English Tallcase Count Lever Jams Count Wheel

Discussion in 'Clock Repair' started by gordon, Jun 2, 2009.

  1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.
  1. gordon

    gordon Registered User
    NAWCC Member

    Mar 7, 2007
    223
    0
    16
    Retired from GM engineering labs.
    Canton, Michigan 48187
    Country Flag:
    Hello All


    Some times the count lever will jam on the count wheel of this English Continuous Rope Movement .
    Once the warning pin is released the count lever drops back in to the count wheel’s slot. Usually the count wheel pushes the count lever up, just before the stop pin sees the stop lever, and the lever rides along the count wheel's edge until it drops back in to its next slot.


    At 9,10 and 11 the count lever drops back down and the count lever jams against the other side of the count wheel slot.


    There is no matinence cam in this movement.


    The stop pin is on the second wheel and the warning pin is on the third wheel. The warning pin is 180 degrees away from the warning lever which is attached to the strike release levers which is picked up by the strike release pins on the hour wheel.



    Should I cut down the corners on the 9, 10 and 11 slots? Or is there some thing else I shoud do to prevent or by pass the jaming?


    The count wheel runs ccw in the pho to.



    Gordon Webb
     

    Attached Files:

  2. LaBounty

    LaBounty Registered User
    NAWCC Life Member

    Aug 29, 2002
    3,438
    24
    38
    Clockmaker
    Mitchell, NE
    Country Flag:
    Region Flag:
    Hey Gordon-

    The count wheel actually acts as the maintenance cam and keeps the levers raised as long as the count lever (count hook) is riding on the edge. I believe your count lever is bent slightly too far to the left, as you look at the back.

    Don't file anything but, instead, bend the count lever so it can't drop back into the slot following the warning release. A lot of these were originally hand filed and poorly indexed so you will need to adjust the lever for the best average position all the way around. You'll need to check for stop and strike at each hour since bending the lever too far could cause it to stop early with the hammer partially lifted.

    You can also increase the warning slightly, adjusting it so it is 270 deg. instead of 180 deg. Be sure this adjustment doesn't allow the hammer to be lifted during warning. Increasing the warning will allow the count wheel to rotate just a bit more.

    If you can't adjust for reliable stop and strike without the hammer being lifted, you may have wear on the hammer detent causing the hammer to travel more than one hammer-head width. This will result in the hammer tail dwelling too deeply in the pins and the point between hammer release and hammer lift will be too short to allow for proper adjustments.

    Good luck with it!
     
  3. gordon

    gordon Registered User
    NAWCC Member

    Mar 7, 2007
    223
    0
    16
    Retired from GM engineering labs.
    Canton, Michigan 48187
    Country Flag:
    Mr David La Bounty

    Thank you for your reply. I am grateful to benifit from your experience.


    The Hammer lift lever is deep in the pin wheel. The hammer moves 2 or 3 hammer head widths during lift. The deten can be seen in the recent photo. The detent is the steel bar running parallel to the rear plate below the hammer tail on the right in the photo. The detent can be pushed deeper in to the movement resulting in the hammer lift lever being rased up further out of the pin wheel. I wll see what this does for the count lever fit to the count wheel.

    Gordon Webb
     

    Attached Files:

  4. shutterbug

    shutterbug Moderator
    NAWCC Member

    Oct 19, 2005
    40,680
    707
    113
    Male
    Self employed interpreter/clock repairer
    Iowa
    Country Flag:
    Region Flag:
    It looks like the count hook is hooked. It really looks like what David was saying, and it looks like the hook needs to be reshaped so it's straight again.
     
  5. Mike Phelan

    Mike Phelan Registered User

    Dec 17, 2003
    9,835
    12
    38
    Retired
    West Yorkshire, England
    Country Flag:
    Region Flag:
    Gordon
    As others say, don't file anything! Parts do not grow.
    It looks like the curved part on the count wheel detent has been bent - the short end should be radial to the centre of the count wheel.

    To reinforce what David says, you might find that the end of the hammer tail is worn; they do wear because of the strong spring.

    You will need to time everything afterwards, and to bear in mind that in an 18th C clock, the notches might not be that precise, so test all the way round.

    Unusual in which it uses a lock pin instead of a hoop, so make sure the pin misses its detent when the other detent is riding on the count wheel, and that this detent with its curved edge rises cleanly out of the notch on the CW. That function is usually carried out by the edge of the hoop, not present here.

    What is all that at the centre of the count wheel?
     
