Junghans mantle clock 13 chimes at 12 o’clock

Tyrone Galea

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Feb 16, 2018
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Dear All,

I am a new member, and very new to he hobby of clock repair. I took an online course, got myself a 1910 Junghans Dickinson mantle clock, dismantled, cleaned, oiled and it’s back up and running. So, I’m really pleased with myself, just for one little problem.

The clock strikes the hour and half hour. It strikes all hours and half hours correctly up to 12 o clock. At 12 o clock it strikes 13 times. In actual fact I believe it is striking a 12 hour + a half hour. The reason being that for the next couple of hours it starts chiming the hour on the half, and the half at 12 o clock. So it reverses. At some point it goes back to normal, but it strikes an extra hour every hour from there on.

12 hours later it repeats the same. It now adds one more extra strike, so 3 strikes at 1 o clock, 4 at 2 o clock etc.

Any ideas? Otherwise, it’s running beautifully.

Thank you all in advance.

Regards
Tyrone
 

shutterbug

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Is it a count wheel then?
 

Uhralt

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Take a look at the thread "Cuckoo chimes flip" right next to yours. You seem to have a similar problem.

Uhralt
 

RJSoftware

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If it is a count wheel then most likely you have a timing issue with the pinned wheel.

The pinned wheel has tiny pin on side of gear that a lever stops. That pin should only be a few degrees away after lever drops. Too far out and the lever misses pin all together as the lever's job is to drop down for only a few degrees of the turn then go back up again.

To correct you onlly need take two top nuts off and spread plates wide enough to disengage gear enough to turn pinned gear. mov fly out of way temporary.

When you test apply finger pressure to the train and control fly to one turn at a time so you can watch where the pin is when lever drops. Might take a few tries.
 

Willie X

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A count wheel system would never recover. So, it would seem that you have some defect in the rack, or the rack hook, or the timing of the gathering pallet. Check the number of degrees the warning wheel has to run up to warning (it should be more than 90 degrees and less than 180 degrees. Also make sure the rack post and rack hook post are clean and free. They should drop cleanly with an audible click.
Willie X
 

Willie X

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Disregard post #5.

I'm pretty sure that clock has a count wheel strike system. The relationship between the count wheel and the count finger is slightly off. Watch it very closely, the count finger should dip to tap the outer rim of the count wheel exactly the same distance at each side of the outer rim/ledges. IOW, at 9 o'clock the first tap on the high ledge should be exactly the same distance from the preceeding deep slot as the 8th tap is from the upcoming deep slot. Another test is to see that the count finger dips at the dead center of the 2 o'clock ledge.

Also, there will be marks to go by on the countwheel rim where where the count finger has been tapping for generations. A photo would help.

Willie X
 

Tyrone Galea

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Feb 16, 2018
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Thank you all. I will post some photos later this evening.

I read on another thread that it should be possible to adjust the count wheel as it is friction fit, somewhat similar to the strike wheel. I suspect that it’s a question of alignment between the count wheel and lever.

Will be back.
 

harold bain

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Look to the count wheel at the 12 O'clock position for a bent tooth if this only happens at 12.
 

Uhralt

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Thank you all. I will post some photos later this evening.

I read on another thread that it should be possible to adjust the count wheel as it is friction fit, somewhat similar to the strike wheel. I suspect that it’s a question of alignment between the count wheel and lever.

Will be back.
Hard to tell without a picture but count wheels are usually not friction fit. In order to adjust it you need to take it off and put it back on shifted for a tooth or two.

Uhralt
 

Tyrone Galea

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Feb 16, 2018
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This is a photo taken during disasembly just prior to cleaning. Later in I will take the movement out and take some better photos.

20180126_175522.jpg 20180126_175638.jpg
 

Uhralt

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Doesn't look like a friction fit to me. Did it have the same problem before cleaning? If not, something is slightly off during re-assembly. You can try to see what exactly is going on by watching the strike mechanism during the 12 o'clock strike closely. When you wind the strike side just one wind or just enough that it moves you can see it in slow motion.

Uhralt
 

Tyrone Galea

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Feb 16, 2018
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Hi Uhralt,

Thank you for your reply. I have worked on it some more and wrote down all the strikes and misses. The count wheel does allow some adjustment, so I took your advise and watched it count the hours, judging the space remaining in each deep slot. At one point it became obvious that the count wheel needed to be advanced slightly, so I did that by apply some force downwards to rotate the wheel slightly.

During manual testing by rotating the minute hand through all the hours, i was able to get some of the missing strikes, and eventually, went through a whole 12 hours with all hours and half pasts being chimed correctly. So now the movement is back in the case, and we’ll see if it remains synchronized through the night. I will post some photos below.

Thanks so far. I may need to come back, but fingers crossed.

Regards
T
 

shutterbug

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I was going to say that the 12:00 position should be the most reliable spot on the wheel because of the wide gap allowing for the 12:00 through 1:30 strikes. I have high expectations that your adjustment will fix the problem.
 

Tyrone Galea

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Feb 16, 2018
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Looks good.. or sounds good! Problem seems to be solved. Clock still chiming properly.

Thank you all for your assistance
 

Uhralt

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Sep 4, 2008
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Looks good.. or sounds good! Problem seems to be solved. Clock still chiming properly.

Thank you all for your assistance
Great! I'm glad you fixed it.
Uhralt
 

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