Information on Klee & Groh

[abuccellato]

Hello again everyone. I have a watch that is branded Klee & Groh Rochester, NY. I found some references to a jeweler with that name and location on the internet, but I cannot find any info on who made the works. Have any of you heard of this company and know where the movement comes from? Thank you!

 

[Appa69]

I believe it to be Swiss. The cross on the balance cock, and something is written on the plate near the balance as well.

 

[Kent]

Hi abuccellato:

Welcome back to the NAWCC American Pocket Watch Message Board!

I haven't heasd of Klee & Groh before but I did get a number of 'hits' for them in the NYS Historic Newspapers website.

The movement seems to be an unadjusted, 15-jewel watch. Broadly speaking, if one were to consider all jeweled watch movements as being separated into three grade groups; low (unadjusted); medium (adjusted to temperature and up to 3-4 positions); and high (adjusted to 5+ positions); then this movement can be considered to be in the upper end of the low grade group. I can't be sure, but it appears to be marked "Swiss" below the balance, at the rim.

Your Watch Case is gold-filled and was made by the Star Watch Case Co. It's fited with a Wachter Safety Bow.

 

[miguel angel cladera]

Its a nice Longines

 

[abuccellato]

You all are awesome! I didn't notice the writing under the balance wheel. Using a loupe, it definitely says "SWISS". I tried to take a good pic of it for you all, but it always comes out illegible. Thank you to Appa69 and Kent! And a great thank you to Miguel for finding the movement! This is great. I bought this on a whim from an antique shop years ago, thinking it looked at least like a decent 15 jewel movement, but then was never able to find any info on the Klee & Groh company. Thank you guys so much for solving this particular mystery for me.

 

[MrRoundel]

Welcome to the NAWCC message board and the WWW (Wonderful World of Watches).

The ID looks good to me. (Note: At that time Longines made a few different sized movements that look a lot alike.) I have a private label Longines of a slightly larger caliber, a c19.70. It has the same layout as yours, which I believe is known as a "Savonette" in Switzerland. Here in the states we call it a hunter case. It is when the movement winds at the 3 o'clock position. This is true regardless of whether the movement is in an open-face/Lepine case.

From what I have seen of this vintage Longines, they have often lost a lot of their nickel finish over the years. I don't know if it's just that they have a thin plating or if watchmakers leave them in cleaners for too long. Your finish look quite good, with very little "clean-through" showing on the plates. It shows up as a bit of discoloration on the plates/bridges.

Oh, and as a word to the wise, even though your case is gold-filled, as opposed to solid gold, you'll want to take care when opening and closing the case. Press to release the cover. Press, close, and release to close the cover. This preserves the lip inside the case lid that the closing spring engages with. Brass versus steel, steel wins. Getting that crystal replaced is probably prudent as well. It won't get any easier to find the right size as time goes on.

And if it runs with a winding, try to resist the temptation of running too much unless it's been cleaned and oiled recently, say over the past 10 years or so. I'm probably being liberal here, but an occasional full wind shouldn't do much harm if it's been cleaned in the last decade. I it hasn't been cleaned/oiled, little run time is suggested until it gets such a service. Enjoy your watch! Cheers.

 

[abuccellato]

Welcome to the NAWCC message board and the WWW (Wonderful World of Watches).

The ID looks good to me. (Note: At that time Longines made a few different sized movements that look a lot alike.) I have a private label Longines of a slightly larger caliber, a c19.70. It has the same layout as yours, which I believe is known as a "Savonette" in Switzerland. Here in the states we call it a hunter case. It is when the movement winds at the 3 o'clock position. This is true regardless of whether the movement is in an open-face/Lepine case.

From what I have seen of this vintage Longines, they have often lost a lot of their nickel finish over the years. I don't know if it's just that they have a thin plating or if watchmakers leave them in cleaners for too long. Your finish look quite good, with very little "clean-through" showing on the plates. It shows up as a bit of discoloration on the plates/bridges.

Oh, and as a word to the wise, even though your case is gold-filled, as opposed to solid gold, you'll want to take care when opening and closing the case. Press to release the cover. Press, close, and release to close the cover. This preserves the lip inside the case lid that the closing spring engages with. Brass versus steel, steel wins. Getting that crystal replaced is probably prudent as well. It won't get any easier to find the right size as time goes on.

And if it runs with a winding, try to resist the temptation of running too much unless it's been cleaned and oiled recently, say over the past 10 years or so. I'm probably being liberal here, but an occasional full wind shouldn't do much harm if it's been cleaned in the last decade. I it hasn't been cleaned/oiled, little run time is suggested until it gets such a service. Enjoy your watch! Cheers.

Great info, thank you! I noticed that the main spring that Miguel showed was positioned opposite to what I have. Thanks for the advise on closing the clam shell and operating the watches. I have a modest collection of watches, but most I just use as display pieces. It's not the most expensive collection, but like them because I think they're neat!

 

[MrRoundel]

FYI, I just came across the response I received from Longines about my movement. They referred to it as a 19.71 caliber, not a 19.70. I'll defer to them on this.