Jahresuhrenfabrik in crystal regulator case

Discussion in '400-Day & Atmos' started by whatgoesaround, Jul 3, 2019.

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  1. whatgoesaround

    whatgoesaround Registered User

    Jan 22, 2008
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    Recently acquired a crystal regulator, JUF, it took some cleaning and one tooth straightening on the escape wheel and now seems to be running well. However, because I had to remove the movement, I noticed a couple of things that make me question if it is totally original. When I removed the movement, I found "Anniversary" on the face, but not on the movement, itself. Horolovar Guide says that Bowler and Burdick had all the anniversary trademark clocks marked with "Anniversary Trade Mark Registered." The question arises because I have another similar one that has the "Anniversary Trade Mark Registered" on the back plate, as well as on the face. That one has a round movement, whereas this one has plate 1471. Everything is JUF. The "Anniversary . . ." is actually covered on the face because of the more ornate surround on the "new" one. So, the two problems are that it is not stamped on the backplate and is actually covered up on the face by the surround. I have a feeling the face was replaced. Any thoughts?

    It is probably not as severe a problem, because I know that JUF movements are in these type of cases, but it would be nicer if all was original.
     
  2. etmb61

    etmb61 Registered User
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    You will find "Anniversary" on the dial, on the movement, or both. Initially it was only on the dial. Sometimes it's only on the movement because it's worn off of the dial. If the movement is from the correct time period there's nothing to worry about. Most B&B clocks were assembled of parts from various sources.

    Eric
     
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  3. whatgoesaround

    whatgoesaround Registered User

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    Thanks, Eric. According to the Guide, the movement is from 1902 and B&B registered the trademark in 1901 with the first full page advertisement for the clocks in 1903. I guess this would put it in the right timeframe for only on the dial. This is good news.

    I do have one more question. The case is a warmer golden color instead of the brighter brass. However, the gold is quite even and if someone did it themselves, they took the case apart and did the insides and outsides very well, really all the surfaces. Not the pendulum and movement, but the case would have been from France and movement from Germany, so that would make sense. I wonder if there may have been different finishes available, especially given the more elaborate dail surround on this one compared to to my other B&B?
     
  4. etmb61

    etmb61 Registered User
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    It would be helpful to see it. I own a B&B in a 4 glass case that was originally gilded brass but has since had most of the gold polished off. All that remains is in the places where the person could not reach without disassembly, and the dial bezel. A JUF movement B&B would most likely have the DRP stamp in the back plate and no serial number. The dates in the repair guide are not accurate for anything made before WWII.

    Eric
     
  5. whatgoesaround

    whatgoesaround Registered User

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    Thanks for taking your time to answer my questions, Eric. Here are pics of the clock that I hope will help. I could not get a good one of the "Patent . . ." Note on the open door how well the gold is applied; just does not appear "home-done" to me. Last pic shows the brass one to compare.

    IMG_2342.JPG IMG_2343.JPG IMG_2344.JPG IMG_2345.JPG IMG_2346.JPG
     
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  6. KurtinSA

    KurtinSA Registered User
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    Is that gilding on the JUF? Looks "off" somehow...an attempt at gilding...maybe because I've never seen it up close. Also, that click spring seems to have been modified with a pin to keep it from rotating, thus keeping pressure on the ratchet click. Interesting "repair".

    Kurt
     
  7. whatgoesaround

    whatgoesaround Registered User

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    Yeah, Kurt, I saw that pin and thought that I had not seen it before, but thought it was something the company had tried and liked and should have been there. My mistake. The "gilding" is only on the case and really looks even to me, but I would not be asking if I was confident. Obviously,I am not that knowledgeable, look at my thoughts on the pin, for instance. :D
     
  8. KurtinSA

    KurtinSA Registered User
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    Actually, it's even more different. It appears that the click spring was relocated slightly lower...notice the hole that is visible above the base of the spring. For others more knowledgeable, what do we make of this?

