French Movement Japy Freres missing parts.

[legosnell]

Is it even worth fooling with since it's missing parts which are probably not going to be easy to find for a clock that dates back to maybe 1885? Posting pictures. Can you please tell me what it's missing? I think maybe pendulum hanger or leader, looks like the suspension spring is there. Pendulum bob. Are there options for repair using a generic suspension spring and rod cut to the right length with a generic bob? It looks complete except for the missing parts and has a nice green onyx case. The hammer and rod have seen better days and some sort of repair has been done. The other issue is one barrel spring is wound up but when trying to wind the other barrel spring the whole barrel rotates instead of just the internal spring.

 

[Willie X]

"The whole barrel rotates", that will be serious. Most likely a damaged or missing second wheel?

You could send it out for repair, if you like it a lot ?? Willie X

 

[legosnell]

"The whole barrel rotates", that will be serious. Most likely a damaged or missing second wheel?

You could send it out for repair, if you like it a lot ?? Willie X

Thanks Willie it's not worth much and I didn't pay much. It looks like the broken barrel is on the striking side which already has issues with the hammer. I may go ahead and try to get it to run without the striking side working.

 

[JTD]

Are there options for repair using a generic suspension spring and rod cut to the right length with a generic bob?

Yes, no problem.

JTD

 

[bwclock]

Thanks Willie it's not worth much and I didn't pay much. It looks like the broken barrel is on the striking side which already has issues with the hammer. I may go ahead and try to get it to run without the striking side working.

One of your photos shows the strike barrel cap has come loose. This does not mean it is "broken". The strike hammer bonus soldering can be cleaned up easily. The hammer arm on these French movements was pressed into the collet and one frequently sees them with some solder to keep the hammer arm from rotating.

I do not know if it is an optical illusion but it appears that the time second wheel had become detached from its arbor where it was pressed onto the pinion. See attached photo.

The pendulum is a non issue as Timesavers has repro ones which are easy to modify to fit. Attached is a photo of a replacement French pendulum to the right of the original one to give you a feel of what to look for.

I guess it boils down to if you are comfortable disassembling the movement and trying to fix it.

Bruce

 

[legosnell]

Yes, no problem.

JTD

Appreciate it. I'll browse around at the Timesavers website or search their catalog I have and see what I can find on a pendulum hanger rod and pendulum. I think it will run with a little bit of tender loving care. It's running now without the pendulum if you position it just right.

 

[shutterbug]

If you post the barrel size and tooth count, you might get a hit on Ebay or elsewhere. Be sure you really need it first, and be prepared to wait for the right movement.

 

[Jaap]

Hi Bruce, I think what you see is the reflection of rhe pinon on the spoke of the second wheel.

 

[legosnell]

One of your photos shows the strike barrel cap has come loose. This does not mean it is "broken". The strike hammer bonus soldering can be cleaned up easily. The hammer arm on these French movements was pressed into the collet and one frequently sees them with some solder to keep the hammer arm from rotating.

I do not know if it is an optical illusion but it appears that the time second wheel had become detached from its arbor where it was pressed onto the pinion. See attached photo.

The pendulum is a non issue as Timesavers has repro ones which are easy to modify to fit. Attached is a photo of a replacement French pendulum to the right of the original one to give you a feel of what to look for.

I guess it boils down to if you are comfortable disassembling the movement and trying to fix it.

Bruce

View attachment 717139 View attachment 717140

Thanks Bruce for the good information and an idea of what I need to look for on the pendulum and rod. It's running now without a pendulum. I guess I need to make sure the hands are rotating as they should be, especially since you think there may be an issue with the second wheel timing train. The barrel spring is wound up good and tight on the timing train going train. I'll check that out. But no, disassembly of this one is beyond my comfort zone. I'll clean it up best I can, oil what I can reach and replace the pendulum and rod and go with it, leaving the strike train alone for now. I like the Green Onyx marble case.

 

[bwclock]

Hi Bruce, I think what you see is the reflection of rhe pinon on the spoke of the second wheel.

HI Jaap, Thanks. that makes sense. I still can't see it. Sometime the brain plays tricks. But I I take it on faith as you can see it correctly and Legosnell says the time side is running.
Bruce

 

[legosnell]

A video I did showing the striking barrel rotating when attempting to windup the spring. The whole barrel rotates instead of just the internal spring. Video details - YouTube Studio

Now that think about it and watched this video a few times, the barrel should rotate while winding up the spring. I guess I better check one of my other clocks to be sure, this is confusing me. Wille says barrel should never rotate when winding so I've got something else going on with the chiming train.

 

[Willie X]

The barrel should never rotate when winding.

Winding rotates the arbor only. The arbor winds the spring which places tension against the stationary barrel.

The barrel does eventually rotate but very very slowly, on this clock about 1/2 revolution per day.

Willie X

 

[legosnell]

The barrel should never rotate when winding.

Winding rotates the arbor only. The arbor winds the spring which places tension against the stationary barrel.

The barrel does eventually rotate but very very slowly, on this clock about 1/2 revolution per day.

Willie X

Thanks again Willie, you told me that once already, so I don't know why I'm still confused about this issue. I've never had one do this, but this is the first French movement I've ever worked on.

 

[tracerjack]

Appreciate it. I'll browse around at the Timesavers website or search their catalog I have and see what I can find on a pendulum hanger rod and pendulum. I think it will run with a little bit of tender loving care. It's running now without the pendulum if you position it just right.

The pendulum shown in post #5 doesn’t use a leader. It hangs directly on the suspension spring. The rod on the pendulum fits into the crutch foot.

 

[Dells]

Hi legosnell
I have a barrel and a second wheel but the trouble is I am in UK but if you are stuck I could send it to you.
Dell

 

[shutterbug]

When the barrel rotates, how many other wheels also rotate? That info might help narrow down the problem.

 

[legosnell]

When the barrel rotates, how many other wheels also rotate? That info might help narrow down the problem.

When the barrel rotates the center pinion of the second wheel rotates but the second wheel itself does not rotate

 

[shutterbug]

That tells a lot! Your second wheel has come loose and will need to be removed and staked tight to the arbor again. It should be a very tight fit, and should not be able to move as yours is. If the arbor itself is not spinning, then the pinion wheel has come loose. Post a pic when you get it out. Look closely for a crack in the pinion.

 

[legosnell]

I'm thinking about buying this one for this french clock project and for the future.

Repairing French Pendulum Clocks by Steven Conover

 

[shutterbug]

Yes, Conover's books are always enlightening.