Gilbert Regulator Minute Hand spins freely

Discussion in 'Clock Repair' started by Alligator97979, Aug 16, 2019.

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  1. Alligator97979

    Alligator97979 Registered User

    Dec 30, 2018
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    Hi. I have a Gilbert regulator in pretty good shape with a nice even beat (though it stops running after a few minutes). However, the minute hand droops to the 6, and seems to be off its track or something. No matter how many times I turn the minute hand, the hour hand doesn’t move. I looked at it but didn’t see anything obvious. What should I check for?

    BD019EF0-C6FF-4D5E-92AF-D96B0DCEFFD5.jpeg 15DEF55D-E2E3-49E4-9A83-68525C8749EA.jpeg CDA4268D-6C48-4C81-AEF0-E9C245BC37B2.jpeg
     
  2. R. Croswell

    R. Croswell Registered User

    Apr 4, 2006
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    Three things come to mind:

    * make sure the square hole in the minute hand is on the square at the end of the arbor and that it is not slipping on the arbor

    * The pinion at "1" in the picture may be cracked and slipping - very common in Gilberts and likely the problem here.

    * the collet at "2" in the picture may be loose on the arbor. It needs to be able to compress that tension spring (not possible in the cannon pinion is cracked)

    It is a simple movement to take apart and once apart the problem should be obvious.

    RC

    gilbert-pinion.jpg
     
  3. Alligator97979

    Alligator97979 Registered User

    Dec 30, 2018
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    Thank you. You are correct that there is a crack in the pinion at #1. Can this be repaired by a pro, or will it require a replacement from another clock?

    4640F262-A340-418C-9319-AD0D7CE61C35.jpeg
     
  4. R. Croswell

    R. Croswell Registered User

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    #4 R. Croswell, Aug 16, 2019
    Last edited: Aug 17, 2019
    You can buy a new replacement part here; Gilbert Brass Pinion There are ways to repair that broken pinion and if you search on this forum you will find several very heated discussions about how to accomplish that. I have repaired then by boring out the center of the pinion and soldering in a bushing that is a press fit on the arbor. The main considerations are; the crack must be closed to maintain tooth spacing, the pinion must be secure at the proper location on the arbor, and it must be tight enough that it will stay there.

    RC

    I never understand why they so often split like this down the center of the tooth instead of between two teeth.
     
  5. tracerjack

    tracerjack Registered User
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    Jun 6, 2016
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    Yes, they can be repaired. Use the search feature up in the top right for “cracked cannon pinion” and you will find several posts on how to fix these. I used the solder method and found it much easier to do than it sounded. The movement I repaired is still working just fine. And I’d never soldered anything before.
     
  6. Alligator97979

    Alligator97979 Registered User

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    Thank you so much. I was getting worried this was going to be difficult.
     
  7. tracerjack

    tracerjack Registered User
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    Mine cracked between the teeth, making it easy to close properly. If yours has cracked down the center of a tooth, I think it would be better to get a replacement as suggested by RC.
     
  8. shutterbug

    shutterbug Moderator
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    The replacement part will probably have to be broached a bit. They are sized too small, and forcing them on will result in another future crack. They need to be tight, but don't need to be so tight that you have to have a big hammer to force them on :)
     
  9. R. Croswell

    R. Croswell Registered User

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    Generally, opening the center hole a bit will relieve the stress and the crack should close pretty well. If a bushing is installed it should be a slip fit, and likewise if it is soldered to the shaft it should also be a slip fit to avoid forcing the crack open. If it's split down the tooth like this one and the crack isn't completely closed it is a simple matter to dress down the "fat tooth". There isn't any real load on this part so as long as it doesn't bind it will be OK. It only needs to be secure on the arbor.

    RC
     
  10. R&A

    R&A Registered User

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    I posted a post on how to repair this By drilling and pinning the cannon pinion Go check it out
     
  11. Alligator97979

    Alligator97979 Registered User

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    Thank you all for your help. I do have a new question about this. I haven’t ordered the pinion yet, as I am trying to gather a shopping list from several clocks. I opened up an Ingraham gingerbread clock I just acquired only to find a Gilbert stamped movement inside, which made me realize that the movement I already posted about above doesn’t have any markings identifying it as a Gilbert (only the case is marked as a Gilbert). Does anyone know if Gilbert used unmarked movements, or if I probably have a reproduction? And if I have a reproduction, is it probable that the replacement pinion won’t work? Thanks again in advance.
     
  12. R. Croswell

    R. Croswell Registered User

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    I have a Gilbert with what appears to be the same same movemen and that movement is signed "EN Welch Mfg. Co., Forrestville, Conn.", the assumption being that Gilbert may have purchased movements for these clocks from Welch. There is no indication that this is not the original movement. It is not uncommon to find movements that are not marked, perhaps when the clock maker purchased movements from another maker and did not want reveal the actual maker's name. Will the Timesavers replacement pinion fit this unmarked movement in your Gilbert clock? Not knowing if this is a gilbert or Welch made movement, I would say definitely maybe.

    I suspect that the Gilbert movement in your Ingraham gingerbread clock is probably a marriage. Look for any extra mounting holes or other signs of a movement transplant. Although clock makers sometimes did by movements from other sources, unless others report seeing Ingraham Gilbert "marriages", I wouldn't believe this is original.

    RC
     
  13. Alligator97979

    Alligator97979 Registered User

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    Thanks. I should clarify that the Gilbert clock has no extra screw holes and the movement looks like it was original to the clock. The Gilbert movement in the Ingraham gingerbread is definitely a transplant as there are extra screw holes. However, it is pretty amazing to me that a different brand movement has the same spacing between the winding arbors and center shaft.
     
  14. R. Croswell

    R. Croswell Registered User

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    Sometimes the clock face is married along with the movement. Ingrahams typically have the name on the outer edge of the dial, still not surprising that the dial fits.

    RC
     

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