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Is the KWM bushing machine available

ChrisCam

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Is the full KWM bushing machine (not the hand tool which i already have) available and if so is it obtainable from a UK supplier that anyone knows of?
 

THTanner

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they have been back ordered and not available for about 2 years now - I spoke with the owner of the shop that makes them and he indicated that new casting molds were being made to restart production - but that was a year ago.
 
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ChrisCam

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they have been back ordered and not available for about 2 years now - I spoke with the owner of the shop that makes them and he indicated that new casting molds were being made to restart production - but that was a year ago.
Many thanks for that . If the KWM are better than Burgeon why was the KWM version halted and is there a good supply of bushes for the KWM/
Regards
Chris
 

shutterbug

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They aren't better than Burgeon, just typically smaller. I'm pretty sure you can get reamers for the Burgeon that will fit the KWM sizes.
 

THTanner

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I have a KWM that I got used - It fits both the Burgeon and other reamers with an adapter - I ended up with a mix of new reamers from a clock shop and got the KWM for that reason - you will very occasionally see them for sale at auction. The rails on mine are slightly warped for some reason so sliding the lock down plates is a bit sticky but that just means they are really tight in place.If you can find one used you would do well to pay the price. You can then use pretty much any bushings and any of the reamers and other bushing tool parts that are commonly available. I especially like the two handed operation where you rotate with one hand and apply pressure with the other.

I don't know why it was halted or what the new castings are supposed to do better. I think part of the issue is that the prices advertised, including all those tools, is quite a bit below a comparable full setup for other makes.
 
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ChrisCam

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I have a KWM that I got used - It fits both the Burgeon and other reamers with an adapter - I ended up with a mix of new reamers from a clock shop and got the KWM for that reason - you will very occasionally see them for sale at auction. The rails on mine are slightly warped for some reason so sliding the lock down plates is a bit sticky but that just means they are really tight in place.If you can find one used you would do well to pay the price. You can then use pretty much any bushings and any of the reamers and other bushing tool parts that are commonly available. I especially like the two handed operation where you rotate with one hand and apply pressure with the other.

I don't know why it was halted or what the new castings are supposed to do better. I think part of the issue is that the prices advertised, including all those tools, is quite a bit below a comparable full setup for other makes.
Cheers TH very useful.
Chris
 

MARK A. BUTTERWORTH

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Many thanks for that . If the KWM are better than Burgeon why was the KWM version halted and is there a good supply of bushes for the KWM/
Regards
Chris[/QUOTEs
This situation is typically due in a low volume manufacturing to waiting until there are sufficient orders to justify making a new run on something. It may be now that the original dies and castings are simply worn to where they no longer meet original specs. I personally believe the KWM machine is the best of them, although we use a drill press ourselves
 

David S

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Chris some time back you had a thread about a suitable small lathe for clock work. As I recall you were leaning toward Sherline. Not sure where that stands now. However if I were going to purchase a Sherline lathe, I would not purchase a dedicated bushing machine, but rather the Sherline mill.

David
 
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MARK A. BUTTERWORTH

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I
Chris some time back you had a thread about a suitable small lathe for clock work. As I recall you were leaning toward Sherline. Not sure where that stands now. However if I were going to purchase a Sherline lathe, I would not purchase a dedicated bushing machine, but rather the Sherline mill.

David
I agree. One of the points being is that a lot of the attachments interchange
 

ChrisCam

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Chris some time back you had a thread about a suitable small lathe for clock work. As I recall you were leaning toward Sherline. Not sure where that stands now. However if I were going to purchase a Sherline lathe, I would not purchase a dedicated bushing machine, but rather the Sherline mill.

David
Thanks David, I have a feeling you may be right and my money may well be better placed buying a mill as I can bush by hand. I am beginning to see it is the tools i can make that will be of great potential benefit. Still waiting for Sherline guy to get back to me with one he is importing at the end of the month and I will ask him if he can price me for a mill attachment for the 8 inch lathe. Is there any thing I should ask for that would be worth knowing?
Kind regards
Chris
 

Bruce Alexander

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David S

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Thanks David, I have a feeling you may be right and my money may well be better placed buying a mill as I can bush by hand. I am beginning to see it is the tools i can make that will be of great potential benefit. Still waiting for Sherline guy to get back to me with one he is importing at the end of the month and I will ask him if he can price me for a mill attachment for the 8 inch lathe. Is there any thing I should ask for that would be worth knowing?
Kind regards
Chris
First I am not an expert on Sherline equipment and accessories. I was referring to a stand alone mill, not an attachment to the lathe. I have experience with small combination lathe ./ mills as well as the milling attachment for my Atlas 618. In my experience these are not suitable for bushing clock plates. It looks like Bruce is getting his new mill up to speed so he can give your first hand experience as he progresses.

And by the way, once you have the mill you can make your own clock plate bushing fixtures.
fixture for holding plates.jpg

David
 

ChrisCam

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Chris, you can bush using the Mill. It will be every bit as accurate as a bushing machine. It can also be used as a depthing tool as per procedures developed and taught by Jerry Kieffer. Sherline even offers a Clock Bushing Kit as per Jerry's specs. I've just incorporated this equipment into my shop and have been very happy with my decision thus far.

See these links: Products by Category

Horological Milling Machine Bushing and Depthing Accessory – Sherline Products
Thanks for this extremely useful.

regards
Chris
 

Bruce Alexander

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And by the way, once you have the mill you can make your own clock plate bushing fixtures.
That's very true. Dad1891 very kindly shared his extremely precise methodology with me. He fabricated his own clock plate bushing fixtures which are less bulky than those supplied by Sherline. There's a little more to the kit than just the fixtures, but you can make your own.

