Jahres-Uhr Catalog No. 222

Discussion in '400-Day & Atmos' started by etmb61, Aug 23, 2019.

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  1. etmb61

    etmb61 Registered User
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    No_222.jpg
    Ok so I've found one of these to purchase, and as I await it's arrival I've been trying to find another example anywhere in my records or online.

    So far I've found only the one here:
    Help Identifying an inherited Clock

    The catalog supplement produced in 2018 says this model was made by Huber and Hauck. The clock I've purchased was made by JUF.

    Does anyone here own this model or have pictures of another they can share here?

    Thanks,
    Eric
     
  2. etmb61

    etmb61 Registered User
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    #2 etmb61, Aug 30, 2019
    Last edited: Aug 30, 2019
    Here is the new arrival, suffering from years of neglect. JUF number 56078 from 1907.

    56078_case.jpg plate.jpg

    The plate has the small "S" in the lower left corner, and the patent numbers are double struck so they look out of focus.

    It has the proper style disk for it's number, but it's not marked. It's probably the original. The movement and pendulum are apart for cleaning. The case will follow soon.

    Unfortunately the dial did not survive the trip.

    dial.jpg

    Anybody have one of these in their spares?

    The catalog says "gilt" but the protected areas in this case only have gold colored lacquer. I still have not found any more examples of this style.

    Eric
     
  3. tracerjack

    tracerjack Registered User
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    How disappointing about the dial. I would never have thought it, but porcelain/enamel dials can be repaired it seems. I’ve never gone any further than looking at repair examples on websites. The examples were so impressive, made me think it must be very expensive. Still, an option if no replacement can be found. All in all, quite a find. Looking forward to seeing it back together after some TLC.
     
  4. KurtinSA

    KurtinSA Registered User
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    #4 KurtinSA, Aug 31, 2019
    Last edited: Aug 31, 2019
    Your broken dial is different than what the catalog shows. Guess dials were interchangeable at the time of build. I have a number of spare dials mostly with the names Kundo, Schatz, Heco on the front. I do have one with a similar dial design to the catalog that has no name so I have no idea which clock it would go to. It says "Made in Germany" at the bottom. I have no idea of the dial material...it's not paper but ceramic, porcelain, something else? On the back, the enclosure has 3 prongs to go through the front plate and held in place with pins. Probably around 100mm in diameter.

    Kurt
     
  5. etmb61

    etmb61 Registered User
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    Kurt,

    It does have a different dial than the catalog, but it is the correct dial for the number on the JUF movement. Here is the pendulum (after cleaning) which also differs from the catalog, but is correct for the number on the JUF movement.
    pend.jpg

    I was thinking of using the dial from a 1920s louvre clock movement I picked up a few weeks ago off ebay, but it doesn't mount the same way to the dial pan. It would probably look too nice.

    The dial was chipped at 9 before it shipped so I was planning on having a new one made anyway (eventually). Having a good sample would make that go easier I'm sure. I do have another clock with a good dial I can make an image of.
    dial1.jpg

    Eric
     
  6. KurtinSA

    KurtinSA Registered User
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    Eric -

    What information are you drawing from to let you know that the it was the "correct dial for the number on the JUF movement"?

    You also must have a good eye as I don't see any difference between the catalog pendulum and the one you posted. I'll admit that disk pendulum differences tend to be pretty subtle to my eye.

    Thanks...Kurt
     
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  7. etmb61

    etmb61 Registered User
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    #7 etmb61, Sep 1, 2019
    Last edited: Sep 1, 2019
    Hi Kurt,

    I've been data mining the internet for information on 400 dayers a few years now. I use to log every clock that came up for sale. Now I just take the interesting ones. I also keep track of what's been posted to this board. If you get enough data, patterns pop out.

    The catalog picture has pendulum 21 from the repair guide, as does the clock in the link in my original post. Note the screws holding the gallery together. Pend 21 is most often found with clocks of the plate 1471 variety, like the one in the link.

    Numbered JUF clocks use a disk pendulum like to one I've shown above. How the disk was made changed over time but the look was the same. That pendulum is not listed in the repair guide, but it is shown with a few of the clocks in chapter 6.

    Dials are another story. Four inch dials on early clocks are kind of scarce. What my data indicates is if the dial has the "star burst" inside the numbers (my original dial) as opposed the floral pattern (catalog clock) than the movement was made by JUF, and is most often a numbered movement between 50000 and 65000. I don't think I have any examples in my records of that dial on any other maker's movement.

    Eric
     
  8. Dave T

    Dave T Registered User
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    Too bad about the dial. However, I've seen some pretty good examples of repaired pocket watch dials, but not with that much damage. Your dial appears to be made the same way as some good pocket watch dials.
    I'd be tempted to save all the pieces and piece it back together, and fill in the missing areas with some good porcelain paint. Similar to what was used on old kitchen ranges that were porcelain.
    I think it might be worth the attempt.
     
  9. etmb61

    etmb61 Registered User
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    Dave,

    Piecing it back together was my plan when it looked like this:

    dial2.jpg

    I even have the chip with the 9 on it, but most of the bits on the right side are too small to sort out. I thought about getting some enamel powders and a torch too. I can't make it any worse.

    I think for now I'll try to make a clean image from my other clock on gloss photo paper and use that until I get the replacement made.

    Thankfully the rest of the clock is in really good shape. It should clean up nice.

    Eric
     
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  10. KurtinSA

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    Eric -

    Those are some eyes to notice those screw heads on the pendulum gallery. Never would have seen them! :glasses:

    Kurt
     
  11. etmb61

    etmb61 Registered User
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    I said years of neglect, but it appears to be only ONE year.

    Here is the bottom plate:
    bottom_outer.jpg

    It still has most of the original finish along with some repair person's corroded mark and the date "28 06 18". The case and back plate shown above has just one year worth of corrosion!

    I've had to scrape through the white crust.

    Never use a liquid polish!

    Eric
     
  12. MartinM

    MartinM Registered User

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    Why not 101 years?
     
  13. etmb61

    etmb61 Registered User
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    The markings look like an electric vibrating engraver was used to make them, unless they had those back then.
     
  14. etmb61

    etmb61 Registered User
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    Correction, I have found a six Hauck clocks with this same dial.
     
  15. MartinM

    MartinM Registered User

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    You're more the expert in this area, but earlier, I was going to say that I've ONLY seen this dial on Hauck clocks.
     
  16. etmb61

    etmb61 Registered User
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    I certainly would not say I'm an expert. I seem to have left out quite a few examples that I should have counted. My earlier statement about the "star burst" dials in general is in error. But, in my records, for the cluster of JUF clocks made with 4 inch enameled dials in 1906/7, not marked Urania, the "star burst" dial is more common.
     
  17. MartinM

    MartinM Registered User

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    My bad, Eric. I took your saying you could use the "Anniversary" dial as a source to print a new one for the JUF a bit too literally.
     
  18. Ingulphus

    Ingulphus Registered User

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    I have a Wurth four glass model with a similar dial that I'm slowly restoring. I've seen the same dial on a Wurth Louvre model.

    Wurth 4 Glass Dial.jpg
     
  19. etmb61

    etmb61 Registered User
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    I guess the dial is more common than I thought. Any luck finding another example of the case?
     
  20. etmb61

    etmb61 Registered User
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    Minor update.

    Put the case back together to see if I was making any progress. There were several places I had to scrape to get through the old polish residue leaving pitting and a copper color that I haven't been able to clean up by hand. It's far from perfect, but I wanted it back together before I lost something.

    56078_case_2.jpg
     

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