dating by engraving font style

Discussion in 'European & Other Pocket Watches' started by novicetimekeeper, Apr 2, 2017.

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  1. novicetimekeeper

    novicetimekeeper Registered User
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    Jul 26, 2015
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    I am turning to the good people of the european pocket watch collectors for some help with fonts.

    I have a painted dial English dial clock which has thrown up some questions and you might have some answers.

    The dial has been repainted but is original to the clock, the case which was said to be a replacement appears in fact to be original to the clock.

    The clock is thought to be about 1810.

    However the script of the location (Bloomsbury) looks later, perhaps 1840s.

    It reminds me of the way Liverpool is engraved on a lot of pocket watches, with the curlicue shapes but particularly the gothic style lettering.

    So the question is, what is the earliest date for this style? What style is appropriate for 1810?

    [​IMG]
     
  2. novicetimekeeper

    novicetimekeeper Registered User
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    Mm, I thought you lot would rise to the challenge given the knowledge you all have about Liverpool signatures.

    I have, meanwhile, found a Barwise dial clock said to be 1810 using the same font for London.

    It's the gothic o with the little tails that is so recognisable and you see it so much on Liverpool watches, but I don't know how early.

    (I think Barwise signed Barwise and Son at some point not that long after 1810 I know a few of you have his watches and might confirm that)
     
  3. Omexa

    Omexa Registered User

    Feb 28, 2010
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    Hi Nick, not just in Liverpool did they have fancy flourishes; London did it as well. The London one is c1820's. Regards Ray View attachment 338919
     
  4. novicetimekeeper

    novicetimekeeper Registered User
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    Thanks for that Ray, we just need to go back a bit further.

    The Barwise I found is for sale so I can't share but it is very similar to your London.

    Once we identify we have the correct style I need to make a difficult decision on town. I can't prove the Bloomsbury ward was there in 1810, or indeed into the 1800s. I feel a previous restorer may have made an assumption on which maker it is. I might drop the Bloomsbury and go for London, but I would like to see some earlier watches with the same style. I'm pretty confident they are out there.

    The good thing about watches in their own cases is we have a style that hasn't been added later and a known date.
     
  5. Omexa

    Omexa Registered User

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    Hi Nick, this is earlier and a lot more fancy flourishes. I have never seen an "L" like this one before. Regards Ray View attachment 338971
     
  6. novicetimekeeper

    novicetimekeeper Registered User
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    That definitely shows that the gothic letters were in for the date required. Thanks.
     
  7. John Matthews

    John Matthews Registered User

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    Nick - if you look on David Penney's site you will find examples to match the style you are looking for, with dates going back to at least the end of the C18th.

    John
     
  8. novicetimekeeper

    novicetimekeeper Registered User
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    That's a good idea, thanks.
     
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