Germany won’t run

Ibehooved

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Jun 9, 2021
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I have been working on a Germany plate 1159 for a while now. It won’t keep running. I have disassembled it, cleaned it , oiled it, added a new torsion spring, put it in beat, and moved the fork up and down. I have not pulled the mainspring and cleaned and lubed it. It runs smoothly with no main spring power, applying manual pressure to the gear train. It has about 450 degrees of rotation with the fork in the high position.

It will run for only about 5 minutes, as the rotation gradually decreases. I have two ideas. One is the mainspring is hanging and needs to be serviced. The second is that the torsion spring is too short, since the bottom of the pendulum is flush with the top of the cup in the base, but not inside it, as I am used to. This would allow 2 or 3 mm additional length for the torsion spring. Thoughts?
 

tracerjack

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Jun 6, 2016
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Sine these clocks are seriously underpowered, the mainspring needs to be serviced or at least the cap pulled and the spring inspected. Working on mine, I’ve had several filled with sticky, green old grease, most clean but dry as a bone, and only one that was clean with good lubrication (which I serviced anyway to be sure). Odds are yours needs service.
 

Wayne A

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Before doing anything else service the mainspring and pay attention to the arbor surfaces where the barrel runs since there often very roughly machined and in need of attention. You can loose allot of power if the mainspring and barrel are not taken care of.

Adjusting the length of the torsion spring a few mm is not going to make this clock run.

Wayne
 

Ken M

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Five minutes? That's not just "not running", something is stopping it. I'd check the fork tine spacing.
 

Kevin W.

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Ollie Baker winders are not easy to get one, if you order one from a supply store like Merrits, you will likely be put on a list of those waiting for them. I saw a few on Ebay but prices are ridicolas.
 

tracerjack

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I guess it depends on perspective. $250-275 is a lot, but I still consider it the best thing I ever bought for working on my clock movements.
 
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Kevin W.

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Tracer the prices were actually 500 and over, usd, i dont call that reasonable, i have one and did not pay retail, as it was purchaed through a friend.
 

Ibehooved

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Tracer the prices were actually 500 and over, usd, i dont call that reasonable, i have one and did not pay retail, as it was purchaed through a friend.
I already have an Ollie Baker spring winder. I have had it for years and had no idea what has happened to the prices! I don't remember paying more than $100 for it, but my memory is not what it once was. I am glad I have it!
So I removed the mainspring, cleaned it (it wasn't bad) and greased it with some Mobius 8300. In the process of reassembling, I bent the pinion on the verge. When I tried to straighten it, of course is snapped off Is there a source for replacements other than buying a parts clock off of e-bay?
 

KurtinSA

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This particular clock was made by a former worker of the Schatz company. There is a strong chance then that any Schatz Type 49 clock will have replacement parts. You could check with Timesavers.

Kurt
 

Ibehooved

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This particular clock was made by a former worker of the Schatz company. There is a strong chance then that any Schatz Type 49 clock will have replacement parts. You could check with Timesavers.

Kurt
Thanks Kurt. I must be living right. I purchased a Schatz 49 that will be delivered early next week. I'll see if the anchor matches up.
 

tracerjack

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Tracer the prices were actually 500 and over, usd, i dont call that reasonable, i have one and did not pay retail, as it was purchaed through a friend.
Oh, I have an Ollie Baker "style" which I see listed in Timesavers for $250. I never looked at a true Ollie Baker, so had no idea those prices were so high. My Ollie Baker "style" works great, and I thought the price of $250 reasonable.
 

Kevin W.

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Tracer, ebay is greed, 800 dollars, is pure greed.250 is reasonable.
 

tracerjack

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No, I would never pay 800. I think I'd pull the mainspring by hand, accepting the risk, than pay that.
 

Wayne A

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You can always build a spring winder that's what I did. Theres PLANS on the board for it, I changed the design up a little and only use twisted wire and not hooks to hold the spring ends because hooks might slip.

Wayne

20201226_133320.jpg
 

KurtinSA

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I, too, build my own winder based upon the same plans. On my first use of it, the rivet tore out of my spring barrel. Not knowing which one was at fault, I put my winder on the bench and order the Ollie Baker.

What I didn't like about mine, and to some degree yours Wayne, is how the barrel is grabbed. In my case there was too much of a chance that teeth were going to be bent/broken on the barrel. With the Ollie Baker, one holds the barrel with a gloved hand and the chance for damage is greatly reduced.

I agree that $800 is a tough thing to bite on...I think I got my Ollie Baker for less than $300. But the right tool for the job...I've used the heck out of mine and gives me more confidence when I have to refurb a main spring and barrel.

Kurt
 

Wayne A

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What I didn't like about mine, and to some degree yours Wayne, is how the barrel is grabbed. In my case there was too much of a chance that teeth were going to be bent/broken on the barrel. With the Ollie Baker, one holds the barrel with a gloved hand and the chance for damage is greatly reduced.
Yea I wrap the barrel's with folded paper towel's to prevent any possibility of damage, never had any. Does not take allot or pressure to prevent the barrel's from rotating in the clamp giving me two hands to mind the spring. I used a large brass ground clamp instead of the wood wedge of the original design because I thought the wood might be prone to cracking. Also use a chunk of wood in the clamp with several arbor sizes drilled in it for support of arbors outside of the barrel, attached a pic of using it for an open spring. Anyway I've had no problems with what I have.

Wayne

20210108_095954.jpg
 

KurtinSA

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Sounds like you thought things through. I spent a lot of time buying materials and then cutting/assembling the winder. Hindsight is that it was not worth my time and effort, not to mention it wasn't a good product. My work is primarily 400-day clocks, so don't know if the Ollie is limited in some fashion for other clocks...doesn't matter, I'm not looking to drift that direction.

Kurt
 

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