  6. laprade

    laprade Banned

    Sep 10, 2008
    3,240
    2
    0
    writer, radio producer, old building-materials adv
    Irish, but live in Laprade, 16390, France, (70 mil
    Country Flag:
    Bending those steel levers is a last resort, as they can snap. Very often they are made from cast pieces and not "wrought".

    One thing you could check. Locking plates (count wheels) on those 30hrs usually have another pinion behind them and it could be one "tooth" out of sync. Don't under any circumstances interfere with the lengths of the count sections.

    When a count lever drops into a rebate, it should rest just next to leading edge of the rebate. If the plate continues moving till the lever jams against the other end, then it is a timing problem.
     
  7. Mike Phelan

    Mike Phelan Registered User

    Dec 17, 2003
    9,835
    12
    38
    Retired
    West Yorkshire, England
    Country Flag:
    Region Flag:
    Looking at the picture, though, it certainly looks bent! I've never seen a cast one, but that does not mean they don't exist.

    I agree with what you are saying about the pinion as these are usually 8 leaves, and the great wheel has 13 pins, therefore the count wheel needs to have a tooth count of 78/13*8 = 48.

    So, you can change the slot spacing by 48/78ths!
     
  8. laprade

    laprade Banned

    Sep 10, 2008
    3,240
    2
    0
    writer, radio producer, old building-materials adv
    Irish, but live in Laprade, 16390, France, (70 mil
    Country Flag:
    Mike,

    the lever parts are mostly cut from cast steel as opposed to wrought steel, which is layered. I have seen clock levers which have snapped and the cast metal can be clearly seen. wrought iron and steel can be easilly bent, in fact, too easilly.
     
  9. Mike Phelan

    Mike Phelan Registered User

    Dec 17, 2003
    9,835
    12
    38
    Retired
    West Yorkshire, England
    Country Flag:
    Region Flag:
    Fair enough, it's just that I've not seen one like that, and it sure looks like this one has been bent.
     
  10. gordon

    gordon Registered User
    NAWCC Member

    Mar 7, 2007
    223
    0
    16
    Retired from GM engineering labs.
    Canton, Michigan 48187
    Country Flag:
    Hello All

    Changing the depth of the hammer's tail in the pinwheel gave me a lot of lead way in setting the stop pin and warning pin. Still the count lever would be at the leading edge of the CW slot for 1-8 towards the trailing edge for 9 & 10 and towards the middel for 11 & 12 hours. Even if I let the warning pin go until the hammer would be on the rise some hours the count lever would drop in th the CW slot.

    The count wheel does not advance enought to over come the variation in the CW train for each hour.

    Also the CW slots are chanfered on the trailing edge. Some of the slots have a wider chanfer then others.

    Straightening the count lever created a situation where the next hour would only strike once with the count lever dropping back in to the slot it had just left.

    Mike what is a "Hoop"?

    Looking closely at the count wheel I found the 3 slots that the count lever would jam in, were 0.75 mm to 1.00 mm deeper then the others 9 slots. I put the curve back in the count lever. Then I added a temporary spacer to the 3 deep slots. The count wheel would then advance for all 12 hours.

    Oddly, once the warning pin is released the count lever drops back in to the count wheel’s slot. The count wheel pushes the count lever back up, just before the stop pin sees the stop lever, and the count lever rides along the count wheel's edge until it drops back in to its next slot.

    I am wondering if that is the purpose of the curve in the count lever and chanfer on the CW slot?

    Gordon
     
  11. Mike Phelan

    Mike Phelan Registered User

    Dec 17, 2003
    9,835
    12
    38
    Retired
    West Yorkshire, England
    Country Flag:
    Region Flag:
    I'll try to answer these, Gordon.

     

    Attached Files:

  12. laprade

    laprade Banned

    Sep 10, 2008
    3,240
    2
    0
    writer, radio producer, old building-materials adv
    Irish, but live in Laprade, 16390, France, (70 mil
    Country Flag:
    Lads,

    Is it possible that the count lever is a replacement and left not quite right!

    (That sounds too odd!)

    meaning, whoever may have changed it, didn't bother to rectify the problem.
     
  13. gordon

    gordon Registered User
    NAWCC Member

    Mar 7, 2007
    223
    0
    16
    Retired from GM engineering labs.
    Canton, Michigan 48187
    Country Flag:
    Hello Mike

    Thank you for the photo of the Hoop. I wish my movement had a hoop.

    The count wheel is mounted with a previous repaires creative effort. Do you have a photo of a count wheel, its tention spring, and the tention spring's retainer?

