Cuckoo Clock

Discussion in 'Clock Repair' started by Clockrepairforfun, Feb 28, 2017.

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  1. Clockrepairforfun

    Clockrepairforfun Registered User

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    Who does this? Takes a perfectly working clock apart to see how it works and whether or not I can put it back together? Me. You?

    This is quite different than the mantle clocks I've been working with, though the mantel clocks at one time looked just as complicated (now not so much). I'm going to need your help on this one guys.

    The first question I have is how to take off the wheel that is attached to the top plate? 2nd question. I took the chains off before taking apart the movement. I don't know how they look underneath. Does anyone have a picture they could share?


    Thanks Guys.

    IMG_3165.JPG IMG_3166.JPG
     
  2. bangster

    bangster Moderator
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    Are you talking about the trip wheel that works the bellows and hammer? If it doesn't have a setscrew, it should just pry off.
     
  3. David S

    David S Registered User
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    On the other side of the plate for the picture on the right is there a sort of star wheel with pins that actuate the levers? There is a brass collar on that wheel with a set screw to loosen it.

    David
     
  4. Tinker Dwight

    Tinker Dwight Registered User

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    The pin wheel on older movements has a set screw but some are pressed
    on. If pressed on, it has to be taken off with a puller.
    I do hope you spent some time looking at the strike side before taking it apart,
    As for the chains, at the factory, a person holds the entire clock upside down
    they feed the chain ( with the end ring removed ) into the chain wheel.
    they tilt the clock a little to catch on a sprocket.
    They then use a long thin rod or screw driver to push the sprocket one ratchet click.
    The rotate the clock a little more to ensure that the chain stays on the sprocket.
    They then continue to push a click and rotate until the chain comes out the other
    hole.
    When you have enough chain, tie it together with a piece of wire so the chain doesn't
    come off the sprocket while fiddling with the other chain ( bead bags we get have the
    perfect tie wire for this ).
    It isn't that hard I've done it a number of times.
    Tinker Dwight
     
  5. Clockrepairforfun

    Clockrepairforfun Registered User

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    Yes.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Yep. Set screw. I'm sorry guys but what does that mean? I see a place where I can press it down, like a pin. Is that it?

    - - - Updated - - -

    Ok. So they put the movement together prior to putting the chains on. ok. What is the end ring?
     
  6. Tinker Dwight

    Tinker Dwight Registered User

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    You loosen the set screw and pull it off.
    I don't think you are making sense about pressing something down.
    Can you post a picture?
    Tinker Dwight
     
  7. David S

    David S Registered User
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    This may not be the same as yours, but look around the brass collar to see if there is a radial screw that you loosen. Mine has a large headed screw seen in this picture.
    three hammer mounts close.jpg

    David
     
  8. Clockrepairforfun

    Clockrepairforfun Registered User

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    #8 Clockrepairforfun, Feb 28, 2017
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 22, 2018
    I'll upload a picture.

    cs

    - - - Updated - - -

    Ah I see - that's a set screw. I didn't see anything. I'm going to upload a picture.

    - - - Updated - - -

    wheel.JPG

    This is a bad picture. You can see the wheel, though if you look carefully. It has a brass holder and what looks like a pin in the center. I didn't see a set screw.
     
  9. Tinker Dwight

    Tinker Dwight Registered User

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    The chain has two ends. one has a hook for the weight.
    The other end will have some type of ring or end piece to keep the
    chain from dropping the weight if you forget to wind the clock.

    If no set screw it has to be pilled off.
    One of the others has success with two paint can top removers to lever
    such things off without a puller.
    Tinker Dwight
     
  10. bangster

    bangster Moderator
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    #10 bangster, Feb 28, 2017
    Last edited: Feb 28, 2017
    See post #2 above. The "pin in the center" is the end of the arbor it's mounted on. If there is no setscrew in the side of the brass collar, the trip wheel (or star wheel) is press-fit onto the arbor, as Tink said earlier. Stick a pair of flat-blade screwdrivers in behind either side of the wheel, and twist them to pry it off.

    Or use some other method.
     
  11. Clockrepairforfun

    Clockrepairforfun Registered User

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    Thank you Tinker. I just didn't want to break it. I have a puller I purchased that I didn't know exactly what it was used for. I thought it was clock hands. It may work well on this.
     
  12. roughbarked

    roughbarked Registered User

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    There are few reasons to remove this unless the hole needs bushing. If you are using an ultrasonic to clean the clock and there is no set screw, you can make the descision not to remove it. It isn't otherwise necessary to battle with your wits to take it off. All that being said, you may acquire a puller to remove it if you so desire.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Telling people to use some other method, isn't necssarily best practice in this instance. Much can go wrong with attempting to remove this by other methods.

    The instances of requiring to pull this off to bush the hole underneath are so rare that it is usually deemed unnecessary.
     
  13. Clockrepairforfun

    Clockrepairforfun Registered User

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    Thank you. I'd prefer not taking it off really. But to get it in without knocking all the wheels around seems like a job in and of itself. Which one is worst? Any best practices?
     
  14. roughbarked

    roughbarked Registered User

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    #14 roughbarked, Feb 28, 2017
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 31, 2017
    The best practices are;
    •leave well alone unless absolutely necessary. This wheel is tight on the shaft for a very important reason. Removing it may be tricky but there is also the additional trickiness of getting back on in exactly the right spot.
    •if wanting to take it off, a puller is the only safe way and it does need to be a robust puller.
     
