How many copies of "The Horolovar Collection" do exist?

Discussion in '400-Day & Atmos' started by Burkhard Rasch, Dec 28, 2015.

  1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.
  1. Burkhard Rasch

    Burkhard Rasch Registered User
    NAWCC Member

    Jun 1, 2007
    4,676
    98
    48
    Male
    General-and trauma surgeon
    Twistringen
    Country Flag:
    Region Flag:
    #1 Burkhard Rasch, Dec 28, 2015
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 31, 2017
    Yesterday I got my hardcover copy of "The Horolovar Collection" by Terwilliger.It's a nice read,the photos of the rare clocks are verry interesting;I didn't know before that this book existed.As it is a limited edition and numbered,I´d like to know how many copies are distributed in our comunity.I've learned that some are even signed by C.Terwilliger;not mine.
    So here I go: I have No.316,unsigned.
    Burkhard
     
  2. sjaffe

    sjaffe Registered User

    Dec 25, 2012
    415
    2
    18
    Engineer
    Santa Rosa,CA
    Country Flag:
    Region Flag:
    #2 sjaffe, Dec 28, 2015
    Last edited: Dec 28, 2015
    It might help to know what edition and published year it is. Looks like the 1991 10th edition is what is currently available. These are commonly sold by a number of book sources and clock suppliers. It's a very common clock book.
    Stan

    EDIT: Sorry, I just realized you were not talking about the Repair Guide.
     
  3. etmb61

    etmb61 Registered User
    NAWCC Member

    Oct 25, 2010
    2,204
    91
    48
    Retired Avionics Technician
    Mascoutah, IL
    Country Flag:
    Region Flag:
    #3 etmb61, Dec 28, 2015
    Last edited: Dec 28, 2015
    Burkhard,

    Good job finding a copy. I've only seen a few for sale. You'll find a lot of the information it contains was reprinted in the Repair Guide, along with most of the illustrations, but there is some new stuff. I think the original sales price in 1962 was $10.

    I have No. 656, unsigned.

    I saw a signed copy for sale some time ago on ebay. The curious thing about it was it was not numbered.

    Eric
     

    Attached Files:

    • THC.jpg
      File size:
      109 KB
      Views:
      78
  4. Dick C

    Dick C Registered User

    Oct 14, 2009
    1,538
    40
    48
    Male
    Country Flag:
    #4 Dick C, Dec 28, 2015
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 31, 2017
    A couple of booksellers claim that there were 1,000 copies printed....1962
     
  5. Les Sanders

    Les Sanders Registered User
    NAWCC Member

    Apr 3, 2010
    639
    7
    18
    Clock Repairman
    Sahuarita Arizona
    Country Flag:
    Region Flag:
    Burhard, I thought you were going to send that to me for Christmas. LOL! Nice Book!
     
  6. etmb61

    etmb61 Registered User
    NAWCC Member

    Oct 25, 2010
    2,204
    91
    48
    Retired Avionics Technician
    Mascoutah, IL
    Country Flag:
    Region Flag:
    The author makes that claim too.

    Eric
     

    Attached Files:

  7. John Hubby

    John Hubby Principal Administrator
    Staff Member NAWCC Star Fellow NAWCC Life Member

    Sep 7, 2000
    12,075
    163
    63
    The Woodlands, TX
    Country Flag:
    Region Flag:
    #7 John Hubby, Dec 29, 2015
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 31, 2017
    A little known tidbit is that the first fifty copies were leather bound and presented by Terwilliger to his best friends and customers. Terwilliger autographed each one and presented it by name to the recipient. I've seen only one of these and would dearly love to find another for sale. My copy is No. 645.