    I have heard the brass leaf spring can be made by hammering on a brass strip. This would be the first time for making a brass spring. Any sugestions would be appreciated.

    The hammer tail looked fine it was just the depth into the pins that I changed.

    The diffrence the warning wheel pin placement was not enought to compensated for the irregular slot placement on the CW.

    With a straite Count lever the advancement during warrning would not move the CW far enough to clear the count lever at the next hour.

    The bent count lever hits the chanfer on the count wheel. If the CW slot is a littel deeper the 2 parts hit on respective flat spots. Resulting in the count lever not being lifted and the train jamming.

    The slope or chanfer is on the CW slot's trailing edge. The count lever enters the slot from the leading edge and leaves over the chanfered trailing edge.

    Gordon
     
  14. Mike Phelan

    Mike Phelan Registered User

    Dec 17, 2003
    9,835
    12
    38
    Retired
    West Yorkshire, England
    Country Flag:
    Region Flag:
    Hi Gordon
    Here we are, and comments below, but I think we have all been barking up the wrong tree, except maybe laprade's comments. I'll answer your post first, then propose a theory!

    Right - I like mysteries, and four things are bugging me with this clock!
    1. The strange contraption on the centre of the CW.
    2. The fact that there is no separate warning lever, and that appears to be original.
    3. The fact that it is so critical to make it work (because of (2)).
    4. The CW lever is definitely bent!
    Is the clock from or near Lancashire, and is there any evidence that the post for the CW has been moved (either a hole or a brass plug above the location it's at now)?

    If these are true, I have a theory!
    Originally, the CW would have been larger, and had 72 or 78 teeth - I think yours has 48. Its pinion would have had 8 or 9 leaves. Instead of 12 notches there will be 13 pins - a typical Lancashire idea.
    Therefore, the post would have to be moved nearer to the great wheel arbor.
    That could confirm (2) and (4) above and the sloping CW detent.

    They work like this - we'll start with the clock actually striking:
    • The stop pin will pass below the detent during the striking.
    • At the end of the strike, the CW pin will raise its sloping detent, arresting the stop pin as soon as the last hammer blow. The CW pin will be nearly at the end of the detent.
    • Warning. Lever is raised into path of warning pin, further raising frees the stop pin from its detent, and warning run occurs (1/2 turn).
    • On the hour, the lever drops, freeing the warning pin.
    • Before the stop pin comes round again, the lever drops off the CW pin, down and out of the path of the stop pin.
    The fundamental difference with this arrangement is the fact that the stop pin detent operates on both sides of the pin.

    Does that make sense? If that's the case, the only hope s to put it back how it was. Possible.
     
  15. Mike Phelan

    Mike Phelan Registered User

    Dec 17, 2003
    9,835
    12
    38
    Retired
    West Yorkshire, England
    Country Flag:
    Region Flag:
    Oops - here's the piccy!
     

    Attached Files:

  16. gordon

    gordon Registered User
    NAWCC Member

    Mar 7, 2007
    223
    0
    16
    Retired from GM engineering labs.
    Canton, Michigan 48187
    Country Flag:
    Hello Mike

    Let me try to give mor information to help with the mystrys.


    1) I think you are refering to the steel washer and tappered pin at the center of the CW. That is how the CW was held on the the its post that attached to the rear plate.

    I made a brass tention washer to replace that mess.

    2) There is a warning lever on the front plate. That W.L. goes through a cut out on the front plated, it raises a lever that picks up the count lever, at the same time it raises the stop lever releasing the stop pin on S# 2 and, seconds later the warning pin on S#3 is stopped by that WL. The clock stays in warrning until the warning lever is released.

    The warning lever has solder on it. I think that can be seen in the front plate photo.

    3) No maitiance cam or hoop does makes a few things critical.

    4) The count lever is bent to fit the slots and in sure it will move up ofver the CW slot in order to continue its strike.

    Additional info the count wheel has 54 teeth the pinion that drives the count wheel has 12 leaves. Their are no other holes on the rear plate to indicated the CW was changed.
    The count wheel and count lever appear to be origional to the movement. Ware marks on the back plate indicate the count wheel has been there a long time.

    Gordon
     
  17. Mike Phelan

    Mike Phelan Registered User

    Dec 17, 2003
    9,835
    12
    38
    Retired
    West Yorkshire, England
    Country Flag:
    Region Flag:
    Right, Gordon, that proves that the CW arrangement is original, so discounts my theory.
    I must have missed the fact that there is a separate warning lever. :(

    With a stop pin, the critical bit is the slope on the count wheel interacting with its lever.