  15. Clockrepairforfun

    Clockrepairforfun Registered User

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    #15 Clockrepairforfun, Feb 28, 2017
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 31, 2017
    Thank you. Do you have any tricks on getting all the wheels lines up with it on?
     
  16. roughbarked

    roughbarked Registered User

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    It only needs to be lined up with all three lifters. Which is where it is lined up now. Examine the positions before you take it off.

    You'll probably have noticed that all three lifter shafts can simply fall out of the clock. It is a good idea to note each one and remember it's positioning before that happens. Small headaches but best to learn to avoid them.

    I would advise all newbies to clock disassembly to keep taking photos of every step.
     
  17. THTanner

    THTanner Registered User
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    The "book" on removing the pressed on brass ring when there is no set screw is to heat it slightly with a torch to make it easier to remove. Then it is recommended that you drill and tap it for a set screw to put it back on. The heating is not always necessary and should be done only after all the oil is removed and after trying to slip it off without heating it.
     
  18. roughbarked

    roughbarked Registered User

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    and the above is best left until absolutely necessary.

    I've rarely had to bush this hole. It does happen but it isn't common in well serviced or younger clocks. Older clocks were always fitted with a set screw here.
     
  19. THTanner

    THTanner Registered User
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    Yes - don't remove it unless there is a good reason - and the heat is the last resort.

     
  20. Clockrepairforfun

    Clockrepairforfun Registered User

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    #20 Clockrepairforfun, Feb 28, 2017
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 31, 2017
    By the way. I saw your movement on another post. Nice work! I haven't seen anything like it so far.
     
  21. roughbarked

    roughbarked Registered User

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    Is that the old cylinder escapement carriage clock? Again this shows, fix the necessary first. Leave the rest until later.
     
  22. Clockrepairforfun

    Clockrepairforfun Registered User

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    yep. Cool clock! and point taken.
     
  23. David S

    David S Registered User
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    CS is this a special clock? Or one you got to practice on? The reason I ask, is if it is a practice clock there will be times when you may have to remove a wheel that has been pressed on. It never hurts to figure out how you would do it when required.

    Pullers are by far my go to choice and for clock work most are ones I have made.

    David
     
  24. roughbarked

    roughbarked Registered User

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    Yes. By all means learn how to do it if you are practising.
     
  25. Clockrepairforfun

    Clockrepairforfun Registered User

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    Ok. I get that. Yeah it was for practice. I'll tell you what. I'll give it a whirl but if it does sideways you guys have to give me a hand. :) Here's the puller I have. It will be nice to get to use it. $T2eC16d,!)8E9s4l8hl4BR58U1EZSw~~60_12.JPG
     
  26. David S

    David S Registered User
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    I don't think that will get around the outside diameter and work... but for sure try to see if it fits.

    David
     
  27. Clockrepairforfun

    Clockrepairforfun Registered User

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    Yeah the one I actually have is a little wider. We'll see... I'll catch up with you this eve.

    But this thread is really complete. Questions answered! Thanks again guys.
     
  28. Tinker Dwight

    Tinker Dwight Registered User

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    You may have to make a puller. That one will just bend the star wheel
    if you get it under it somehow.
    Tinker Dwight
     
  29. Chris D

    Chris D Registered User

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    I've tried all of the methods to get the pressed on star wheel off. Sometimes just twisting and pulling works, sometimes heating and pulling with pliers works. I've even copied this idea (pictured) and tried to punch out the arbor (and broke all of my punches). They're all 50/50. Most of the time, to save time, I end up breaking off the arbor (on purpose) and replacing with new or salvaged parts from old movements. Just not worth the time when they are so easily replaced.

    If it was my clock and the hole didn't need a bushing and I didn't have spares on hand... I'd leave it on and don't even mess with it. It does make reassembly tricky though. You'll need to put the movement together and either try and turn the star wheel on the arbor without bending the arbor or keep splitting the plates and adjusting the wheel until it's in the right position (pin on the star wheel should be a hair from touching the hammer when stopped)





    attachment.jpg attachment.jpg
     

    Attached Files:

  30. roughbarked

    roughbarked Registered User

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    I believe the puller he displayed is for getting hands off clocks perhaps. Not a good choice for this job.

    - - - Updated - - -

    and yes, the shaped steel block is probably the best anvil. Place an anvil under it and knock the shaft out with a punch, is the method I use rather than attempting to pull things off. The shafts are too soft and the necessary leverage, immense.
     
  31. BLKBEARD

    BLKBEARD Registered User

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    To remove using the slotted square tube stock as shown in the photo. I would press it out using an Arbor Press. Lacking an Arbor Press I would use my 5" Bench Vise as a Press. I would probably use a 3/8" drive Allen Socket as a driver. A little heat may be required if it's truly stubborn. I think pressing will yield better results than trying to drive it out with a drift punch.
     
  32. shutterbug

    shutterbug Moderator
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    When you put it back on, put a set screw in the side, and make it a looser fit :)
     
  33. Clockrepairforfun

    Clockrepairforfun Registered User

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    Thank you. Your idea of just breaking it off and buying a new one made me laugh. Last night I tried ever so slightly to pry it off. I realized the only thing that would happen had I continued was I'd break the wheel or worst bend the plate. I decided not to take it off and try to assemble with it in.

    In doing so I found that working from the top down, putting in the pivots in the plates, is a much easier task. And goes against the conventional wisdom of working from the bottom up. I still had a couple pivots to go before bed time came. I'll rework it tonight. This is good experience... But I'm no closer to understanding yet how this movement really operates. So many bells and whistles - no pun intended.
     

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