    Kurt
     
  9. etmb61

    etmb61 Registered User
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    That is how the gilding should look. Compare it to other gilded French clocks. It would have been painted with a mercury/gold amalgam and fired on. I have a clock in the same case here:

    Bowler & Burdick crystal regulator

    As I said most of the gold is now gone. Pity.

    Yours is very nice. Treat the finish gently!

    Is the bottom of your pendulum covered with a brass plate?

    Eric
     
  10. etmb61

    etmb61 Registered User
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    #10 etmb61, Jul 4, 2019
    Last edited: Jul 4, 2019
    Looks like the click spring screw broke off in the plate and they just made another hole for it. I would dissolve the old screw with alum and put the spring back where it belongs with no extra pins.

    Another thing you can see from the back plate is the screws and washers for the pillars were originally on the back with the taper pins to the front. Like this Hauck:

    Post Your Ph. Hauck 400 Day Clocks Here

    Most 4 glass case clocks I've noted are assembled that way. I guess it makes it look better.

    Eric
     
  11. KurtinSA

    KurtinSA Registered User
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    So, Eric you're saying that the pillars have been rotated with the screws on the front plate? All my JUFs of this vintage have pins on the back so that the screws can be seen from the front...they're the typical front dial, not crystal regulators. Who spends time looking at the back?? :whistle:

    Kurt
     
  12. etmb61

    etmb61 Registered User
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    Yes and doesn't everyone?

    All of mine that are standard clocks under a glass dome have the screws on the front too. It's with most 4 glass and some louvre cases where I've found the pillars reversed.

    Almost all JUF, Hauck, and Wurth clocks I've recorded in 4 glass cases where the movement is supported by the bezel (typically French made cases) have the pillars reversed and the screws to the back or show marks that the screws were once to the back. From what I've observed, it's my opinion that for this group of clocks the screws should be on the back plate.

    Eric
     
  13. KurtinSA

    KurtinSA Registered User
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    I would tend to agree, especially when the dial covers the existence of the pins. Why waste the view of the screws with them behind the dial.

    You made me go back and check. I have a round plate JUF crystal regulator. It came to me in pieces and you helped me get it assembled. Fortunately, with guidance, the pins are on the front and the screws are on the back plate!!

    Crystal Regulator - Manufacturer Unknown?

    Kurt
     
  14. whatgoesaround

    whatgoesaround Registered User

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    I have to confess that whenever I have encountered the screws they were on the front, so when I took it apart to see why she would not run I "corrected" the position of the screws and pins. The screws were actually quite attractive with the silver colored portion. Yes, Eric, it has a brass cover on the bottom of the pendulum. Yours is a defiinite sister to mine.

    It looks like the pin is there because the click had a portion to stick in the open hole and it broke off, so to hold it in place the new pin was improvised. Kurt, my brass Anniversary clock in the above picture is a very close match to the one in your link, even the pendulum.

    Thanks Eric and Kurt for your help. I really like the finish, especially now. It looks like I will have to take the movement apart again and rearrange the pins and screws on the plate.
     
  15. MUN CHOR-WENG

    MUN CHOR-WENG Registered User

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    The back plate of your clock shown below though made by JUF is not the same as Plate 1471, as the holding screw of the ratchet click of your clock has been shifted a little to the left when JUF introduced a larger ratchet click to replace the smaller one used for Plate 1471. Your clock's back plate is unlisted.
    The link below contains more information from a recent discussion on this topic.

    Jahresuhrenfabrik in crystal regulator case


    img_2344-jpg.jpg

    Mun C W
     

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  16. MUN CHOR-WENG

    MUN CHOR-WENG Registered User

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  17. whatgoesaround

    whatgoesaround Registered User

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    Hello Mun,

    I see what you are talking about. Thanks for the explanation in the link.
     
  18. etmb61

    etmb61 Registered User
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    I was watching that auction. I thought it would sell for a lot more.

    Eric
     
  19. whatgoesaround

    whatgoesaround Registered User

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    Yes, I thought I got a great buy.
     

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