Jauch PL 42 Secrets?

[etmb61]

I have a Jauch PL 42 on my bench that needs cleaned and serviced. Are there any quirks with these movements I should know about before I tear into it? Should I tear into it?

It has a split front plate for removing the barrels so I let the springs down and removed them. The time barrel cap is worn but only in one direction. Is this normal for these movements? The other two barrels look good.




Thanks,
Eric

 

[wow]

Can you show us the rest of the movement? I don’t remember what a PL42 looks like.

 

[Willie X]

Yes, barrel wear and click failures. No replacement parts are available. You can use a steel Hermle click wheel and you can rebush that barrel cap on a lathe but it trickey making the bushing stay in place. Champfering and peening on both sides is necessary.
Willie X

 

[etmb61]

Can you show us the rest of the movement? I don’t remember what a PL42 looks like.

As requested.

Bottom half of front plate is removed.



Eric

 

[wow]

Eric, that looks like a pretty normal movement with no unusual quirks. Those barrel caps and the barrels themselves may all need bushings. If they are worn that much I imagine that there are several more bushings needed. Just take many photos as you go.

 

[etmb61]

Barrel bushing installed. That was fun. Tight fit then peened from both sides as suggested. There is a small lip on the inside so it cannot pull through.



I still don't see how it wore only on one side. Is it because the mainspring forces the barrel off to one side? Is this form of wear common?

Eric

 

[wow]

Barrel bushing installed. That was fun. Tight fit then peened from both sides as suggested. There is a small lip on the inside so it cannot pull through.

View attachment 762072

I still don't see how it wore only on one side. Is it because the mainspring forces the barrel off to one side? Is this form of wear common?

Eric

Nice job! I have seen instances where both barrels and caps needed bushings. I have seen others where only the barrels needed bushings and the caps were fine. Since the teeth are on one side it seems that would cause the barrel to wear more than the cap. Not always the case. Keep us informed of your progress.

 

[Willie X]

Looks good. Willie X

 

[etmb61]

I had to break down and buy a proper set of mainspring winder sleeves to work on the barrels. My home built sleeves couldn't hack it. It's so much easier, and I'm certain safer, when you have the right tools. Only the time cap had any wear. Interesting.

Eric

 

[John P]

If you put the lip on the inside, it interferes with the end play of the arbor, might want to check that. Push the arbor in and out and see if it moves. Any movement, then you are good to go.


johnp

 

[etmb61]

If you put the lip on the inside, it interferes with the end play of the arbor, might want to check that. Push the arbor in and out and see if it moves. Any movement, then you are good to go.


johnp

I figured that out pretty quick.

Thanks,
Eric

 

[etmb61]

I took lots of pictures as I took the rest of the movement apart. Hopefully I can get it back together! They did make a couple of things easier. In addition to the split front plate they have an adjustable cam to sync the chime train's warning pin.



Without this arrangement one would need to spread the plates to get everything in sync. I don't recall seeing this in other movements.

 

[John P]

I have done dozens of those Urgo's 32 movements and have never seen that feature.
When i assemble them, i would bring both that chime lock wheel at 12 o'clock and the stop pin at the same position. All worked fine. Way to go Urgo's.

johnp

 

[Willie X]

Few modern clocks have to be taken apart to sync anything.
Willie X

 

[etmb61]

It's back together less the rack which I somehow forgot to clean. I also need to install the chime select lever once I get the hammers falling in the right order. The drum is just a tiny bit off so the last one on the right doesn't always hit the last note.


I used an ultrasonic cleaner for the first time on this one. I'm sold.

No problems getting the chime and strike trains in sync. Beginners luck?

I guess now I should tackle that Becker that's been waiting on the shelf since 2015.


Eric

 

[etmb61]

It's been running for a few days now. Every so often it won't chime or strike at the top of the hour so something's not right. If left to run it will re-sync and chime properly.

So much for beginner's luck.

Hmmm.

 

[TEACLOCKS]

There might be a bushing in the minute hand that you can turn to get the minute hand to be straight up when striking.
Good Luck

 

[etmb61]

Repair method #1: Wind the clock. I had only given it enough power to load up the train when I started testing it. It works better when given a full wind.

Eric

 

[etmb61]

Still fails to chime consistently. It will warn but sometimes the train will stall once it gets released. Then if I touch one of the wheels it will run. Also as it chimes it picks up speed as if overcoming some drag somewhere.

 

[wow]

Still fails to chime consistently. It will warn but sometimes the train will stall once it gets released. Then if I touch one of the wheels it will run. Also as it chimes it picks up speed as if overcoming some drag somewhere.

So what wheel do you touch to get it to chime?

 

[etmb61]

The one pictured above in post #12.

 

[wow]

A slightly bent pivot will do that. Check the wheel next to that one and see if the arbor has a wobble in the pivot.

 

[etmb61]

I think I found the problem. The arm that selects which tune is played (A) is on too tight against the pivot of the chime drum (B). So the drum is clamped between the back plate and the selector arm. When I tested the movement initially I did not have the arm installed. When I did put it on I set it for the Westminster chime but apparently didn't leave any end play for the drum. The flat spring (C) keeps the drum's pivot against the curve in the arm to selected the tune.

 

[etmb61]

The last next bit to sort out was auto correcting the chime with the hour. When I took the movement apart I did take pictures but I missed the alignment of some critical parts. So here is how they should be set.


In this picture the locking plate (A) is in the position to chime at 1st qtr hour. The tab on the chime locking lever (C) is down in the notch of the chime cam (B). The front pin on the correction lever (D) is away from the chime locking lever. In this position the chime warning pin (not shown) is in contact with a tab on the chime locking lever through a slot in the front plate. The arrow points to the notch in the locking plate for the top of the hour, and is where the train needs to be to set the correction cam position. When adjusted correctly the front pin on the correction lever (D) will be almost in contact with the chime locking lever (C).


