Does it Matter

[william knapp]

I am putting together a seconds beating, tall case, regulator, In it's original case I suspect the weight hung straight down from the movement. I propose changing it so that the weight will be suspended from the :"roof" of the case, what if any will be the ramifications of this change?

 

[Tinker Dwight]

Hi
I'm assuming that it will have a path straight to the pulley
and then straight down such that the cables ( or chains )
are parallel.
If so, it should work.
I'm not quite sure why you want to do this?
Tinker Dwight

 

[wow]

I am curious, also. Why?

Will

 

[The Tick Doc]

Dito,, why. Whats up with what you want to do.

 

[william knapp]

The reason for the change is to accommodate a shorter case,
I was simply wondering if the wear pattern from a straight drop over the two centuries as opposed to the new wear pattern would creat any unusual issues/inconsistencies..This is a quality movement with jeweled pallets, arbors, end stops, six crossing wheels and high count pinions. I hope that I will get to a time when 2/3 seconds variance a month will be routine.

Thanks for your input.

 

[harold bain]

Well, if you look at a simple weight clock like an OG, there's no reason you couldn't copy this type of setup, routing the cable through a pulley at the top of the case. Is there a pulley on the weight, compounding it, now? Or does the weight connect directly to the cable?

 

[eskmill]

Good plan Bill.

The very best seconds beating precision regulators have the driving weight suspended either to the left or right of the pendulum path. Some with the weight enclosed in a chute. Others have the weights split; one left and one to the right, most often double hung.

I think the only issue in the conversion is to assure that there's no upward thrust on the movement on account of the direction of pull from the weight(s).

There is a basis for having the driving weight out of the path of the pendulum. Many theorists assert that the mass of the weight would have a gravitational force on the bob when the weight would be in the path of the pendulum bob.

Gravity, the weakest natural force, is just one additional possible cause of a less-than-perfect rate. Re-routing the driving weight path away from the bob eliminates that possibility.

On the other hand, some excellent regulators had ornate weight pulleys....shame to hide them from view.

 

[bangster]

Unless I'm mistaken, if you introduce a pulley into a system that doesn't have one, you're going to have to alter the weight.

 

[william knapp]

The pulley will be seen,
The original configuration would have had a pulley, I confused the picture by describing the original configuration as a straight drop.
I know it will work, I was interested in comments about the effect of two centuries of wear being disturbed by the new direction of the weight acting on the great wheel.
Thanks again for your collective response

 

[Scottie-TX]

Think about it BONG: An ogee with single pulleys at the top - it's still a SINGLE line. Even if it was routed thru six pulleys, if it's a SINGLE line there is no change. It's only when you add lines - called drops - that compounding occurs as in a simple single compound with TWO lines and one pulley BETWEEN them.
Naw; I don't see any implications or problems arising from pulling upward on the great wheel instead of downward. I like your idea for increasing length of descent. I can only see the great wheel wearing the top of the bushing instead of the bottom.

 

[william knapp]

Thanks again to all

 

[bangster]

Think about it BONG: An ogee with single pulleys at the top - it's still a SINGLE line. Even if it was routed thru six pulleys, if it's a SINGLE line there is no change. It's only when you add lines - called drops - that compounding occurs as in a simple single compound with TWO lines and one pulley BETWEEN them. ...
.

T'aint exactly true. Tie a rope to a weight and run it through a pulley on the ceiling. It's easier to lift the weight by pulling on the rope than by doing a straight lift. That's why they make pulleys and multiple pulley devices like blocks & tackles and chain hoists and whatnot. Cain't fool me on that. The more pulleys the easier, starting with One. Betcha if you got rid of the pulley on your ogee and turned it into a straight drop, you'd need more weight.

 

[Tinker Dwight]

Hi
Sorry, no mechanical advantage by drapping a line
over a pully. The line moves the same distance at the
clock as it does at the weight.
If the pulley was on the weight and looped up, that
has advantage. For every inch the cable move up,
the weight only move 1/2 inch.
You have to figure the relative ratios of travel.
Tinker Dwight

 

[bangster]

Bah, humbug.



You're right, of course. The reason it's easier to lift a weight with a single pulley is that the weight of your body is helping your muscles, not because there's a mechanical advantage. Heck Everbody knows that.

 

[Scottie-TX]

This is my favorite source whenever this subject arises:
PULLEYS

 

[R&A]

If your weight travel is the issue. Are you not just losing the height of the face in length. And is the weight going to travel like an OG per say. Down the side of the case and wound to the height of the case. Like some one else said. It has allot to do with your ratio. And will you have a full 8 days of travel? Or will it be just a 30 hour? Interesting concept thou. You could even put two pulleys at the top and have the weights run down the back of the inside of the clock. On either side of the chime block. Now the center weight. I guess a 3 sided wood box around the chime block and have the weight drop threw the box. Now routing it. Hum I would have to think on this one...

H/C

 

[Tinker Dwight]

Hi
Cut a hole in the wall. Put a 1 ton weight in the garage.
set the clock up to run from a continuous loop rather than
spooling it as a single layer. Put the needed pulleys in the garage
so that the drop of the weight matches the pull needed to run
the clock.
Then wind it once a year on new years eve. For an 8 day
clock, 64:1 is a good ratio to target. ( 15Lb * 64 = 960Lb
so maybe on a half ton would be enough )
Lift the weight back up with a ratchet and hydraulic bottle
jack.
Tinker Dwight