Please ID this Clock ID: Vintage Toll & Courtis Johannesburg Large Fusee Clock

Discussion in 'General Clock Discussions' started by danjard, Feb 11, 2020.

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  1. danjard

    danjard New Member

    Feb 11, 2020
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    Hello,

    I'm hoping someone will be able to shed some light on this vintage clock.

    I have done some research and I believe (but could definitely be wrong!) that it is a fusee clock, that the maker of the clock is Toll & Courtis (I am unable to get in to the case to see what is underneath the hand covering the name) who were a Watch and Jewellery maker in the late 1800's in South Africa.

    The clock face is 18 inches in diameter and due to its large scale and quality I was wondering if it had been for industrial use, possibly a railway station or school?

    I can only find examples of Toll & Courtis pocket watches and have found no examples of clocks made by them.

    If anyone has any information and can share their knowledge with me that would be very much appreciated.

    Thank you.

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  2. bruce linde

    bruce linde Technical Admin
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    Nov 13, 2011
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    what it says on the dial may or may not have anything to do with who made it... it could have been purchased for their shop, and the name added.

    why are you not able to get into the case? remove the pendulum from the side door and then lay it on its back before removing the four round wood pegs that hold the dial/bezel/movement assembly in place... and then you can lift off the front and take some better photos of the movement. from there, you could also remove the hands and you''ll see how to unpin the dial from the movement.
     
  3. danjard

    danjard New Member

    Feb 11, 2020
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    I am so new to this I wasn't sure how to open up the clock, I have done so after taking your advice and photos are attached. Thank you for your help!


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  4. bruce linde

    bruce linde Technical Admin
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    Nov 13, 2011
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    well done. the bad (not really bad, but unfortunate) news is that most fusee movements are unmarked and they all look kind of the same. there are ones where there's gut, and ones where there's a chain. you have a chain one. i like those better, but that's a personal and not professional preference. i'm going to stick with my guess about the dial being more about the business than the actual maker, but that's a hobbyist guess rather than professional. :cool:

    when you say 18" dial... are you talking about just the white dial? or including the bezel?

    and... the movement is filthy and needs to be serviced. it may run as is, but you can see how dirty the chain is. you probably want to find a local clock shop or nawcc chapter member who can clean and service the movement for you.

    nice clock!!!
     
  5. John Arrowood

    John Arrowood Registered User
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    Dec 14, 2001
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    Be careful if you decide to remove the hands since some fusee hour hands are attached to the cannon pinion with a screw instead of being a push on friction fit.
     
  6. novicetimekeeper

    novicetimekeeper Registered User

    Jul 26, 2015
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    The screwed pillars show that it is more than likely post 1900.

    It is very unusual in my experience to have a bezel hinged at the top like that. To wind it would mean holding the bezel up with one hand while winding with the other.
     
  7. Chris Radano

    Chris Radano Registered User

    Feb 18, 2004
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    That's a fine industrial clock. To have a top-hinged bezel is pretty standard for 20th century mechanical clock with an 18" (or larger) dial. Seth Thomas made clocks with 30 day movements, with either an 18" or 24" dial that had a top-hinged bezel. I even saw one with a 30" dial, but it was in poor condition.
     
  8. jmclaugh

    jmclaugh Registered User

    Jun 1, 2006
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    Nice clock and a top hinged dial is as Nick says unusual for the reason he mentions. I agree that most fusee movements are unmarked but not that they all look the same as they don't. Anyway the name on the dial would be the retailer, it looks late 19th early 20th C and was most likely it was imported from England but I know nothing as to clockmaking in South Africa.
     
  9. novicetimekeeper

    novicetimekeeper Registered User

    Jul 26, 2015
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    That is presumably to reduce strain on the hinge and stop the clock trying to rotate on its supports with a heavy door, but it can't make it easy to wind. I've never seen it before on an English clock.
     
  10. Levi Hutchins

    Levi Hutchins Registered User

    Oct 21, 2012
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    I have two Seikosha time & strike wall clocks (12" and 14" dials) that are top-hinged.
    The bottom of the bezels rest on the top of my head while I wind them.

    The 12" also has the same style hands as the one under discussion:

    DSCN2351 (1).jpg

     
  11. novicetimekeeper

    novicetimekeeper Registered User

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    Perhaps it is related to the American market, I think that was a big market for Japanese clocks. If American dial clocks had the same feature.

    English made clocks tend to follow fairly conservative lines and particularly so with dial clocks.
     
  12. jmclaugh

    jmclaugh Registered User

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    I find it enough exercise winding my fusee dial clock without having to contend with supporting the bezel on the top of my head.
     
  13. novicetimekeeper

    novicetimekeeper Registered User

    Jul 26, 2015
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    I agree, I can see the advantage on a big clock from the point of view of preserving the hinges. I have to support the bezel on my wooden bezel clock and on several of the others where the hinges have worn I have to lift the door as I shut it to engage the lock.
     

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