    The inside detent needs to just miss the stop pin when the outer part is riding on the CW.
    Because of this, the timing needs to be set so the warning run is more than half a turn - nearly a full turn, so when it starts on the hour, the CW will have turned far enough to raise its detent and miss the stop pin.
    The real problem is probably the fact that the CW notches have been filed - not so much the depth, but the facing edges.
     
  18. gordon

    gordon Registered User
    NAWCC Member

    Mar 7, 2007
    223
    0
    16
    Retired from GM engineering labs.
    Canton, Michigan 48187
    Country Flag:
    Hello Mike

    What is the weight range for continusous rope clocks?

    This is one of those projects.

    After learning to adjust / live with this old strike train I decided to start the movement. To continue with the strugles the time side will not run.


    Gordon Webb
     
  19. gordon

    gordon Registered User
    NAWCC Member

    Mar 7, 2007
    223
    0
    16
    Retired from GM engineering labs.
    Canton, Michigan 48187
    Country Flag:
    Photo of countwheel with tention washer.
     

    Attached Files:

  20. Dave B

    Dave B Banned

    Jun 7, 2008
    2,389
    1
    0
    Civil Engineer; woodwind musician; clock repairman
    Westminster. MD
    Country Flag:
    After reading this thread several times, there are a couple of niggling points that come to mind for me. First, and perhaps most important, is the suggestions made by people who implied that someone earlier had been inside the clock and done something wrong. I always assume that whoever got into a clock or watch ahead of me, whether they used "right" or "wrong" methods or approaches to repair, GOT THE THING TO WORK! That immediately brings me to the second question: Do I want to restore the clock to original, or to some point in it's life? That question begs the third: Is it possible to go back to the original, or did some repair along the way effect a permanent change? The next question to be asked is: What is the simplest explanation of how things got to be as they are today? (Apply Occam's Razor - The simplest answer that takes into account all factors is probably the correct one.)

    That is a series of questions I ask myself with every movement that comes into the shop. First, figure out how the movement was originally intended to run. Second, assume any repairs made along the way actually worked, though possibly not as the original manufacturer intended. Third, figure out what I need (or am willing, for whatever reason - be it value, time, age, difficulty, etc.) to do to bring the clock back fom the dead.

    In your particular case, I believe you have a compound problem. First, there was a runaway strike. Someone solved that by opening the slots in the countwheel on the leading edges. That is why some slots in the countwheel are wider and deeper than others.Today, the strike is no longer working properly. What has changed between the day the repair person opened up some of the slots and today? I believe if you find that, your problem is half solved. I suspect it has to do with worn pins or levers, and I would be examining them closely, by pushing the strike train through it's paces with my fingernail on the second wheel, while closely observing all locking and unlocking through a loupe. Do not forget to look at the hammer lifting pins, too. They may have gotten worn, requiring that someone advance a wheel one tooth to cause striking of the last note in twelve before the train locked.
     
  21. gordon

    gordon Registered User
    NAWCC Member

    Mar 7, 2007
    223
    0
    16
    Retired from GM engineering labs.
    Canton, Michigan 48187
    Country Flag:
    Hello Dave

    After reading this thread several times, there are a couple of naggling points that come to mind for me. First, and perhaps most important, is the suggestions made by people who implied that someone earlier had been inside the clock and done something wrong. I always assume that whoever got into a clock or watch ahead of me, whether they used "right" or "wrong" methods or approaches to repair, GOT THE THING TO WORK!
    I assume they also did in this case. That immediately brings me to the second question: Do I want to restore the clock to original, or to some point in it's life? I want to go back to the origional condition. That question begs the third: Is it possible to go back to the original yes for the most part., or did some repair along the way effect a permanent change? Yes previous repair left 2 or 3 of the CW slots deeper. I soldered in spacers in the deep slots to bring their depth in line with the other slots. The next question to be asked is: What is the simplest explanation of how things got to be as they are today? Previous repair left 2 or 3 of the CW slots deeper. So deep in fact the count lever was unable to move to the higher counting section of the CW.(Apply Occam's Razor - The simplest answer that takes into account all factors is probably the correct one.)

