French clock

[Wazza]

This French clock won't stop chiming unless I move the minute hand around a bit

 

[Mike Phelan]

It looks quite dirty so that might be the problem. Does it strike on the hour and half hour, or just a few minutes before?

BTW, it doesn't chime, but strikes

 

[shutterbug]

You might also have a broken stop pin, or one that's not adjusted well. Moving the hands just puts the strike train in warning, temporarily holding the train.

 

[Wazza]

It starts the strike a few minutes before the hour and half hour, it stops after I move the minute hand about 10 minutes

 

[shutterbug]

OK, that might indicate that your warning stop pin is broken off. It would normally hold the strike in the ready mode, and only allow it to start striking at the correct time. It would normally go into warning about 5 minutes before the strike time, as you describe.
The same pin probably also serves as the strike stop pin, which would explain the run on strike issue too. Look at your upper strike wheels to see if you can see evidence of a pin broken off.

 

[Mike Phelan]

These French roulants with count wheels usually have the warning pin on the wheel below the fly, and the wheel below it has the stop pin.
Seems as if the warning pin is broken or fallen off. Unusual.

 

[Wazza]

Are these the pins you are talking about

 

[Mike Phelan]

Yes, and they are both present and correct. I note that the detent is against the warning pin (wheel next to the fly) so at this point the clock should be near the hour or half hour - say xx.25 or xx.55. Is that so?

 

[shutterbug]

Yeah, it looks like it's in warning now, and the strike can't run until the pin is released. The pic doesn't match what you are describing. Is it possible to post a video of what's happening on Youtube and link to it here?

 

[Wazza]

Yes, and they are both present and correct. I note that the detent is against the warning pin (wheel next to the fly) so at this point the clock should be near the hour or half hour - say xx.25 or xx.55. Is that so?

it seems to be on the hour, also the are near the minute and hour shaft seems to be too low, it takes too long for the minute wheel to go around to release the shaft so it will stop

 

[Mike Phelan]

Interesting. Looking at your pic, the warning lever seems to have been soldered and is much too low. What you are saying is that the cannon pinion ('minute wheel')
pins cannot engage the pins on the latter so it's permanently in warning and the lever cannot drop.

 

[Wazza]

The lever drops ok but only after the minute hand has moved about ten minutes

 

[JimmyOz]

I am not sure I understand all this, however put the minute cannon back on, turn it with the minute hand till it goes into warning, how close is this to the hour? should be about 8 minutes before. Now turn it till the minute hand is at the hour, the lever should drop. Look at the count wheel on the back, if it is setup correctly the lever should drop into the cutout and stop the strike, if not it will just keep going. Check this and get back to us.

 

[Wazza]

I am not sure I understand all this, however put the minute cannon back on, turn it with the minute hand till it goes into warning, how close is this to the hour? should be about 8 minutes before. Now turn it till the minute hand is at the hour, the lever should drop. Look at the count wheel on the back, if it is setup correctly the lever should drop into the cutout and stop the strike, if not it will just keep going. Check this and get back to us.

That lever that is closest to the minute cog seems to be too high, after the pin on the back of the minute cog lifts the shaft up it can't fall down until the minute cog has moved for about 10 minutes then it has passed the pin and the lever can fall down and stop the strike

 

[Mike Phelan]

Cogs are for old mangles - we have wheels here!

That lever that is closest to the minute cog seems to be too high

Is that because someone had previously soldered the warning lever?

after the pin on the back of the minute cog lifts the shaft (warning lever?) up it can't fall down until the minute cog has moved for about 10 minutes then it has passed the pin (that's as it should be) and the lever can fall down and stop the strike

At that point, it should start striking, not stop. However, in a previous post you say it keeps striking continually . I think we really need to see a picture of you turning the hands slowly.

 

[Wazza]

Cogs are for old mangles - we have wheels here!

Is that because someone had previously soldered the warning lever?

