Elgin Grade 341 17j 16 size HC

Robert J. Moore

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Aug 28, 2013
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Was the Elgin Grade 341, 17j., size 16s, HC the only HC model in this size (also marked BWR) that was lever set? I see many three finger bridge, HC size, 16s examples that are pendant set.
Totally unrelated, In Gilberts watch price guide there is a vague reference to a Elgin size 18s, 23j., 3/4 plate, HC movement. 3 stars that indicates upwards to 350 may have been produced. No grade is listed. Is this an up jeweled Grade 274 or just a ghost that nobody has a info on?
Thanks.
 

John Cote

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Totally unrelated, In Gilberts watch price guide there is a vague reference to a Elgin size 18s, 23j., 3/4 plate, HC movement. 3 stars that indicates upwards to 350 may have been produced. No grade is listed. Is this an up jeweled Grade 274 or just a ghost that nobody has a info on?
Regarding the Gilbert/Engle/Shugart book in general, there are a lot of examples of "ghost" watches. One of the classics is the Illinois, 18s, 25j, Bunn Special. There are others including the Elgin you reference. I have never said that these ghost watches don't exist because I suppose that someday one might be found to disprove it. That said, I have never seen the elusive 25j Bunn Special nor the 23j 3/4 plate 18s Elgin or any of the other "ghost" watches. I will admit to being slightly less sure about not seeing the Elgin but I am pretty sure.

I have heard these ghosts were purposely put and left in the book so that the authors or the publisher could tell if someone directly copied all of their data. Who knows. I asked Cooksey about it when he was alive and I don't remember getting a great answer.

Also, don't pay much attention to the "star ratings" in the Gilbert/Engle/Shugart book. At least don't pay much attention in so far as they indicate some real number of watches produced. I think they are more a qualitative rather than a quantitative indication of rarity.
 
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musicguy

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I just found running number 1192 of 1500 made in grade($60.00). This is a really
beautiful 16 size Hunting Cased Elgin B W Raymond Grade 341 17 jewel three finger bridge LS
circa 1906-07. "The Book" gives it 2 stars but by their own
definition it should only be one star, I'm not complaining.

BW BRAYMOND 3FB .jpg

20210619_154650.jpg

20210619_154822.jpg




Rob
 
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