Geo Carley & Co pocket watch

Discussion in 'European & Other Pocket Watches' started by goldenstar, Aug 8, 2017.

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  1. goldenstar

    goldenstar Registered User

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    #1 goldenstar, Aug 8, 2017
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 9, 2017
    Thanks Graham, I had not realized that manufacturing a watch involved so many people, very interesting! My daughter will be visiting us one of these days bringing another gold watch that belonged to my great-grandfather which I believe is quite a bit older that the one belonging to my grandfather. Here are some photos.

    Keith
     
  2. gmorse

    gmorse Registered User
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    #2 gmorse, Aug 8, 2017
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 9, 2017
    Re: Geo Carley & Co gold pocket watch

    Hi Keith,

    This 18 carat gold case was made by John Woodman at 33 Smith Street, Northampton Square, London, (who registered this mark on 7th November 1876), and assayed in 1882/3.

    The movement is a good quality 1/2 plate, typical of the period. Although it looks very similar to your Goddard, that's a 3/4 plate; the difference is because the 4th wheel in that is pivoted in the top plate whereas it has a separate cock in this watch.

    It would cause less confusion if the Moderators could split this watch off into a separate thread, which I've asked them to do.

    Regards,

    Graham
     
  3. goldenstar

    goldenstar Registered User

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    #3 goldenstar, Aug 8, 2017
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 9, 2017
    Re: Geo Carley & Co gold pocket watch

    Thank you very much for your review of this watch Graham. My daughter has tried to find more information without much success so this will be most helpful to her. I am sorry, should have made a new thread but am new to this website.
    Regards
    Keith
     
  4. goldenstar

    goldenstar Registered User

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    #4 goldenstar, Aug 9, 2017
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 9, 2017
    Re: Geo Carley & Co gold pocket watch

    My daughter has just replied to the thread about my great-grandfather's watch, I have pasted it below. Thank you for your help Graham.

    That is really interesting information Dad. Just a thought on Joseph’s watch – the maker is Geo. Carley & Co (not Carter) of 30 Ely Place London. Would be interesting if we could find out a bit more about him. What I do know so far is the following: George Carley moved from Wilderness Row to Ely Place, and after 1857 the firm became known as George Carley & Co., and it continued there after his death in 1879 until 1881. The business became Carley & Clemence Ltd. in 1903.

    So the 1882 case mark fits in with the time frame on Joseph’s watch. Have attached an add for Carley and Co.

    Glad you found out some info on Henry’s watch. I had the maker down to two – Fred Thoms or Frederick Trahern. At least we now know it is Thoms.
     
  5. MartyR

    MartyR Super Moderator
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    Re: Geo Carley & Co gold pocket watch

    I have found the following Post Office (trade) Directory entries for Geo Carley & Co:

    1841 trading as Watchmaker at 3 Singleton Stree, N Hoxton, London
    1856 trading as Wholesale Watchmaker and Clock Maker at 30 Ely Place, Holborn Hill, London
    1882 trading as Wholesale Watchmaker and Importer at 30 Ely Place, Holborn, EC London

    I have also found a reference to George Carley (b1805-d1879) in Tony Mercer's Chronometer Makers of the world. In 1935 George Carley formed a company, Carley & Clemence Ltd, in partnership with J A Clemence (b1843-d1915) who had founded Clemence Freres (watchmakers) and became chairman of Carley & Clemence. There is some confusion about the address(es) from which the firm operated, but 30 Ely Place is included with others.

    Mercer says that the firm made Torubillon chronometer watches using Kullberg and Garner movements, two of the finest watchmakers in England in the 19th century, and this would place Carley & Clemence in the highest ranks of watchmakers. The firm also made deck watches for the Admiralty. The trademark of Carley & Clemence was a goat's head, and that of Clemence Freres "Ccc Frs" in an oval.

    I note that this information is partly at odds with your daughter's information above ... so for now both should be treated with a little caution.
     
  6. goldenstar

    goldenstar Registered User

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    Re: Geo Carley & Co gold pocket watch

    Thanks Marty
    I have had another look at the photo sent by my daughter and agree with you, the inscription looks like Geo Carley and the address matches the ones you have provided. My daughter will be bringing the watch to Canada when she visits, I am keen on getting a closer look at it. My daughter says that the gold watch she has is not that valuable as it was probably one produced for the mass market, not the quality of deck watches.
    Regards
    Keith
     
  7. MartyR

    MartyR Super Moderator
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    Re: Geo Carley & Co gold pocket watch

    The watch is in an 18 carat case, Keith. In general, that bespeaks a good quality watch. The fact that Carley were known to make torubillons, and that they bought Kullberg and Gardner movements, tells me that they were a high quality maker.

    Even the best of makers sometimes made, or just sold, lesser watgches ... but tell your daughter not to rush to judgement on this one :)
     
  8. gmorse

    gmorse Registered User
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    Re: Geo Carley & Co gold pocket watch

    Hi Keith,

    I agree with Martin, watches of this quality were never regarded as a 'mass market' product, and would only have been accessible to those with substantial disposable income. They would have cost many times more than the run of the mill pieces carried by the average customer, who themselves would not have been poor by any standards.

    Regards,

    Graham
     
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