lenzkirch bracket clock odd suspension spring adjustment?

Discussion in 'Clock Repair' started by ChrisCam, May 26, 2020.

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  1. ChrisCam

    ChrisCam Registered User
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    Hi Guys,

    Just started looking at this Lenzkirch bracket clock. German about 1867 I think. What interests me thus far is the adjustment on the suspension spring. There is a bar with a square end that goes through the dial.

    Has anyone any experience / knowledge of this adjustment and why the quality German firm thought the suspension spring would benefit from these adjustments.

    Chris

    crutch.jpg bar through dial.jpg clock.jpg adjuster2.jpg adjuster.jpg
     
  2. bruce linde

    bruce linde Technical Admin
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    based on the brocot adjuster in french clocks... gives you the ability to regulate from the front of the clock
     
  3. JTD

    JTD Registered User

    Sep 27, 2005
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    As Bruce says.

    It is a very useful mechanism - once you have the clock adjusted as well as you can with the pendulum bob, you then can make the final tiny adjustments from the front, with the appropriately sized key.

    This is nothing to do with being a 'benefit' to the suspension spring, but it is of great benefit to the clock owner, and the 'quality German firm' thought it was a good idea, because it is.

    If you can post the serial number of your movement, it should be possible to date it. Personally, I think it is later than 1867, though I may be wrong. Where did you find that date?

    JTD
     
  4. new2clocks

    new2clocks Registered User
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    I agree. I believe that the trademark on the OP's clock was registered in 1875, so that would be the earliest date that the clock was made.

    Regards.
     
  5. ChrisCam

    ChrisCam Registered User
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    #5 ChrisCam, May 27, 2020
    Last edited: May 27, 2020
    Thanks for the posts Guys. I found a couple of lists of serial numbers with years and extrapolated from these for the year based on the length of serial number. Have just found this site; George's Antique Clocks

    This states clocks like mine with 1 million stamped on the back means you add the serial number to 1 million to get the date. So as my serial is 9320 it means i think the clock is 1893 or 1894.

    I haven't yet stripped clock as found the fault why it was stopping and am seeing how it goes first. This is my first clock which i have come across that I believe is called a 'ting-tang' clock. It has 2 iron chime rings. How these strike in relation to the hour, half hour etc I am monitoring as no idea yet.

    Cannot see the adjustment on the verge / suspension spring does anything other than alter the tension holding the suspension spring. I take it I am wrong but as yet cannot see why?

    Chris



    adjust3.jpg adjust4.jpg
     
  6. JTD

    JTD Registered User

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    It raises and lowers it, thus changing the regulation, as if you were altering the bob.

    JTD
     
  7. JTD

    JTD Registered User

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    Yes, that is a much more likely date.

    JTD
     
  8. ChrisCam

    ChrisCam Registered User
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    Just raising or lowering the suspension spring in itself would still give the same length. It must alter the effective spring length to make a difference. If I am right are these suspension springs unique to this type of mechanism or if i am wring I still don't get it??

    Chris
     
  9. new2clocks

    new2clocks Registered User
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    Chris,

    Your clock was made in 1894, according to the most recent data base on Lenzkirch serial numbers.

    For the record, please provide a picture of the serial number.

    Thanks!
     
  10. wow

    wow Registered User
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    Raising or lowering the suspension spring also raises or lowers the pendulum bob, right? Therefore raising the spring speeds up the clock and vice-versa.
    Does the clock have an adjustable bob? If so, adjust the bob as close as possible and then use the dial adjuster to fine tune it.
     
  11. JTD

    JTD Registered User

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    Exactly right. (And as was explained in post #3)

    JTD
     
  12. ChrisCam

    ChrisCam Registered User
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    Any particular reason you want a picture as opposed to my stating it?

    Chris
     
  13. new2clocks

    new2clocks Registered User
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    Your serial number would be one of the lowest / earliest of the "1 Million" series that was made. I have not seen a serial number in the "1 Million" series lower than five digits. Your clock has four digits.

    The picture would be for the sake of posterity and for those who have been accumulating this data on Lenzkirch clocks.

    Regards.
     
  14. ChrisCam

    ChrisCam Registered User
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    Fair enough, picture uploaded. I have investigated the clock and found the height adjuster was not working as there is a slot in the screw held by a pin which was back to front. the suspension spring is held in the slot of the adjustable screw head and is adjusted by the bar. The pendulum on this clock is fairly heavy so how much reliance you can have on the screw head holding the spring by a millimeter of force is questionable over time I would suspect.

    Anyone know if the drums can be removed without a total strip down on these clocks?

    Chris

    serial.jpg
     
  15. shutterbug

    shutterbug Moderator
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    The time is actually regulated by the chops (the lower part that the suspension spring goes through) affecting the usable length of the actual spring. As you choke up on the spring (a baseball euphemism) it gets shorter and less flexible. That speeds the clock up. Of course the opposite is also true. If you max it out (choke it too far) it will not be able to function at all.
     
  16. THTanner

    THTanner Registered User
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    I am wondering if that is the proper suspension spring. There are longer versions of similar two block springs. The distance the chops can move would take this spring all the way up to the bottom block which would effectively remove the spring from the setup. Perhaps look for a longer such spring, raise the bob accordingly, and plan to keep at least 1/4 inch of suspension spring below the chops when in the full up position?
     
  17. JTD

    JTD Registered User

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    Having looked more carefully at the photo, I am also wondering if this is the wrong suspension spring.

    JTD
     
  18. ChrisCam

    ChrisCam Registered User
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    Good point TH.
    Chris
     
  19. ChrisCam

    ChrisCam Registered User
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    Always appreciate learning something new so the 'chops' are the sliding fit the spring goes into?
    Chris
     
  20. shutterbug

    shutterbug Moderator
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    Yes.
     
  21. new2clocks

    new2clocks Registered User
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    Thanks, Chris.

    Regards.
     
  22. wow

    wow Registered User
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    Yes, Chris. If you notice the set-up on many of the little round French clocks, they have adjustable chops rather than adjustable springs like yours. The chops move up and down whereas your spring moves. As Shutt says, it’s where the spring bends that matters.
     
  23. THTanner

    THTanner Registered User
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    I also wonder if springs of that era had two feathers? Perhaps something more like this one ??

    #33 Suspension Spring
     
  24. shutterbug

    shutterbug Moderator
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    I hadn't noticed that. I think you are right .... but not certain that your example would be the right one.
     
  25. THTanner

    THTanner Registered User
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    I don't really know what the right spring would look like, but did they use dual feather springs back then? Would like to know.
     
  26. JTD

    JTD Registered User

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    French movements with brocot - type adjusters did, if I recall correctly.

    JTD
     
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  27. shutterbug

    shutterbug Moderator
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    I've never encountered a dual spring suspension used in conjunction with chops except on French made clocks. That does not mean there aren't any though :)
     

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