    That is a series of questions I ask myself with every movement that comes into the shop. First, figure out how the movement was originally intended to run. This old movement's Strike train runs diffrent then any I have seen. A few people here have helped make things clearer. Second, assume any repairs made along the way actually worked, though possibly not as the original manufacturer intended. The deeper slots may have worked because the previous repaire turned this continuous rope clock in to a 2 weight rope clock. The strike side and time side may have had more weight then origionaly. Third, figure out what I need (or am willing, for whatever reason - be it value, time, age, difficulty, etc.) to do to bring the clock back from the dead. Its got to be close to coming to life. I just found 2 minor problems with the time side. First, the crutch's foot was loose. Second, I had the rope wraped the wrong way on the time's mainwheel. The time side did not want to run backward. The Strike is doing well as I belive the manufactuer intended.

    In your particular case, I believe you have a compound problem. First, there was a runaway strike.Someone solved that by opening the slots in the countwheel on the leading edges. That may be why some slots were deeper. But, no one widened the CW slots.Thatis why some slots in the countwheel are wider and deeper than others. Deeper yes (none were wider). Today, the strike is no longer working properly. I think it is now. What has changed between the day the repair person opened up some of the slots and today? The deeper slots may have worked because the previous repaire turned this continuous rope clock in to a 2 weight rope clock. The strike side and time side may have had more weight then origionaly. I believe if you find that, your problem is half solved. I suspect it has to do with worn pins or levers, and I would be examining them closely, by pushing the strike train through it's paces with my fingernail on the second wheel, while closely observing all locking and unlocking through a loupe I think you may be correct the previous changes were made to correct for one of the problems you suggest. It was late last night when the movement whent on the test stand. If the strike failes I will be checking all that you said. Do not forget to look at the hammer lifting pins, too. They may have gotten worn, requiring that someone advance a wheel one tooth to cause striking of the last note in twelve before the train locked.

    Thank you for your help. This old movement has been a lesson in the good old days.

    Gordon
     
  22. Mike Phelan

    Mike Phelan Registered User

    Dec 17, 2003
    9,835
    12
    38
    Retired
    West Yorkshire, England
    Country Flag:
    Region Flag:
    Gordon
    There might be exceptions, but none of these clocks ever had two weights.
    I've just weighed mine, and it's 13lb and lead.
    I suspect that there might be a few things that might cause the clock to stop as these are common.
    The clock must be fixed to the wall - makes more difference than you realise!
    Pallets get very worn and might need re-facing - I use an old bit of mainspring or suspension. Meybe it's running OK with excessive weight now.

    Now, back to the striking and Dave's comments. I am not 100% certain that it did all work after being repaired; we really don't know about the standard of repairs in the past (or even now!). 30-hour LC clocks were not worth a fortune years ago.
    Relative tries to repair it, as folk did in Victorian times, sort of made it work, but "I've fixed it but can't make the striking work".

    Did you try making the warning run nearly a turn?

    My thoughts are that the strike train timing is the remaining problem, and previous repairers have missed the point by deepening the CW notches (which should make no difference) and/or bending the CW detent.

    I think the set-up with the train locked should be:
    CW detent on end of slot ready to lift.
    Warning pin only just past detent to give maximum run.
    Hammer just dropped - tail nearly touching pin.

    When the strike is running, CW detent riding on edge of CW, and stop detent just missing pin.

    When the hour occurs, the CW detent will not drop into the notch completely, and by the time the stop pin comes around again, it will be riding on the edge of the CW.

    Thoughts, folks?
     
  23. laprade

    laprade Banned

    Sep 10, 2008
    3,240
    2
    0
    writer, radio producer, old building-materials adv
    Irish, but live in Laprade, 16390, France, (70 mil
    Country Flag:
    I suppose whoever put the second weight on, wanted to extend the time the clock ran for.

    normally it would have 1 heavy weight and a small led "doughnut" which was there to keep the loose loop out of the way and hanging down.

    If the clock has two weights, then there is a possibility that they are too heavy for each side and could cause severe strain on the trains.

    The single weight divided between the two trains, efectively halves its real weight.

    This might have something to do with the jamming of the lever.
     
  24. gordon

    gordon Registered User
    NAWCC Member

    Mar 7, 2007
    223
    0
    16
    Retired from GM engineering labs.
    Canton, Michigan 48187
    Country Flag:
    Hello Mike

    The time and strike are running with a 5 lb 12 oz weight. I had to correct 2 minor problems with the time side. First, the crutch's foot was loose. Second, I had the rope wraped the wrong way on the time's mainwheel. Time did not want to run backward.

    The count lever needed some adjustment to land in the slots in the CW. Considering the irregular placement of the slots it took a few times around the count wheel to get the count lever to fit nicely in each slot.