    One of my "long term" projects is to complete an errata booklet to provide updated info on what has been discovered since "The Horolovar Collection" was published. I've compiled notes and have noted that less than 24 of the 143 pages do not have any errors when compared to today's knowledge. It's easy to find the errors in identification especially now that we know of clocks made by Gustav Becker (cylinder escapement), L. Furtwängler Söhne, Hanau Uhrenfabrik, Steinheuer & Rabe, Wendes Metzger, Carl Bauer, Andreas Huber, W. Würth & Co, Ph. Hauck, Wintermantel, Schlenker & Posner that weren't identified or even known to have made 400-Day clocks at the time Terwilliger wrote the book. Many of these are in the Horolovar Collection, mis-identified as some other maker. There are a lot of dating errors as well and other information that is known but not yet properly published. Needless to say it will be a couple of years or more before this all comes about.
     
  8. shutterbug

    shutterbug Moderator
    NAWCC Member

    Oct 19, 2005
    40,240
    622
    113
    Male
    Self employed interpreter/clock repairer
    Iowa
    Country Flag:
    Region Flag:
    We're looking forward to it, John! :)
     
  9. Burkhard Rasch

    Burkhard Rasch Registered User
    NAWCC Member

    Jun 1, 2007
    4,676
    98
    48
    Male
    General-and trauma surgeon
    Twistringen
    Country Flag:
    Region Flag:
    is it known what happened to that collection? Is it still together or distributed over the whole community of collectors?
    Burkhard
     
  10. etmb61

    etmb61 Registered User
    NAWCC Member

    Oct 25, 2010
    2,204
    91
    48
    Retired Avionics Technician
    Mascoutah, IL
    Country Flag:
    Region Flag:
  11. shutterbug

    shutterbug Moderator
    NAWCC Member

    Oct 19, 2005
    40,240
    622
    113
    Male
    Self employed interpreter/clock repairer
    Iowa
    Country Flag:
    Region Flag:
    etmb61 - I get a warning from McAfee when attempting to go to your linked site. Some kind of risk attached to it.
     
  12. etmb61

    etmb61 Registered User
    NAWCC Member

    Oct 25, 2010
    2,204
    91
    48
    Retired Avionics Technician
    Mascoutah, IL
    Country Flag:
    Region Flag:
    That's odd. The link is from the sticky at the top of this forum.
     
  13. Dick C

    Dick C Registered User

    Oct 14, 2009
    1,538
    40
    48
    Male
    Country Flag:
    I have no problems getting to it using Norton security
     
  14. Keith Conklin

    Keith Conklin Registered User
    NAWCC Member

    Aug 22, 2018
    33
    3
    8
    Male
    Selden, New York
    Country Flag:
    Region Flag:

    Mine
    Mine is letter "L" and is signed.

    IMG_3647.JPG IMG_3648.JPG IMG_3651.JPG
     
  15. jeffm

    jeffm Registered User

    Mar 21, 2010
    7
    1
    3
    Clothing pattern maker
    Niwot, Colorado
    Country Flag:
    I acquired book # 847 today. It was a library copy in another life, but it is in good condition.
    I was able to buy the clock #19 in the book from Dave Cooper, who bought it from Bob Terwilliger, Charles's son. Dave did a beautiful job of restoring it. I feel very lucky to have piece of Charles's collection. It runs very nicely

    Terwilliger clock 2019-01-18.jpg
     
    Keith Conklin likes this.
  16. etmb61

    etmb61 Registered User
    NAWCC Member

    Oct 25, 2010
    2,204
    91
    48
    Retired Avionics Technician
    Mascoutah, IL
    Country Flag:
    Region Flag:
    Jeff,

    Could you confirm the serial number of the clock? It is 16326?

    Thanks,
    Eric
     
  17. jeffm

    jeffm Registered User

    Mar 21, 2010
    7
    1
    3
    Clothing pattern maker
    Niwot, Colorado
    Country Flag:
    Hi Eric, The serial number is 23866. The picture of #19 shows a small, protruding diagonal dent on the very bottom of the base, below the left column. My clock has the same dent. -Jeff

    Terwilliger dent.jpg Terwilliger serial # 23866.jpg
     
  18. etmb61

    etmb61 Registered User
    NAWCC Member

    Oct 25, 2010
    2,204
    91
    48
    Retired Avionics Technician
    Mascoutah, IL
    Country Flag:
    Region Flag:
    Jeff,

    Thanks for the update.

