make more money selling chronometers of good quality made by others and only needed to make some for prestige.

    The "regulator" that they applied to stock chronometers was almost always an improvement to the standard chronometer balance.

    I noticed the auction where you purchased your chronometer and I think the price was fair. I recently purchased a John Roger Arnold for about the same price and another American piece by Eggert & Son in a bit better condition that is currently being restored. I will not likely restore the Arnold because it needs a bit too much work. I collect these pieces both as machines to enjoy and as documents of the history of the art. They do not all need to be running for that purpose.
     
  22. masterwatchmaker

    masterwatchmaker Registered User

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    some of texte were mine and some from that page http://blisschron.org/jbliss.html


    john Bliss virtual museum i contacted mr Norman Bliss the curator

    for my self i am the only one of my watchmaking scool to win a scolarship to study in switzerland at LausanneC.F.H. all fees paid 10 430.00cdn$ no other student received any i got it because it was the years of the youth and it was in 1985 so there was some budget for overseas study
     
  23. Marco C.

    Marco C. Registered User

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    Sorry for using a wrong term, English is not my native tongue. I meant the "helical spring+compensated balance wheel" component. What does one call it? Controller? Oscillator?

    Marco
     
  24. masterwatchmaker

    masterwatchmaker Registered User

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    oscillator is fine Marco :)
     
  25. gmorse

    gmorse Registered User
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    Hi Marco,

    The jargon can catch all of us out from time to time! The usual term is "the balance assembly", and the various extra parts sometimes added to the balance wheel, mostly to reduce middle temperature error, are collectively called "compensators", although not all of them actually compensate.

    Regards,

    Graham
     
  26. tick talk

    tick talk Registered User

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    Antiktak, was that your "very first Patek secret wristwatch brought in from Ukraine 322253442587" listed on fleabay for half a million? There seems to be a lot of very rare and unique pieces from Ukraine.
     
  27. masterwatchmaker

    masterwatchmaker Registered User

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    Re: marine ship chronometer made by Dillon & Tuttle in N.Y. u.s.a. arround 1867

    hi tick talk

    yes its mine might be ordered by tsar alexanderII to patek

    - - - Updated - - -

    i had to change my name but its me whom was antiktak
     
  28. masterwatchmaker

    masterwatchmaker Registered User

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    Re: marine ship chronometer made by Dillon & Tuttle in N.Y. u.s.a. arround 1867

    the tsars were very interested in fine watchmaking and they loved repeaters and when the revolution apear all watches disapear and they are still in russia some how
     

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