    There might be exceptions, but none of these clocks ever had two weights.
    I've just weighed mine, and it's 13lb and lead.
    I suspect that there might be a few things that might cause the clock to stop as these are common.
    The clock must be fixed to the wall - makes more difference than you realise!
    Pallets get very worn and might need re-facing - I use an old bit of mainspring or suspension. Meybe it's running OK with excessive weight now.

    Now, back to the striking and Dave's comments. I am not 100% certain that it did all work after being repaired; we really don't know about the standard of repairs in the past (or even now!). 30-hour LC clocks were not worth a fortune years ago.
    Relative tries to repair it, as folk did in Victorian times, sort of made it work, but "I've fixed it but can't make the striking work".

    Did you try making the warning run nearly a turn? Yes.

    My thoughts are that the strike train timing is the remaining problem, and previous repairers have missed the point by deepening the CW notches (which should make no difference) and/or bending the CW detent. It also looked that way to me.

    I think the set-up with the train locked should be:
    CW detent on end of slot ready to lift.
    Warning pin only just past detent to give maximum run.
    Hammer just dropped - tail nearly touching pin. That is the way it is set up now.

    When the strike is running, CW detent riding on edge of CW, and stop detent just missing pin. That is the way it is set up now.

    When the hour occurs, the CW detent will not drop into the notch completely, and by the time the stop pin comes around again, it will be riding on the edge of the CW. YES.

    Thoughts, folks?

    Thank you again for all the help. The clock ran fine over night on a test stand.

    Gordon
     
  25. gordon

    gordon Registered User
    NAWCC Member

    Mar 7, 2007
    223
    0
    16
    Retired from GM engineering labs.
    Canton, Michigan 48187
    Country Flag:
    Hello laprade

    I suppose whoever put the second weight on, wanted to extend the time the clock ran for. I think their objective was to eliminate the continuous rope by create a 2 weight system that is more common to modern man.

    normally it would have 1 heavy weight and a small led "doughnut" which was there to keep the loose loop out of the way and hanging down. The doughnut was attached to one of the ropes.

    If the clock has two weights, then there is a possibility that they are too heavy for each side and could cause severe strain on the trains. Thats what I thought too.

    The single weight divided between the two trains, efectively halves its real weight. Agreed.

    This might have something to do with the jamming of the lever. Mostly it was a sloppy CW and count lever.


    Gordon
     
  26. Mike Phelan

    Mike Phelan Registered User

    Dec 17, 2003
    9,835
    12
    38
    Retired
    West Yorkshire, England
    Country Flag:
    Region Flag:
    Tentatively, with all fifty fingers and tail crossed and breath bated to the nth degree, I think we might have a result! ;)
     
  27. laprade

    laprade Banned

    Sep 10, 2008
    3,240
    2
    0
    writer, radio producer, old building-materials adv
    Irish, but live in Laprade, 16390, France, (70 mil
    Country Flag:
    Gordon,

    I am curious to know if having two seperate weights, does actually give the clock more going time?

    In fact, now that I think of it, my electric crane, when the wire is doubled back for double weight, it goes slower.

    Any way, the real question is; does the double weight method effect the time counted.

    I just realized I can't spell lead.

    laprade
     
  28. Dave B

    Dave B Banned

    Jun 7, 2008
    2,389
    1
    0
    Civil Engineer; woodwind musician; clock repairman
    Westminster. MD
    Country Flag:
    Seems to me the running time would be dictated by how much rope you could wind onto the barrel, regardless of how many weights there were.. But what do I know? I'm still learning.
     
  29. Mike Phelan

    Mike Phelan Registered User

    Dec 17, 2003
    9,835
    12
    38
    Retired
    West Yorkshire, England
    Country Flag:
    Region Flag:
    They don't have barrels, Dave - just a spiked sprocket on each great wheel, but the length of rope needs to be short enough so the weight does not reach the floor.

    Laprade
    The running time for a separate weight on the going train will be half of that with a single weight, but only so if the striking was disabled in some way.

    No-one has mentioned yet that on a rope or chain LC, the pulley on the going train is firmly attached to the great wheel arbor; only the strike great wheel has a ratchet**. This enables it to have a sort of maintaining power.
    If you changed it to separate weights, the great wheel on the going train would have to be vandalised to give a ratchet.

    **The 'ratchet' is rather crude, and uses the four arms of the great wheel; the 'click' is a steel ring with a step in it, rivetted to the sprocket.

    I was wondering how they they used LED's then! Not to mention doughnuts. Mmmm ... [fx Homer Simpson voice]
     

Share This Page