Help with Kienzle clock

Cespain

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Nov 14, 2019
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I recently was given a Kienzle Westminster chime clock and am puzzled about a few things which I hope someone can help with. There is a lever attached at the midpoint of the rack which can pivot at that point but whose purpose is unknown to me. There is also a small bracket with a vertical spike almost directly above the aforementioned lever whose function is also puzzling me. Finally, you will notice that there are two clicks on the chime mainspring ratchet which i presume is just for extra security?

Thanks for any help.
SC.

20210303_155743.jpg
 

roughbarked

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Firstly, if you watch the whole 4/4 sequence you will see why this is here without a need for a long explanation.
The two clicks are there for security but mainly because the chime train mainspring is so much stronger than both the others and a slip could easily take a finger apart.
 

roughbarked

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There's the rub.
It doesn't matter if the clock is going.
What you need to observe is the chime and strike action which is what relates to the mystery pivoting piece.
If the strike and chime are wound up then turn the hands in fifteen minute increments and watch the actions that ensue at each point.
 

Cespain

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The chime also doesn't run either so I guess I need to have a look at that too before resolving the puzzle of these parts.
 

roughbarked

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Sounds like a complete strip down but first up, let down the mainsprings, all three. Remove the barrels if the clock allows this.
You may play with the trains to watch what happens but if nothing was working with those big mainsprings then your fingers will find it difficult to push without removing at least the fly wheels..
Anyway, as I said, you really do need to see it in action to resolve your issues about why they bothered to spend money on making it.
 
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shutterbug

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The extra part is to slowly lower the rack so it doesn't bang against the snail. That pin on the chime timing cam interacts with it to lower it slowly during the hour chime. It's a good idea that other manufacturers chose not to incorporate in their movements.
The vertical spike is a mystery to me too, and I don't think it belongs.
 
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tracerjack

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I have a Kienzle with the same movement. Well built and worth restoring. I too wondered about the vertical pin. Other that preventing the long lever, which is pretty long on this one, from getting out of alignment, I’m not sure either what it is for.
 
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roughbarked

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The vertical pin is someone's halfway decent attempt to stop the lever coming away from the plate and missing the warning pin.
of course they could have looked at other ways to remedy the perceived problem but at least it doesn't detract from the clock much.
 

JimmyOz

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As it is in the photo, it looks like the strike has not finished and the chime is on set/warning?
In this situation the clock will not run as the chime has lifted the strike lever to set/warning, therefore the strike can't finish and the chime can't go.
Lift the rack and let the strike count lever drop to its finish position, put the minute hand on and slowly turn it to the next 15 minute, it may start before you get there as the chime is ready to go.
 

chimeclockfan

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The pin bracket serves no purpose besides preventing the levers from jumping out of line in transit. Look up tracerjack's old topic about these movements for further help.
 

Cespain

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Thanks for the help guys. I am not able to work on the movement at the moment but will eventually get around to repairing it as best I can. I have worked on some Westminster chime clocks before but the chime mechanism on this is a new design to me especially the auto correct feature.
 

SuffolkM

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DRP and DRGM are the Deutsches Patent-und Markenamt (German Patent and Trademarks) numbers. Deutsches Reichspatent and Deutsches Reichs Gebrauchs Musterschutz respectively.

DRP 283312 is dated 1915 (this relates to the pin locking the arbor inside the mainspring barrels - you'll soon find it comes out rather gladly, so be careful not to lose it on the floor!), then there's DRP 367338 dated 1923 which is for the 'silent rack' design, and DRGM 779005 is a device to 'regulate the beat of pendulum clocks' dated in the early 1920s.

43cm is the length of the pendulum and 104 is the beats per minute.

Michael
 

chimeclockfan

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D.R.P. 367338 does not refer to the older silent 'double rack' prominent on earlier Kienzle chime movements.
It instead refers to the silent rack drop and chime self-correction device infamous on these clocks. Look it up here:


Detailed archives of the Utility Patents (D.R.G.M.) do not exist beyond arbitrary descriptions.
 
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