This picture shows the locking pin on the correction lever and the notch in the correction cam. The cam is adjusted to put the pin in the notch when the locking plate (A above) is at the top of the hour. As I said in an earlier post, the cam is a friction fit to the arbor so it can be adjusted in place.

I hope this makes sense.

Everything appears to be working as it should now. (I hope).

Eric

 

[etmb61]

I've had this clock running now for a couple of weeks. A few days after winding it will hard stop at 25 after the hour. I move the minute hand and is feels jammed clockwise. Moved CCW and the chime will warn, then it works normal. I need to take it back out of the case and remove the dial again to see what's sticking.

Not happy.

 

[shutterbug]

You are probably encountering the stop pin with the lever as it raises. It's usually a 'once in a while' situation where the pin hits dead center on the lever and stops the train. Take a close look inside when it happens. That's my best guess.

 

[etmb61]

You are probably encountering the stop pin with the lever as it raises. It's usually a 'once in a while' situation where the pin hits dead center on the lever and stops the train. Take a close look inside when it happens. That's my best guess.

I think you got it right.

I took the dial off and waited for the next stop. Here's what I found.

The chime stop pin (circled) is stuck hard against the tip of the warning lever (A). It warned for the 3rd qtr but did not chime. The clock stopped when trying to lift the already stuck warning lever again at the top of the hour.

I had to bend the tip of the warning lever to remove it for cleaning. I took pictures but I could not find any reference for how it should be placed and just guessed at it when I put it back in. This picture shows how it was before I started. It's angled back quite a bit. I thought it was a bit much so I left it more vertical.


Here is how it is positioned now. I made it still more vertical so it should not be able to jam against the stop pin.


Wound the clock and set it going. Now we wait.

Eric

 

[Willie X]

The train is probably stalling due to worn parts. If the train is in good condition, the pin will always stop in the same positon, which should be well away from the stop lever. Somewhere between 90° and 180°. Some clocks need to be closer to the 180° mark for the auto-correct to operate properly.

Two questions: Does the chime start quickly and run at a normal speed? How high are the chime hammers lifting?

Willie X

 

[etmb61]

The train is probably stalling due to worn parts. If the train is in good condition, the pin will always stop in the same positon, which should be well away from the stop lever. Somewhere between 90° and 180°. Some clocks need to be closer to the 180° mark for the auto-correct to operate properly.

Two questions: Does the chime start quickly and run at a normal speed? How high are the chime hammers lifting?

Willie X

I'm not sure what you mean about the pin's stopped position. For this movement the pin stops against the chime stop lever, the chime correction lever, or the warning lever.

The chime does start quickly and runs at a constant speed. The hammers lift about the length of the heads, so about 5/8". I spent a bit of time adjusting them to get good sound without them rebounding or landing against the chime rods.

Eric

 

[Willie X]

So, how does the chime warning work on that one?
Willie X

 

[etmb61]

So, how does the chime warning work on that one?
Willie X

I think I see what you mean. On a Hermle movement the chime train is stopped by chime cam and chime locking lever (or correction lever) on the front of the plate, and the warning stop pin is not engaged.

On this Jauch movement the chime train is stopped by the warning pin engaging the chime locking lever (or correction lever), or the warning lever.

Here is a diagram from Conover's book:

After chiming, the warning pin is in contact with a tab on the chime stop lever near the line at 3 in the diagram above.




When the chime warns, the chime stop lever is lifted and the warning pin drops to the tip of the warning lever. When the warning lever drops the chime train runs until the pin on the chime stop lever drops into the notch on the locking plate and the warning pin engages the stop tab.

I hope this makes sense.

Eric

 

[etmb61]

It ran of 4 days then stopped. Again the warning lever was stuck on the warning pin stopping the minute hand.
This time, however, when I moved the minute hand and the warning lever dropped the chime train was stalled. I'll take it apart again.

Eric

 

[shutterbug]

You might be able to fix it by moving the stop cam slightly. Loosen, turn, try. If worse, try the other direction

 

[etmb61]

You might be able to fix it by moving the stop cam slightly. Loosen, turn, try. If worse, try the other direction

I think I'm past that. I let the mainspring down, released the train, and wound the spring. It takes about half the turns in the spring before the train starts to move, so it's worn enough that it's not getting power after a few days. The arbor with the stop cam drives the chime drum directly. It will need bushings on both ends. The second wheel will need a bushing too. There is more side movement than I remember. I guess I didn't look at the wear close enough when I had it apart for cleaning. I was more worried about getting it back together. I don't have all the tools for that anyway. The wheel end of the barrel might also need a bushing. I can do that one no problem.

Eric

 

[etmb61]

I bit the bullet, ordered tools, built fixtures for my Sherline mill, and practiced installing bushings.

Last night/this morning I tore the movement down again, identified the wear, rechecked the pivots, and bushed the plates. I tested each bushing as I went and it runs smooth. Just 6 bushings installed plus one I had to do over. There was one pivot hole on the strike side that is too close to the plate edge for me so I left it alone. The chime side is much better now.

I also found I had not tightened the 3 nuts that hold the plate at the end of the chime drum in place. That could have been part of the problem.

I will service the mainsprings again and take another look at the barrel bushings before it goes back to testing, just to make sure.

It was easier to get back together this time around.

Eric

 

[etmb61]

It's back on the wall and running. I found a slight burr on the locking plate that was stalling the chime at the top of the hour. It was right at the point where the chime locking lever was raising the rack hook. That's where it was stopping before I think.


Now we wait.

Eric

 

[etmb61]

Day 8 and it's still running, chiming, and striking!

Eric