At that point, it should start striking, not stop. However, in a previous post you say it keeps striking continually . I think we really need to see a picture of you turning the hands slowly.

When the minute hand pushes the shaft up it takes too

Cogs are for old mangles - we have wheels here!

Is that because someone had previously soldered the warning lever?

At that point, it should start striking, not stop. However, in a previous post you say it keeps striking continually . I think we really need to see a picture of you turning the hands slowly.

When the minute hand pushes the shaft up and releases the strike, the minute hand has to travel too far around to drop the shaft

 

[shutterbug]

The video helps. It's going into warning just fine, but the strike train doesn't run. Probably some wear that needs to be addressed.

 

[Mike Phelan]

All gummed up, maybe?

 

[Wazza]

The video helps. It's going into warning just fine, but the strike train doesn't run. Probably some wear that needs to be addressed.

I turned the minute hand too quick, the strike runs ok. The shaft that the minute hand lifts up ok, but the minute hand has to move around too far to let it drop and stop the strike, it seems that that shaft that lifts is too low but there doesn't seem any way to lift it up

 

[Wazza]

I just saw some photos of the front of some French mechanism and the arm on them was level with the minute hand shaft, mine is hanging below it.So it might have been soldered and not lined up properly. Can you tell me the name of this lever and where I can buy one please.

 

[JimmyOz]

Looking at the video, it goes into warning and it also drops close to the hour (stop the video at 0.05) and the hammer falls as it should, I can see the pin on the minute cannon is spot on and the lever has dropped. Although it looks like the half hour strike is what you are showing? This is telling me that the lever is fine. In post #13 I asked you to check the count wheel lever to see if it is working and stopping when it drops into the cutouts on the wheel, did you do that?

 

[Wazza]

Looking at the video, it goes into warning and it also drops close to the hour (stop the video at 0.05) and the hammer falls as it should, I can see the pin on the minute cannon is spot on and the lever has dropped. Although it looks like the half hour strike is what you are showing? This is telling me that the lever is fine. In post #13 I asked you to check the count wheel lever to see if it is working and stopping when it drops into the cutouts on the wheel, did you do that?

That is all fine, that lever near the main shaft is down too low and the minute hand has to take too long to release it, if that lever was higher it would work ok.

 

[JimmyOz]

That is all fine, that lever near the main shaft is down too low and the minute hand has to take too long to release it, if that lever was higher it would work ok.

This is not what I am seeing, it goes into warning at the right time and releses at the right time, the lever is fine. Maybe take a video when it is to strike the hour as the other pin on the minute shaft has been moved? Where in Australia are you?

 

[Wazza]

This is not what I am seeing, it goes into warning at the right time and releses at the right time, the lever is fine. Maybe take a video when it is to strike the hour as the other pin on the minute shaft has been moved? Where in Australia are you?

Bingara nsw

 

[Mike Phelan]

I'm still seeing that the warning lever has been soldered for some odd reason (never known one to break) therefore is too low hence it's not striking at the correct time.
You won't be able to buy a new one. These clocks are from the 1800's!
I'd suggest unsoldering it to see why that's been done and possibly making a new one - you only need files, a saw and a sheet of brass; the collet can be re-used.

 

[Wazza]

Here is a photo on the internet, and one of mine, you will see the internet one is facing at the shaft, and mine is below the shaft, therefore the strike cannot stop until the minute hand has gone around about 10 minutes extra

 

[Wazza]

I will do that and see what happens

 

[Wazza]

That fixed it. Thank you all.

 

[Mike Phelan]

Interesting, but what did you do and what fixed it?

 

[Wazza]

I pulled that part off, was about to saw it and thought I wonder if it will bend, I was surprised that the brass bent easily, matched it to the same as the one in the photo and it works fine

 

[Mike Phelan]

Sound good, then. Not sure why you'd want to saw it, but there are more things in heaven and earth, Wazza, than are dreamt of in our philosophy.

Good to see another French roulant working and striking.