Thanks for this extremely useful.
You're very welcome Chris. I've only just started using my Mill to bush plates but it's much more accurate and precise than the method I was using before. I recently placed six bushings in a Seth Thomas R. Kaiser Round 15-day Time and Strike Movement for a customer. It's swinging away with vigor on day 7. So far, so good. I have an R. Kaiser in our Collection. I think I'll need to go back through it with this method. Getting the Mill to Bush makes good sense when you compare the cost of dedicated single-use equipment like a Bushing Machine or Depthing Tool, but it's like getting a Lathe to Polish Pivots. Sure, it will allow you to do a great job, but in the end, your time and imagination are the only limits to what you can do with the equipment.

I think you can also acquire the Mill Base and Column without the Motor. Evidently it's a quick and simple matter to swap the motor from your lathe into the Mill. That could save you a few hundred I think. It's certainly worth looking into. I just opted to get the complete machine so it's all set up and ready to go whenever I am.
 
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Uhralt

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I think you can also acquire the Mill Base and Column without the Motor. Evidently it's a quick and simple matter to swap the motor from your lathe into the Mill. That could save you a few hundred I think. It's certainly worth looking into. I just opted to get the complete machine so it's all set up and ready to go whenever I am.
Initially I went that way but I found that there are often occasions where you work with the mill and the lathe at the same time, so swapping forth and back becomes time consuming. After a few months I bought a second motor unit. Much happier now.

Uhralt
 
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mauleg

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Initially I went that way but I found that there are often occasions where you work with the mill and the lathe at the same time, so swapping forth and back becomes time consuming. After a few months I bought a second motor unit. Much happier now.

Uhralt
I saw that Sherline also makes a Lathe Vertical Milling Column with which, according to Sherline, "Conversion from the lathe to milling takes less than one minute". Does anyone have experience with this device? Also, would it work with the Horological Milling Machine Bushing and Depthing Accessory? This would be for personal, infrequent use only; I'm currently doing everything by hand and do not have a lathe.
 

ChrisCam

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Initially I went that way but I found that there are often occasions where you work with the mill and the lathe at the same time, so swapping forth and back becomes time consuming. After a few months I bought a second motor unit. Much happier now.

Uhralt
Thanks Chaps will make some initial enquiries.
Regards
Chris
 

Bruce Alexander

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Hi Mauleg,
I saw that Sherline also makes a Lathe Vertical Milling Column with which, according to Sherline, "Conversion from the lathe to milling takes less than one minute". Does anyone have experience with this device? Also, would it work with the Horological Milling Machine Bushing and Depthing Accessory?
I'm not sure but I think the Milling Column attachment essentially converts the Lathe's Cross Slide into a Mill Base. The Cross Slide's relatively small size and range of movement beneath the Column would be a limitation on using the Lathe as a Mill. The Bushing Accessory will probably work with the Cross Slide, but you might not be able to fit a very large movement plate on it.

I don't have any experience with the Column Attachment so if anyone knows differently, please correct me if I'm wrong.

Regards,

Bruce
 

ChrisCam

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Hi Mauleg,


I'm not sure but I think the Milling Column attachment essentially converts the Lathe's Cross Slide into a Mill Base. The Cross Slide's relatively small size and range of movement beneath the Column would be a limitation on using the Lathe as a Mill. The Bushing Accessory will probably work with the Cross Slide, but you might not be able to fit a very large movement plate on it.

I don't have any experience with the Column Attachment so if anyone knows differently, please correct me if I'm wrong.

Regards,

Bruce
Thanks Bruce, baring in mind at the moment I am not clued up are you saying that Sherline offer more than one option to convert the lathe into a milling machine and that one option is a column attachment and the other a more or fuller milling attachment or are you saying there is only one option whichn is restrictive?
Regards
Chris
 

ChrisCam

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Thanks Bruce, baring in mind at the moment I am not clued up are you saying that Sherline offer more than one option to convert the lathe into a milling machine and that one option is a column attachment and the other a more or fuller milling attachment or are you saying there is only one option whichn is restrictive?
Regards
Chris
After looking I think you are suggesting the Sherline 5000 / 5010 stand alone Mill or the Vertical Colum attachment which is the lesser alternative?
Chris
 

Bruce Alexander

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Hi Chris,

Sherline has a Manual Mill Column that can 'retro-fit' their Lathe to form a Mill. The Lathe's Cross Slide forms the base of the Mill, but it is relatively small. Here's an image url I found on the web: 71128d1330031534-sherline-4400-mill-column-pix-dscn0378.jpg

Source: http://www.penturners.org/forum/att...34-sherline-4400-mill-column-pix-dscn0378.jpg

Another option is basically to buy a Mill Base and Column without the Headstock & Motor/Control. You have the size and full range of one of Sherline's dedicated Mills. If you have a compatible Lathe, you can swap the Headstock & Motor/Control unit between the Lathe and the Mill. They call it their XYZ Base. I think this is the option that Uhrait was discussing earlier in your Thread. For more details, ask him.
Here is a link to the Sherline website which describes it: XYZ Bases – Sherline Products

The other option, of course, is to obtain a complete Lathe and Mill.

Sherline offers quite a few basic machines, packages, options and accessories.

I think that you'll want to make sure your Mill has the "Adjustable Zero" Hand Wheels. They would be a "nice to have" option on the Lathe too but probably not as important.

Hope that helps.

Regards,

Bruce