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Illinois 12s 21J Executive question

49stude63

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Mar 21, 2009
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I have a Illinois 12 size 21 jewel movement marked "Executive" marked adjusted 3 positions w/sn 4685674. I don't see it listed in Shugart's guide book. It looks to be an Illinois marked watch and not a private label.

Thanks

http://inlinethumb39.webshots.com/27558/2944617730075349633S425x425Q85.jpg
 

doug sinclair

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Aug 27, 2000
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In their book American Pocket Watches-Encylopedia & Price Guide-Illinois Watch Co., Meggers & Ehrhardt list the Executive as a 12-size, 21 jewel, model 1, open faced movement. The listing is in the "private label" section of the book, on page 240. So it appears to be a pretty good assumption that it is a private label.

Doug S.
 
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terry hall

NAWCC Silver Member
Apr 12, 2001
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Just remember... Private Label can mean:

A movement marked with a jeweler or personal name/location or...

A movement with a contracted marking... such as Executive... or Rail Road King, Hallmark, etc....
 

Jim Carroll

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Aug 27, 2002
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Your watch is a grade 274 model 1 adjusted to 3 positions; it comes from the run 4684,001 – 4,687,000 = 3,000, Executive models also turn up in grades 405 and 406.

Time King 300 estimate
Wavy lined pattern demaskeening.

Illinois Watch Co. 200 estimate
Sunburst pattern demaskeening.

Illinois Watch Co. 500 estimate
Bright lined pattern demaskeening.

Federal 500 estimate
Sunburst pattern demaskeening.

Executive 300 estimate
Ringed fishscale pattern demaskeening.

Criterion 200 estimate
Broad striped pattern demaskeening.

Paramount 300 estimate
Wavy lined pattern demaskeening.

Illinois Watch Co. 700 estimate
Bright lined pattern demaskeening.
 

49stude63

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Mar 21, 2009
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Thanks I that information is extremely helpful since nothing was showing up in the guide books that I had access to.
 

Kevin W.

NAWCC Member
Apr 11, 2002
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Nice watch, sure is a keeper.
i am a fan of 12 sz watches.:):):):)
 

49stude63

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Mar 21, 2009
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Keven I plan to do that, I have to replace the dial and missing sec hand and get the balance staff repair (cleaning also). The spade hands are very nice but the metal dial seems to have given up the ghost so I am looking on ebay for porcelain or nice metal one. The only other 21 jewel 12 size watches that I have is a South Bend Studebaker, and some 19J Waltham and a 19J Lord Elgin. It has a bit of discoloration on one winding wheel but the rest of the movement is in great condition. Here is another shot that shows the "Executive" engraving a bit better.

http://inlinethumb12.webshots.com/43083/2924883920075349633S425x425Q85.jpg
 

Kevin W.

NAWCC Member
Apr 11, 2002
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A nice looking watch and well worth restoring.
The private label Illinois watches are really nice like a Hallmark that i have,the nicest i have is the 12 sz Abe Lincoln, that is my favourite and the next likely would be the Autocrat.
Enjoy and wear your watch after you get it restored.:)
 

rschussel

Registered User
Mar 1, 2002
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Kevin
Illinois must have over 1,000 12 size private labels. Thus many of them aren't listed in the reference books.

Bob
 

Kevin W.

NAWCC Member
Apr 11, 2002
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Yes i realize there were many and i like the ones i have, which are not many.
It is a interesting hobby just to collect 12 sz private labels from the makers.
 

49stude63

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Mar 21, 2009
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Kevin I would agree, I thought I was lucky with my Elgin grade 361 (only 1000 made) but with the Illinois 12s that I have it shows only 300 made and it isn't just a name on it that makes it different but also the damaskeening effect. I have an Elgin 3 finger that is what I considered "private label" with instead of Elgin it has William B Krill but the movement looks like any other Elgin grade 339. On the Illinois Executive that is not the case, it appears Illinois made an effort to make a major difference on these private label runs.

On the William B Krill I did a search and found this
Descendants of James Driscoll 1 William J. Deniel b: 1846 d: 23 Mar 1901
..+Elizabeth Mary Shanahan nee Butler b: 15 Jul 1846
...2 Anna Mary DeNial b: 1875
.......+William Berthold Krill b: 11 Dec 1878 d: 24 Feb 1942

And the information on the movement off the Elgin site
Serial Number SN Range RunQty Name Year grade size code jewels Adj/reg/etc.
-------------- -------- ------ ---- ---- ----- ---- ------ ------ ------------
12724057 12724001 1000 1906 339* 16s hbn6p 17j e
 

Kevin W.

NAWCC Member
Apr 11, 2002
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William B Krill would be a jewellery store owner or a watch inspector, just wondering?:)
 

49stude63

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Mar 21, 2009
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Kevin I tried to access the family members by using the website link but I will try another route to see what kind of information I can get since the dates seem to make since and that is a bit of an unusual name, so the middel initial matching is unique.
 

LloydB

Registered User
Feb 24, 2006
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Kevin I tried to access the family members by using the website link but I will try another route to see what kind of information I can get since the dates seem to make since and that is a bit of an unusual name, so the middel initial matching is unique.
You've probably already located this, there's a picture at this site:

http://www.hershberger.org/Genealogy/Krill/Pictures/WmBKrillFamily.htm

Also, there's another "William B. Krill" (16-s) listed in the Elgin Private Label Database:

http://www.nawcc-info.org/Fogarty/ElginPrivateAll.asp

Listed as a "16s, Gr290, 6th Model, 7j"
 
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49stude63

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Mar 21, 2009
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I will post the data on the movement that I have so it can also be entered. The dates seem to be close for both movements, I overlooked that there was a Sr & Jr one of the sons was involved/owned a electronics company and died in Erie (PA I think) in the mid 2000's and his father was William B Krill. Donald is the little boy in the first row on the very left side.

Donald F. Krill
Donald F. Krill, 84, of Erie, died Friday, Dec. 26, 2003.
He was born Dec. 11, 1919, in Erie, son of the late William Berthold Krill and Anne DeNile Krill.
He founded Don F. Krill Co., a creative manufacturing design firm, in the early 1960s.
He was an inventor and machine design engineer. He was awarded several patents and was recognized for designing and manufacturing the first electronic full-wave bridge rectifier that was used in the Apollo space program and became part of the lunar-landing equipment.
 
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