    The reason I asked was your clock is shown the Repair Guide, number 61 on page 39 (10th ed.). The associate plate number 1423 has serial number 16326, but I can now see that goes with clock 17 from the collection which is number 56 in the guide. I should have known from the suspension bracket.

    Your clock was made by Würth and would originally have had a disk pendulum. I own number 23662 shown here Late model Wurth with its original pendulum.

    Eric
     
  19. jeffm

    jeffm Registered User

    Mar 21, 2010
    7
    1
    3
    Clothing pattern maker
    Niwot, Colorado
    Country Flag:
    Is it possible to locate the disc for this clock? I have a feeling I should keep the clock as pictured in the Terwilliger books.
     
  20. etmb61

    etmb61 Registered User
    NAWCC Member

    Oct 25, 2010
    2,204
    91
    48
    Retired Avionics Technician
    Mascoutah, IL
    Country Flag:
    Region Flag:
    #20 etmb61, Jan 19, 2019
    Last edited: Jan 19, 2019
    Sure it's possible to find a disc, but probably not the disc. I've seen a few loose Würth pendulums for sale online in recent years. The problem is they made a relatively small number of clocks and a good portion of those used the "Crown" pendulum, number 20 in the guide. Kienzle used disc pendulums made very similar to those used by Würth. One of those would probably be easier to find. The differences are hard to spot if you don't know what you're looking for.

    Because it's a historical piece, I might keep it as it is, but I really like to find original parts when I can. The Huber ball pendulum you have (primarily used with Huber clocks sold by Badische) is one of the worst designs made. My understanding is that for some time knowledge of Würth clocks all but disappeared. Terwilliger obviously could not identify them, but he did the best with the information available at the time. Würth made good quality clocks that, I believe, deserve preservation in as original condition as possible (parts not patina).

    Eric
     
  21. jeffm

    jeffm Registered User

    Mar 21, 2010
    7
    1
    3
    Clothing pattern maker
    Niwot, Colorado
    Country Flag:
    Hi Eric,
    Thank you for the info. Is there a way to determine when the clock was made? How many clocks were made? How many are still around? Any guess at it's value?
    Thanks, Jeff
     
  22. etmb61

    etmb61 Registered User
    NAWCC Member

    Oct 25, 2010
    2,204
    91
    48
    Retired Avionics Technician
    Mascoutah, IL
    Country Flag:
    Region Flag:
    Jeff,

    Based on the serial number your clock was made in 1910. Würth's entire production was around 24000 clocks and, as I recall, the company did not continue after sometime in 1911. As for how many still exist there's no real way to tell. In the 8 years I've been interested in 400 day clocks, I've recorded data on 152 clocks by Würth, mostly from a variety of online sources. That's a really small percentage. I figure since brass was a war material a lot of old brass clocks were probably made into shell casings.

    We don't discuss values in these forums. It's all subjective anyway. It's worth exactly what someone else is willing to pay for it. If you looked at the link I posted to my clock I think you can get the idea. I paid about $145 for it complete and original.

    Eric
     
  23. jeffm

    jeffm Registered User

    Mar 21, 2010
    7
    1
    3
    Clothing pattern maker
    Niwot, Colorado
    Country Flag:
    Eric, Thank you for the info!
     
  24. Kevin W.

    Kevin W. Registered User
    NAWCC Member

    Apr 11, 2002
    21,451
    173
    63
    I work at the Veritas Tools machine shop.
    Nepean, Ontario, Canada
    Country Flag:
    Region Flag:
    I found one for sale online, wow i was surprised how expensive these books are.
     
  25. JTD

    JTD Registered User

    Sep 27, 2005
    6,571
    327
    83
    Yes, there is a copy for sale in the UK at the moment, but costs USD 300.- !

    JTD
     
    Kevin W. likes this.

Share This Page